Project 75 India Diesel-electric Submarine Programs (SSK) : Updates and Discussions

Who will win the P75I program?

  • L&T and Navantia

    Votes: 16 36.4%
  • MDL and TKMS

    Votes: 11 25.0%
  • It will get canceled eventually

    Votes: 17 38.6%

  • Total voters
    44
  • Poll closed .
Could this have something to do with the data breach (yet again) at NG? After the 1st incident in 2016, the IN delayed plans to buy more Kalvari.

Le Naval Groupe seems to be a bunch of Charlot . Just a few years ago leaked details of the Scorpenes made the headlines around the world. Le Naval Groupe assured everybody concerned those leaks weren't important. People seem to have bought into these explanations & the matter died a quiet death.

7-8 years later , here we are once again. Wonder what will the Charlot at Le Naval Groupe be coming out with next by way of an explanation instead of strengthening their cyber security. @Picdelamirand-oil ; @Bon Plan ; @Amarante ; @Herciv

The Australians not the brightest of the lot out there giving close competition in this matter to the Canadians must be on the floor besides themselves. You tell le Francais pops . @Optimist
 
Le Naval Groupe seems to be a bunch of Charlot . Just a few years ago leaked details of the Scorpenes made the headlines around the world. Le Naval Groupe assured everybody concerned those leaks weren't important. People seem to have bought into these explanations & the matter died a quiet death.

7-8 years later , here we are once again. Wonder what will the Charlot at Le Naval Groupe be coming out with next by way of an explanation instead of strengthening their cyber security. @Picdelamirand-oil ; @Bon Plan ; @Amarante ; @Herciv

The Australians not the brightest of the lot out there giving close competition in this matter to the Canadians must be on the floor besides themselves. You tell le Francais pops . @Optimist
i’ve sent some messages here

@Sathya namaskar (‘cause i Forgot in my Previous post) and Namaskar to all of you.

Other infos dated 23.07:

The French authorities have been doing cybercriminals a disservice lately! [want to say « are Harming ´em »]

New victory ✌🏽 with the arrest of the "administrator"—read: the mastermind—of the other Russian "Amazon of cybercrime"!

As a reminder, this forum existed for over 12 years—since 2013—and contained firsthand information about cybercrime!

According to the authorities, the arrested suspect, who has been very active in cybercrime for nearly 20 years, allegedly pocketed the tidy sum of €7 million.
He was arrested in Ukraine, four years after the investigation began!

Note that since this afternoon, the site is no longer accessible on the clearnet—read: the normal internet—but remains (for the time being) accessible on its darkweb version.

Cyber-yours,

SaxX ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ /d**pl

adendum from a contributor on the air-défense forum, thx 2 the original poster:

A recap of the alleged NG hack:

Naval Group, a destabilization operation underway?

Two weeks ago, NoName057 (no introduction needed), a pro-Russian hacktivist group known for its DDOS attacks, already claimed, before its partial dismantling, to have infiltrated "the internal perimeter of Naval Group."

They mentioned the assistance of "volunteers" with whom "interesting data" had been recovered before being shared with "relevant/appropriate third parties." without making any mention of the nature of this data or even accompanying this claim with a screenshot in the absence of samples...

This first claim made on Telegram was a flop.

A week later, between July 14 and 17, a large-scale operation, led by authorities from several countries, including France, put a serious stop to the activities of the hacker collective NoName057(16).

Another week later, we find the "same" claim, from a cybercriminal who had created his account a little earlier on the "Amazon of cybercrime," with more details on the alleged cyberattack on Naval Group, a 13GB sample of data, and, above all, a 72-hour ultimatum...

The modus operandi, the timeline, and many other questions arise... are surprising.
A destabilization operation targeting France through its flagship maritime defense? A false flag operation by a competitor or a government following the group's latest contracts? ...

Also, always take a step back, know how to cross-reference sources, and avoid letting your narrative dictate!
A reputational attack, a destabilization operation,
it's like the three Rafale jets supposedly shot down during Sindoor.

There's a saying that goes: gossip, gossip, there's always something left.
 
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i’ve sent some messages here


A reputational attack, a destabilization operation,
it's like the three Rafale jets supposedly shot down during Sindoor.

There's a saying that goes: gossip, gossip, there's always something left.
I'm sorry but this is what NG claimed the last time too. Whether these disclosures affect national security & compromise operations are something only expert evaluation will confirm. As of now it's one man's word against the other .

Btw NG quite obviously hasn't learnt anything from the previous episode. Last time the allegations were TKMS was indulging in industrial espionage . Now it's being blamed on the Russians.
 
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french subs leaks (real truth revealed)
Gw3PlN8WcAArPB4

@_Anonymous_
we know nothing​
 
How Make in India comes to focus in submarine plan amidst Trump shadow

So the Babus do know that 3 Scorpenes would be delivered starting 6 years and P75I delivery will start in 10.

