India - Pakistan Standoff 2019

[Bharath]

So PAF F-16 if they took part in 27th February face off with IAF were carrying 120 km range AIM-120C AMRAAM.
IAF MIG-21 flown by Abhinandan was armed with 30 km range R-73.
So the F-16 could shoot down Indian Mig-21 from 120 km away. But for the mig-21 to shoot down F-16 it had to be within 30 km.
Yet the Pakistani F-16 pilot was so stupid that instead of using his weapon from a safe distance, he felt the need to come with the enemy missile range and get shot down
Doesn't make any sense.

no one wanted to shoot any missile to another aircraft - they only wanted to bomb the groud target - you cannot attack an aircraft in another's territory - thats an act of war.
the IAF fighters that came into the Indian territory were attacked with WVR
the F-16 that was within the Indian Airspace scooted to Pakistani airspace but got shot
another f-16 shot down the MiG

see, we can create whatever narratives we want. the fact remains, OFFICIAL news of Indian side, there were NO FLIPFLOPS. but ISPR had multiple!

 

[Guynextdoor]

So PAF F-16 if they took part in 27th February face off with IAF were carrying 120 km range AIM-120C AMRAAM.
IAF MIG-21 flown by Abhinandan was armed with 30 km range R-73.
So the F-16 could shoot down Indian Mig-21 from 120 km away. But for the mig-21 to shoot down F-16 it had to be within 30 km.
Yet the Pakistani F-16 pilot was so stupid that instead of using his weapon from a safe distance, he felt the need to come with the enemy missile range and get shot down
Doesn't make any sense.

The sukhoi jamming pods saved both themselves and other Indian aircraft until the wing Commander decided to move out of the protection as he chased the f 16 for the lock. @vstol Jockey, doesn't bring up another point? We have been talking so much about the bison shooting that we haven't spent anytime analysing the lovely contribution the sukhois made. So many times the f16s tried to get a firm lock on many of the jets including the sukhois and kept failing due to excellent maneuvering and electronic warfare
Even if 1 sukhoi had gone down it would have been major PR disaster for us. They really prove their moneys worth.

 

[Notsuperstitious]

So PAF F-16 if they took part in 27th February face off with IAF were carrying 120 km range AIM-120C AMRAAM.
IAF MIG-21 flown by Abhinandan was armed with 30 km range R-73.
So the F-16 could shoot down Indian Mig-21 from 120 km away. But for the mig-21 to shoot down F-16 it had to be within 30 km.
Yet the Pakistani F-16 pilot was so stupid that instead of using his weapon from a safe distance, he felt the need to come with the enemy missile range and get shot down
Doesn't make any sense.

When needed u achieve the most impressive feats of mental gymnastics. Einstein would wonder at the complexity of the stretched logic you come up with.

And when needed an air war with multiple assets of various roles is a question of 120>30 for you.

You truly are a Pakistani. Begin with a conclusion provided by ISPR and then stick whatever sticks to it.

 

[vstol Jockey]

R-73 seeker near the wreckage.

View attachment 4814

This must be from the missile which was still on the missile rails of the aircraft when it crashed.

 

[vstol Jockey]

The sukhoi jamming pods saved both themselves and other Indian aircraft until the wing Commander decided to move out of the protection as he chased the f 16 for the lock. @vstol Jockey, doesn't bring up another point? We have been talking so much about the bison shooting that we haven't spent anytime analysing the lovely contribution the sukhois made. So many times the f16s tried to get a firm lock on many of the jets including the sukhois and kept failing due to excellent maneuvering and electronic warfare
Even if 1 sukhoi had gone down it would have been major PR disaster for us. They really prove their moneys worth.

I am sure that IAF will now expedite super sukhoi upgrade and also order some more SU-30MKIs.

 

[Shajida Khan]

I am sure that IAF will now expedite super sukhoi upgrade and also order some more SU-30MKIs.

French platforms have performed remarkably well.. We should get more french platforms. Mirage 2Ks, Rafale. Put more Israeli avionics and sensors.

 

[Kane]

This must be from the missile which was still on the missile rails of the aircraft when it crashed.

@vstol Given that they have the deadly R73 seeker and the pilot's helmet with the sighting system, do you consider this as a cause of concern? Is it possible to extract any information from these which otherwise are considered highly sensitive and not available in public domain? if so, what do you think are the possible options the IAF has to counter it?

 

[nair]

picture of his body? his aircraft, the wreckage or the aircraft?

That was an Israeli F16 flown by an Israeli pilot....Shot down by PAF F16... Pilot died and buried in Pakistan..... Now enjoy the Pakistani logic.....

 

[vstol Jockey]

@vstol Given that they have the deadly R73 seeker and the pilot's helmet with the sighting system, do you consider this as a cause of concern? Is it possible to extract any information from these which otherwise are considered highly sensitive and not available in public domain? if so, what do you think are the possible options the IAF has to counter it?

Chinese have R-73s with them. So it is not a loss of hi tech to Pakistan.

