Zorawar: Light tank for Indian army

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
What more protection can you get from 25tonn tank at least it's better than tin can sprut.
Its protection is less than BMP2.

The BMP2 based light tank would have better Survival chances. No ATGMs required, the 37mm AA chinkis have, will be enough to get this thing to ashes.
 

Chain Smoker

Well-Known member
Mar 2, 2020
1,047
904
india
Its protection is less than BMP2.

The BMP2 based light tank would have better Survival chances. No ATGMs required, the 37mm AA chinkis have, will be enough to get this thing to ashes.
I believe it's probably a typo even with modular composite armour one can easily reach stanag 5 level.
 

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
By the way Sprut can withstand 23mm canon fire. STANAG level 4 means Zorawar can only face 14.5 HMG fire.

The 23mm AP round will penetrate it from front and get out from its rear.
I believe it's probably a typo even with modular composite armour one can easily reach stanag 5 level.
Modular Armour is the answer. European IFVs have it. It protects them against 30mm canon fire.

But it has weight. And those European modern IFVs weight between 30-35 tons.

Not 25 tons.
 

Sathya

Senior member
Dec 2, 2017
3,129
2,017
India
By the way Sprut can withstand 23mm canon fire. STANAG level 4 means Zorawar can only face 14.5 HMG fire.

The 23mm AP round will penetrate it from front and get out from its rear.

Modular Armour is the answer. European IFVs have it. It protects them against 30mm canon fire.

But it has weight. And those European modern IFVs weight between 30-35 tons.

Not 25 tons.


Aren't we moving away from Rifled Gun?
Stanag level 2 weigjs 25 tons?
Read somewhere our new M5 Or tata Or mahindra vehicle is stanag level 2.

Isn't this a bit too low for a tracked tank platform?
 

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
NEW DELHI: India is set to kick-start a mega indigenous acquisition project for 354 light tanks, the critical operational necessity for which has come to the fore during the ongoing over 30-month long confrontation with China in eastern Ladakh.

Sources say the defence ministry has resolved the festering differences between the Army and DRDO over the light tanks meant for high-altitude warfare in Ladakh and Arunachal Pradesh as well as riverine areas like the Rann of Kutch and can be swiftly deployed after being transported by air.

The Rajnath Singh-led Defence Acquisitions Council will soon take up the grant of AoN (acceptance of necessity) for the armoured fighting vehicle-Indian light tank (AFV-ILT) under Project `Zorawar’, at a cost of around Rs 17,500 crore, the sources told TOI.

The proposal is that 59 of the 354 light tanks, each weighing less than 25 tonnes with a high power-to-weight ratio as well as superior firepower and protection, will be reserved for the tanks developed by DRDO. The remaining 295 tanks will be manufactured under the government-funded design and development project for the Indian industry in the `Make-1’ category of the Defence Acquisition Procedure (DAP).

“DRDO can also compete with private players for this,” a source said.


The Army had strongly pitched for all 354 tanks to be produced by the private sector under the Make-1 category. But the DRDO argued its Combat Vehicles Research and Development Establishment (CVRDE) was already working to develop a light tank prototype with private sector giant Larsen & Toubro as the “lead system integrator”.

“DRDO says its first light tank prototype will roll out by mid-2023. So, the decision is that 59 tanks be reserved for DRDO, with the condition that it delivers a successful prototype ahead of the others in the fray,” the source added. The 12-lakh strong Army had managed to deploy some of its heavier Russian-origin T-90S and T-72 main-battle tanks (40 to 50 tonne each) in eastern Ladakh after the confrontation erupted in 2020. The PLA also inducted a large number of technologically advanced mix of medium and light tanks, including the new third-generation Type-15 ones. “But the T-90S and T-72, designed for operations in plains and deserts, have limitations in high-altitude areas ranging from 11,000 to almost 17,000-feet. Consequently, the need for indigenous versatile light tanks that are more manoeuvrable and operationally flexible in mountains,” another source said. The ongoing Russia-Ukraine war has also impacted both the manufacturing and sustenance of the Army’s fleet of 1,200 T-90S (another 457 being manufactured under licence from Russia) and 2,400 older T-72 tanks. The Army wants the new light tanks to also incorporate niche technologies like AI, drone integration, active protection system and high degree of situational awareness, among others.
 

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
NEW DELHI: India is set to kick-start a mega indigenous acquisition project for 354 light tanks, the critical operational necessity for which has come to the fore during the ongoing over 30-month long confrontation with China in eastern Ladakh.

Sources say the defence ministry has resolved the festering differences between the Army and DRDO over the light tanks meant for high-altitude warfare in Ladakh and Arunachal Pradesh as well as riverine areas like the Rann of Kutch and can be swiftly deployed after being transported by air.

The Rajnath Singh-led Defence Acquisitions Council will soon take up the grant of AoN (acceptance of necessity) for the armoured fighting vehicle-Indian light tank (AFV-ILT) under Project `Zorawar’, at a cost of around Rs 17,500 crore, the sources told TOI.

