We will fight alone only. Our politicians irrespective of the flag color will make a storm out of that issue.
Japanese will drag US in to the equation and avoid a military conflict with Chinese.
Project 75 India Diesel-electric Submarine Programs (SSK) : Updates and Discussions
- Thread starter Himanshu
- Start date
Definitely. We are like 300. Their entire navy has to operate from across major chokepoints to get to us, which gives us a major advantage.
The expectation is by the time PLAN becomes a threat to India, we will also have a large enough navy of our own, including SSNs. And post 2030, we can use our economic heft to start making subs like baguettes, no different from how the US is doing it today.
Long long back on another forum, I had stated that we are going to have spinoff of Rafale deal with Submarine deal. The time has come now.
With no Trump in white house american jets with IAF is a closed chapter. So its logical to go with already existing aircraft and an upgraded version of existing submarine with IN.
HSL is constructing two Diving Support Vessels which will likely carry the UK bought Deep Submersibles Rescue Vessels. That is Submarine Rescue Ship.
We need to invest in a fleet of Submarine Support Vessel. Capable of towing the submarines in distress, provide replenishment at sea, repair equipment and if required rescue equipment.
The absence of any such program in IN shows lack of planning on our part.
If we are hellbent on spending 1 billion per SSK, we need to invest in vessels which improve their efficiency.
When will the first SSN start construction and when will it be handed over to the navy? Is it possible before 2030?
An estimate if no sources are available.
The construction is expected to begin after 2024. Beyond that it's unclear how many years it will take to finish, and that entirely depends on if they plan to make the subs with full strength of manpower over three shifts or not. There's also the question of whether subs will be constructed from one line or two.
If they choose both, like the Americans, then all the subs can be delivered by 2030. If they don't choose either, then it will take 7-10 years just to finish 1, with the following ships delivered slightly faster.
The Americans take 2-3 years to finish construction and commission a sub. And they use 2 shipyards. So if our shipyards also get enough orders, like 5-10 subs each, then the same can be replicated after the first 6 are built.
Lastly, it depends on whether the shipyard is public or private. If it's public then all numbers are just numbers. More time will be spent on being idle than on production. If the navy has executive control or it's under private control, then the subs will come in sooner than expected, because the navy will set relaxed timelines anyway.
For a first try, you will need more than 10 years to induct a new indan studied and built SSN. Far more....
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Gotta agree with that. But I think the SSBN experience will transfer over to the SSN program relatively quickly. We will be producing the first of the third class of SSBNs while we begin production of our first SSN. So that counts for a lot when the same generation of technologies become transferrable to the SSN.
A SSN is smaller. It's not a way to ease the design (same for jets : the smaller, the harder. Tejas is a good illustration, unfortunately for India)
But you're right : SSBN is a real ans usefull experience.
Interestingly, our first two classes of SSBNs, Arihant class and S4, will be similar in size and weight as the upcoming SSNs. Arihant and S4 have a displacement of 6000-7000 tons and the SSNs will displace 6000 tons.
I think the IN will be careful by using evolutionary technologies developed under the Arihant class instead of going for whole new tech.
Will the SSN use the same nuclear reactor than SSBN ?
6000 to 7000 tons is low for modern SSBN (the emphasis on noise stealth increase the size of the sub). But they carry a reduced load of missiles if I remember well.
6000 tons fon SSN is the norm.
A new and more powerful reactor is needed.
An SSN was planned since the 70s. Our first nuclear sub was supposed to be an SSN until nuclear deterrence became more important.
Arihant class S2 is for R&D. It will have 4 VLS.
S3 may have 4 or 8 VLS. Most likely 4, just like S2.
S4 and S4* will have 8 VLS.
So 6000-7000 tons seems fine for such small subs.
S5, S6 and S7 will have either 12 or 16 VLS, weighing over 13000 tons.
3 billion USD for lease of a refurbished Akula for another 10 years was signed few years back.
A lot of that amount is actually for consulting fees for designs, testing and import of certain components for SSBN program and in my opinion even for the SSN program.
More or less in similar configuration to Delta III/IV
They are not going to give us their latest learnings for money. They didn't do it with China for a lot more, and sure will not do it now.
What is possible that they can take up a smaller Soviet era SSN design , and their design bureau helps us to add various systems we can get our hands on to outfit the whole design.
Even for the SSBN project they are not giving out Borei blueprints. But inputs based on Soviet era delta iii
Possibly similar to the Triomphant class.
Rather our SSN and SSBN programs are similar in size to the current French programs.
France and India have a lot of military needs in common....
Definitely. I don't think there's any other country we have as many common interests as with France.
I hope it turns into something more concrete later on.
Naval Group delivers first Suffren-class submarine to French Navy
France-based shipbuilder Naval Group has delivered the first of six Suffren-class nuclear attack submarines (SSN) for the French Navy.
www.naval-technology.com
What If we try to get a package deal
Of P.75 I Plus this New SSN from
France