 

[jetray]

old wine new bottle.
Pakistan claims to 'crack down' on Jamaat-ud-Dawa. Again. | FDD's Long War Journal

The Pakistani government says it is shuttering institutions that belong to Jamaat-ud-Dawa (JuD), a designated terrorist group that is an alias for Lashkar-e-Taiba. If the past is any guide, the efforts are merely eyewash to placate Western governments in the wake of major terror attacks emanating from Pakistani soil.

That’s because Pakistan has claimed it has shut down JuD offices and detained its top leaders in the past, only to allow the offices to reopen and the leaders free months later.

 

[Golden_Rule]

When you say "you make" means Mittals, Ambanis and Tatas. All of whom are business entities who make profit.

All those and more are part of IMC (Indian Military Complex). Business need to make profit and it is verified in their balance sheet and the IT annual returns. On the other hand, madarsaas do charity by training youngsters to blow themselves up. Their profit is the balance (left over) $h!t and the 72 hoories they get afterlife

 

[vstol Jockey]

One thing which emerges from the 27th air engagements is that PAF really wanted to down at least one Su-30MKI and tried desperately with multiple AMRRAM launches. AND when they failed to shoot down even one of them, they claimed their own downed F-16B to be a Su-30MKI. Aisay bhi bewkoof hain is duniya main.

 

[nair]

One thing which emerges from the 27th air engagements is that PAF really wanted to down at least one Su-30MKI and tried desperately with multiple AMRRAM launches. AND when they failed to shoot down even one of them, they claimed their own downed F-16B to be a Su-30MKI. Aisay bhi bewkoof hain is duniya main.

They were expecting a dog fight with Su 30... and wanted to shoot down it at any cost.....While doing this they lost one of their best birds

 

[NKVD]

They were expecting a dog fight with Su 30... and wanted to shoot down it at any cost.....While doing this they lost one of their best birds

Actually No Dog fight With MKI's is death Wish Even Euro-fighter
bested in WVR combat by MKI's .Multiple AMRAAM launches Without genuine lock only depicts it

 

[nair]

Actually No Dog fight With MKI's is death Wish Even Euro-fighter
bested in WVR combat by MKI's .Multiple AMRAAM launches Without genuine lock only depicts it

We kept su 30 away from all this

 

[STEPHEN COHEN]

@safriz.

Many years ago there was an English song

Walk like an Egyptian

It was quiet popular in colleges

Today if a song is made

Lie like a Pakistani ,

it would become the Greatest
chartbuster ever

 

[vstol Jockey]

We kept su 30 away from all this

We did not keep it away. The ROE forbade engaging targets beyond LOC. Su-30MKI and also M2K had multiple locks on PAF fighters but did not shoot them down as they were within their own airspace. But PAF F-16 pilots thought themselves to be God's own balls and paid the price. Su-30MKI were the first in combat and stayed till the end in the combat. I am sure Su-30 MKI guys must be itching for a revenge and once given a free hand, they will teach these F-16 guys what is called Dogfight.

 

[STEPHEN COHEN]

We did not keep it away. The ROE forbade engaging targets beyond LOC. Su-30MKI and also M2K had multiple locks on PAF fighters but did not shoot them down as they were within their own airspace. But PAF F-16 pilots thought themselves to be God's own balls and paid the price. Su-30MKI were the first in combat and stayed till the end in the combat. I am sure Su-30 MKI guys must be itching for a revenge and once given a free hand, they will teach these F-16 guys what is called Dogfight.

PAF failed in all the Four aspects
Of Air Combat

1 Air Strike : They could not drop their
Ordnance on the Right targets

2 . BVR : No Aim 120 touched a Su 30

3 WVR : F 16 downed by MiG 21

4 Air Defence : Indian Planes bombed Balakot

Aim 120 is a Dud

 

[vstol Jockey]

PAF failed in all the Four aspects
Of Air Combat

1 Air Strike : They could not drop their
Ordnance on the Right targets

2 . BVR : No Aim 120 touched a Su 30

3 WVR : F 16 downed by MiG 21

4 Air Defence : Indian Planes bombed Balakot

Aim 120 is a Dud

Maarnay kee iccha laykar ayeh thay, marwaa kar wapas gayeh. This reminds me of a joke. A man suddenly got an idea to kill a lion and got hold of a very old muzzle loader. He went to the Jungle searching for a Lion and soon he was face to face with one. He took aim and fired. There was deafening sound and lot of smoke. once the smoke cleared he found the lion standing in front of him and smiling. This guy started shitting bricks and begged the lion for forgiveness. Lion asked him to drop his pants and turn around and bend down. Lion screwed him and went off.
This guy was now seething with anger and got hold of a double barrel. Again he went to the jungle and same thing happened again. He again got screwed by the Lion. Finally he got hold of an AK-47 with fully loaded clip and went in again. This time he fired the entire magazine on the lion. Once again nothing happened to the lion. he knew what the lion will ask him to do. So he dropped his pants and turned around and bent down. Lion tapped him on his shpoulder and asked, " Tainoo shikaar karan da shouk hai ya marwaan da".

 

[STEPHEN COHEN]

Maarnay kee iccha laykar ayeh thay, marwaa kar wapas gayeh.

And also PAF gave away its Tactics on the first day itself , without any gains

They will make Swarm attacks in a diving mode

And then Lie in Ambush ,using Other planes
As Bait