The proposal is that 59 of the 354 light tanks, each weighing less than 25 tonnes with a high power-to-weight ratio as well as superior firepower and protection, will be reserved for the tanks developed by DRDO. The remaining 295 tanks will be manufactured under the government-funded design and development project for the Indian industry in the `Make-1’ category of the Defence Acquisition Procedure (DAP).

“DRDO can also compete with private players for this,” a source said.

The Army had strongly pitched for all 354 tanks to be produced by the private sector under the Make-1 category. But the DRDO argued its Combat Vehicles Research and Development Establishment (CVRDE) was already working to develop a light tank prototype with private sector giant Larsen & Toubro as the “lead system integrator”.


“DRDO says its first light tank prototype will roll out by mid-2023. So, the decision is that 59 tanks be reserved for DRDO, with the condition that it delivers a successful prototype ahead of the others in the fray,” the source added. The 12-lakh strong Army had managed to deploy some of its heavier Russian-origin T-90S and T-72 main-battle tanks (40 to 50 tonne each) in eastern Ladakh after the confrontation erupted in 2020. The PLA also inducted a large number of technologically advanced mix of medium and light tanks, including the new third-generation Type-15 ones. “But the T-90S and T-72, designed for operations in plains and deserts, have limitations in high-altitude areas ranging from 11,000 to almost 17,000-feet. Consequently, the need for indigenous versatile light tanks that are more manoeuvrable and operationally flexible in mountains,” another source said. The ongoing Russia-Ukraine war has also impacted both the manufacturing and sustenance of the Army’s fleet of 1,200 T-90S (another 457 being manufactured under licence from Russia) and 2,400 older T-72 tanks. The Army wants the new light tanks to also incorporate niche technologies like AI, drone integration, active protection system and high degree of situational awareness, among others.


Pointers

1. Estimated cost of program is 17,500 crore rupees.

2. Usage will not be limited to mountains but also kutch area. Also air mobile.

3. Total requirement 354. (6 formations with 59 tanks each)

4. 59 tanks will be DRDO-L&T

Rest will be open competition. If DRDO wins then DRDO-L&T, else other.

BAE and Israel both had showcased their ideas. They will likely team up with Indian pvt sector companies..
 

Fatalis

Senior member
Sep 30, 2022
1,102
1,649
India
Pointers

1. Estimated cost of program is 17,500 crore rupees.

2. Usage will not be limited to mountains but also kutch area. Also air mobile.

3. Total requirement 354. (6 formations with 59 tanks each)

4. 59 tanks will be DRDO-L&T

Rest will be open competition. If DRDO wins then DRDO-L&T, else other.

BAE and Israel both had showcased their ideas. They will likely team up with Indian pvt sector companies..
I feel like DRDO is worrying that they will lose the competition to the private players and their RnD will go in vein, so they went to the government for backing them up and securing them some numbers which government did and quoted them a number '59'.

Now, for the rest of the number which is around 291, private players will be allowed to bid and develop and if DRDO also wants to bid then they can do it separately without any commitment of procurement.
 

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
I feel like DRDO is worrying that they will lose the competition to the private players and their RnD will go in vein, so they went to the government for backing them up and securing them some numbers which government did and quoted them a number '59'.

Now, for the rest of the number which is around 291, private players will be allowed to bid and develop and if DRDO also wants to bid then they can do it separately without any commitment of procurement.
Just clear AMCA and TEDBF funds first 🙃
 

Fatalis

Senior member
Sep 30, 2022
1,102
1,649
India
🤣 they are not afraid of any thing, on the contrary it is the govt which is afraid of them.


vain.
The similar kind of arrangement will happen to 814 MGS but there no number will be reserved for DRDO and they will have to bid in the tender.
 

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
Only 50 will be indigenous that too as a khairat rest will be import solution. When you have dalla lobby at helm don't get excited.
59 will be drdo and drdo will be free to bid for the rest too. Its kind of unfair to others.

I would have hoped for full fledged competition between DRDO design, BAE and Israeli design.
 

_Anonymous_

Senior Member
Dec 4, 2017
19,262
15,414
Mumbai
59 will be drdo and drdo will be free to bid for the rest too. Its kind of unfair to others.

I would have hoped for full fledged competition between DRDO design, BAE and Israeli design.
After the release of the ATAGS RFI , in spite of all that tall talk on MII & Atma Nirbharta including the GoI's / MoD's active push towards it by coming out with the DPP , various MII plans w.r.t the armed forces , negative import lists etc I somehow get the strong impression there's either deep dissatisfaction at the DRDO consequently leading to the IA favouring imports or an active lobby smartly playing on this dissatisfaction to ply their own agenda .

I'd be very interested in seeing whom Elbit would be partnering with to bid for the RFP for ATAGS. The cat'd be out of the bag then.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Innominate

Ankit Kumar

Team StratFront
Nov 30, 2017
6,043
6,262
Bangalore
After the release of the ATAGS RFI , in spite of all that tall talk on MII & Atma Nirbharta including the GoI's / MoD's active push towards it by coming out with the DPP , various MII plans w.r.t the armed forces , negative import lists etc I somehow get the strong impression there's either deep dissatisfaction at the DRDO consequently leading to the IA favouring imports or an active lobby smartly playing on this dissatisfaction to ply their own agenda .

