MMRCA 2.0 - Updates and Discussions

What is your favorite for MMRCA 2.0 ?

  • JSF F-35 Blk 4

    Votes: 24 11.9%
  • Rafale F4

    Votes: 159 78.7%
  • Eurofighter Typhoon T3

    Votes: 3 1.5%
  • Gripen E/F

    Votes: 6 3.0%
  • F-16 B70

    Votes: 1 0.5%
  • SH F-18

    Votes: 9 4.5%
  • F-15EX

    Votes: 2 1.0%

  • Total voters
    202

randomradio

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Nov 30, 2017
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The problem is f-35 brings more American oversight than being in an actual treaty alliance with America.

Most countries, especially in Europe, honestly don't care about this. It's more like the benefits of a much closer relationship with the US outweigh the cons. Also, their "oversight" isn't really a big problem even for countries like India, let alone Europe. Like the Americans want to protect their communication and encryption systems. Such things don't bother even India.
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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What's special about the F-35 is unlike all other US jets, the F-35 is a one-man army. It doesn't require the assistance of support aircraft for intelligence gathering and EW. So it's pretty much the best option for non-NATO countries for interoperability with NATO.
Rafale also doesn't require the assistance of support aircraft for intelligence gathering and EW and it doesn't require ALIS or ODIN too... (y)
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
11,983
9,147
India
Rafale also doesn't require the assistance of support aircraft for intelligence gathering and EW and it doesn't require ALIS or ODIN too... (y)

Yes. But the drawback being it cannot communicate as well with US assets like the F-35 can.

So the F-35 in Europe has more advantages if you have Russia as an adversary since the US and other F-35 operators are likely to fight alongside you. Most Rafale operators outside Europe will not be communicating with French assets, so there is no advantage of interoperability. Inside Europe, the American presence is still greater than French presence, with 7 NATO operators of the F-35.

You may not have much regard for ALIS/ODIN, but for Finland emergency supplies and attrition replacements are more readily available from multiple sources. A loss of 30-40 F-35s can easily be replaced by allies overnight.

So, F-35's one man army + interoperability + logistics versus Rafale's one man army.
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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Seventh batch of QEAF Rafales delivered

The seventh batch of Al-Quwwat Al-Jawiyyah Al-Amiriyyah Al-Qatariyyah (QEAF, Qatar Emiri Air Force) Dassault Rafales departed Bordeaux/Mérignac (France) on delivery to Qatar on 9 November 2021.

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The three aircraft involved are all Rafale DQ two-seaters. The fighters were accompanied by a QEAF C-17A Globemaster III registered (A7-)MAO and a Qatar Airways Amiri Flight Airbus A340-211 registered A7-HHK. Both transporters arrived a few days before.

The following Rafales were delivered:

Rafale DQ: QA201, QA208 and QA209 as ADIYAT11, ADIYAT12 and ADIYAT13
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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France To Sign Multi-Billion Rafale Fighter Jet Deal With The UAE During Macron’s Visit To Abu Dhabi – French Media

France is close to finalizing a Rafale fighter jet deal with the UAE. According to French media, the potential deal could involve the F-4 variant of the multi-role combat aircraft.

Reports suggest that if negotiations progress at this pace, an announcement could be made before the end of this year. The French media also reported that President Emmanuel Macron will visit Abu Dhabi on December 2, followed by visits to Doha (Qatar) and Riyadh (Saudi Arabia) on December 3 and 4.

The agreement might be announced during his visit, boosting his image significantly before the end of his five-year tenure. However, no official announcement has been made by the French government.

Since 2009, the UAE has shown interest in the Rafale F4 standard. The fact that these claims surfaced so soon after the US confirmed its willingness to proceed with the sale of F-35 fighter jets to the UAE, with somewhat “additional obligations” before and after delivery, is striking.

France-UAE Ties Post-AUKUS

The visit of UAE Crown Prince Sheikh Mohammed bin Zayed Al Nahyan to France in September has been linked to Emirati-French efforts to forge a new alliance to cover the purported gap left by Washington’s disengagement from the Arab Gulf region.