Logically the last Scorpene will come before the 1st P75I.
Of course they know, each file needs 4-5 signatures from different stakeholders, and the top rank official has to self-attest each page of the file. Like if the entire file is with 200 300 or more pages still no exception. Else finance ministry will send it back again. Approx 40% are getting sent back this way and more delay.

Anyway, this cutting up a sub and fitting the module biz is frankly pathetic and as per projection due to overall cost involved Govt is not considering subs as priority. Hence the surface warfare asset building is more priority.
 
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How Make in India comes to focus in submarine plan amidst Trump shadow


Even as the Indian Navy is tossing between two of its critical submarine programmes, three additional Kalveri (Scorpene) submarines and Project-75 India (P-75I) for six advanced submarines, the issue of the Make in India component is being discussed in the corridors of South Block.

India is in critical need to enhance the navy’s underwater capabilities as Pakistan is building its underwater prowess massively with the help of China. The PLA Navy is the world’s largest and most rapidly expanding navy. Its submarine fleet is projected to reach 65 this year and 80 by 2035.

Early this week, during Philippines president Ferdinand R. Marcos Jr’s bilateral discussions with Prime Minister Narendra Modi, both leaders discussed enhancing cooperation in maritime security, including through collaborative efforts for enhanced maritime domain awareness (MDA), cooperation in ship-building, maritime connectivity and coastal surveillance.

It is learnt that the Philippines has expressed interest in Indian-built submarines. For that, the Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Limited (MDL) will play a significant role as it has just delivered six Kalveri (Scorpene)-class submarines in partnership with France’s Naval Group.


In July 2023, India and France had signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) to fabricate submarine and surface combatants and parts in Mumbai and Kolkata, respectively, for export. It was announced that the move will boost the Make in India initiative since MDL will jointly develop and manufacture Scorpene-class submarines with the Naval Group for a third country.

While the contract for three additional Kalveri-class submarines is awaiting the Union Cabinet’s approval, as announced a year ago, P-75I is at the cost-negotiation stage, even though the shipbuilder has not yet been called for it. Modi announced the contract for manufacturing three additional Scorpene submarines during his visit to France in July 2023. Progress of the project has been followed up by French president Emmanuel Macron and Modi during state visits in India and France in January 2024 and February 2025.

While explaining the timelines of both submarine projects, a defence official said that three additional Scorpene submarines will be delivered in six years from signing of the contract, while in the case of P-75I, it will take at least 10 years to deliver the first boat, factoring in the tedious procurement process in India.

Defence sources claim the additional submarines will have 60 per cent indigenous content compared to the previously delivered six Kalveri submarines, where all six boats had close to 30 per cent indigenous content on an average. Moreover, the new additional Scorpene submarines will be slightly bigger than the earlier version of the boat and have improved performances, including significant involvement of Indian industry and possibilities of integration of technologies developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), including torpedoes.

For the Scorpene (Kalveri) submarines under Project 75, the Make in India components include main batteries, gas analysers, intercoms, AC and RO plants, and hull fabrication—with INS Vagsheer, the most recent boat to be commissioned, achieving 40 per cent indigenisation. Moreover, it will have the DRDO Naval Materials Research Laboratory’s fuel cell-based AIP (air independent propulsion) system, which is being developed. Besides, the combat management system and missile package area are also planned as Made in India.

On the other hand, P-75I (whose project cost has shot up from Rs 43,000 crore to Rs 70,000 crore) will have local content of about 45 per cent in the first boat, going up to 60 per cent in the last (sixth) boat. These six advanced conventional submarines will have the latest sensors and weapons and AIP. Germany’s ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (TKMS), which is being shortlisted for the project in partnership with MDL, cleared the technical evaluation conducted by the ministry of defence, and will bring its own proven AIP into the boat.

Another factor bothering Indian naval planners is the weapons package in the German boat. So far, existing German HDW (Shishumar-class) submarines have the US’s Harpoon missiles, and it is likely that the new submarines to be built under P-75I will also carry Harpoon missiles. However, the Indian Navy has not finalised the weapons package with the submarine-maker yet. Considering US president Donald Trump’s unpredictability, India’s advanced submarine programme resting some dependency on a US missile platform could cause problems at a later stage.

On the other hand, the DRDO is at an advanced stage of developing its 500-km-range Submarine-Launched Cruise Missile (SLCM). This missile is expected to be fitted on Indian submarines. “Uniformity in its inventory is always good for any navy. From weapons package to propulsion system, the Indian Navy should be trying to get a common platform as much as possible,” said a defence source. Moreover, the DRDO-developed AIP gives India an edge when it comes to exporting submarines as this will not require consent from any third country.
 
Western navies are phasing out Harpoon and it's unlikely the IN will want to buy any more. As the article itself states the focus is on commonality and localization. Imo, negotiations for Kalvari B2 have advanced too far for the deal to be cancelled now. Otoh, cost negotiations with TKMS for Type-214I haven't even started.