I'd be very interested in seeing whom Elbit would be partnering with to bid for the RFP for ATAGS. The cat'd be out of the bag then.
In 2013 we were talking about 414 OFB guns right? 114 45cal ones and 300 in 52 cal.

This RFI is an insurance against OFB gun. Those 300 units. Kalyani has a 155/52 gun without any APU, like the M46. Low cost, light weight and like for like replacement of solid M46 guns, but with the capability to fire at high angles.

I just urge all to wait and not judge. Just discuss the possibilities. Atleast in the Artillery case.

ATAGS are coming. And 1400 units will come. But 2-3 years down the line.
 

marich01

Senior member
Aug 17, 2022
2,768
3,617
India

L&T gets order to build prototype of light tank for Sino-India border,​

To be optimised for extreme cold, high altitude of Ladakh, Arunachal Pradesh
With the Indian Army on a major drive to equip itself adequately on the Sino-Indian border, the Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) and Larsen & Toubro (L&T) have joined hands to develop an indigenous light tank that is optimised for the extreme cold and high altitude of Ladakh and Arunachal Pradesh.
Having co-designed an indigenous, 25-tonne, light tank, the DRDO has placed a development order on L&T to build the first prototype, say Army sources.
Meanwhile, the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) — the Ministry of Defence’s (MoD’s) apex body for capital purchases — has granted an Acceptance of Necessity (AoN), or in-principle agreement, for seven light tank regiments, each equipped with 45 tanks.
The AoN requires L&T — the MoD’s development partner — to build one regiment of light tanks, while the MoD acquires the other six regiments under the “Make” procedure.
The light tank will have a hull, co-developed by DRDO and L&T, that will house an 800 horsepower (HP) engine optimised for high altitudes. The engine will be provided by German firm MTU, which is a subsidiary of Rolls-Royce.
Mounted on this hull will be a 105-millimetre gun turret, procured ready-built from Belgian firm, John Cockerill.
It is intended to marry the DRDO’s expertise in tank design, created while developing the Arjun tank, with the heavy engineering capability of L&T, which is already building the K-9 Vajra self-propelled artillery gun system for the army.
The indigenous light tank was initially planned to be built on the chassis of the K-9 Vajra. This, however, was ruled out because the Army placed a weight limit of 25 tonnes on the light tank, while the Vajra’s heavy chassis would take its weight to at least 34-35 tonnes.
The armoured challenge from the People’s Liberation Army (PLA) in Ladakh is centred on China’s new light tank, the agile and versatile ZTQ 105 — also known as the Type 15 –developed by China’s North Industries Group Corporation (NORINCO) and unveiled during the Zhuhai Air Show in 2016.
The ZTQ 105 has a 105-mm rifled gun that can destroy enemy tanks at ranges of two-to-three kilometres (km). It also fires anti-tank guided missiles to knock out tanks at ranges of five km.
The Indian Army currently uses Russian T-72 and T-90 tanks on the Sino-Indian border. But these hefty, 42-45-tonne main battle tanks are designed for the plains. Movement is difficult for them on steep and narrow mountain roads.
There are also limitations on how much their heavy 120-mm guns can be depressed or elevated, sometimes preventing them from engaging targets on hilltops or in valleys. That is why the Army took only small numbers of T-72 and T-90 tanks into Ladakh to counter the Chinese intrusions in 2020, and used them only sparingly.
In contrast, the Army has a formidable combat tradition of using light tanks in the mountains. In 1944, it used Stuart and Sherman tanks in the battle of Kohima. In 1948, these same tanks pushed back Pakistan forces in the Zoji-la pass. Against China in 1962, the Army used light AMX-13 tanks in the battle of Gurung Hill near Pangong Tso and deployed them in Bomdila and Dirang in Arunachal Pradesh. In the 1971 Bangladesh campaign, French AMX-13 and Soviet PT-76 tanks played a stellar role in the battle of Garibpur.
Although the K-9 Vajra artillery gun is designed for use in plains terrain, the Sino-Indian border tensions in 2020 saw a full regiment of these long-range, self-propelled guns deployed in eastern Ladakh, to increase the army’s long-range firepower.
Their successful deployment prompted the Army to consider diverting significant numbers of K-9 Vajras for use in mountainous terrain. This requires L&T to build 100 more K-9 Vajras; as well as induction of the Ordnance Factory Board’s indigenous 155 mm, 45 calibre Dhanush howitzers, and imported M777 ultralight guns.
To cater for this enhanced firepower, L&T has built 100 K-9 Vajras in Hazira, near Surat, with technology transferred from South Korean defence major Hanwha Defense. It handed over the 100th SP howitzer on February 18, 2021, ahead of its contracted date.
Now the MoD is pursuing the “Vajra repeat programme”, which requires L&T to build another 100 K-9 Vajra howitzers. L&T’s proposal is currently before the MoD’s “technical evaluation committee.” The commercial bid is likely to be opened this month.