There has been a sense of waning of American commitment to Gulf security since the outset of President Joe Biden’s administration.

This was sparked by the United States’ move to lessen its military presence in the region, including the withdrawal of the Patriot air-defense missile system and a restriction on arms sales to Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates.

UAE-France
UAE Crown Prince Sheikh Mohammed bin Zayed and President Emmanuel Macron in Paris, on September 15, 2021. (via Twitter)

Sheikh Mohammed bin Zayed’s visit to Paris, according to UAE Ambassador to France Hend Al Otaiba, was a chance to showcase the two countries’ excellent strategic alliance, emphasizing their coherent goal and determination to develop further cooperation.
Furthermore, as one of Washington’s oldest allies, France has suffered severe embarrassment as a consequence of the AUKUS pact involving Australia, the UK, and the US. And now, France and the UAE want to play a bigger role in the region and are working together militarily and economically.

Status Of The Rafale Deal

According to the Arab Weekly, Sheikh Mohammed may count on his special relationship with Macron, as well as the UAE’s significant investment in France, to seal a deal for Rafale jet fighters.

This will be part of a larger Emirati effort to diversify its armament sources. Since 2009, the UAE and France have discussed the procurement of 60 Rafale combat aircraft.

According to military experts, the aircraft’s combat record in Afghanistan in 2007, Libya in 2011, and the Sahel region in 2013 earned it a global reputation. The UAE is already a customer of the French arms manufacturers. It has 436 Leclerc assault tanks with its army.

In terms of Franco-Gulf trade, the UAE has also become a vital strategic partner for France in the Middle East, second only to Saudi Arabia. In the battle against terror, the two nations maintain a strong partnership.

Additionally, Egypt entered into a contract worth €3.75 billion ($4.5 billion) to purchase 30 Rafale combat jets in May and this is expected to further encourage the UAE to buy the Rafale fighter jets.

Prior to this, Macron had advocated arms sales to Gulf countries. He referred to Riyadh and Abu Dhabi as allies in the fight against terrorism, emphasizing that Paris had gained assurances that these countries would not use these weapons against civilians.

There is a possibility that the UAE will buy both F-35 and Rafale fighter jets, but there is a fine distinction between the two. While the Rafale will provide them with more operational autonomy, the American platform will come with certain pre-conditions. The Rafale could also be an excellent replacement for the UAE’s Mirage-2000 fighters.
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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These are the reasons that prompted the Emirates to choose the Rafale aircraft

2021-11-20 Military News , Regional News Military , United Arab Emirates


French President Emmanuel Macron will travel to the United Arab Emirates in early December, according to two well-informed officials.
Bloomberg news agency reported that the officials refused to provide details, while a spokeswoman for Macron's office did not confirm the news of the visit.

Challenges quoted unnamed sources as saying that progress has been made in talks on selling Rafale fighter jets to the UAE, and the deal may be announced before the end of the year.

Challenges said the deal could include as many as 30 aircrafts.

And a specialist in the field of military aviation, Mina Adel, commented in an interview with the Arab Defense website about the issue, saying: “The reason for the success of the Emirati-French talks regarding the Rafale planes is the French’s reliance on an attempt to draw attention to the technological advantages of the fighter, such as monitoring, jamming and obstruction systems, and armament, which is one of the The best in the world right now.”


Adel added, "The French were able to persuade the Emiratis to buy the Rafale fighter, by showing the result of its use in more than one theater of operations."

According to Adel, this year France participated in two exercises in the UAE, the first is called "Desert Flag", in which the Rafale plane was tested against the F-16 fighters of the Bahraini and Emirati Air Force, and the Mirage 2000-9 of the UAE Air Force, and aircraft "F - 15" American aircraft and the "Su -30" subsidiary of air force Indian, showed strong results of the French plane. "

Adel pointed out that the French fighter proved itself in the face of the American "Patriot" systems in the exercises of the second "Skyros", in which Squadron 3/30 Lorraine participated.