MMRCA 2.0 - Updates and Discussions

What is your favorite for MMRCA 2.0 ?

  • JSF F-35 Blk 4

    Votes: 22 11.6%
  • Rafale F4

    Votes: 152 80.0%
  • Eurofighter Typhoon T3

    Votes: 4 2.1%
  • Gripen E/F

    Votes: 4 2.1%
  • F-16 B70

    Votes: 1 0.5%
  • SH F-18

    Votes: 8 4.2%
  • F-15EX

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    190

Picdelamirand-oil

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It cut an electric cable probably at 14 m when following the ground at a very low altitude.


 
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vikata

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As per the gamer “It’s so easy that it’s ridiculous” 😀
How reliable are these games, saw mirage and jf17 ending in a tie, jf 17 even defeating f15 and su 30. Rafale unable to pick raptor at even 20 miles wheras su 35 picked it at a fairly long distance yet unable to kill.
 
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AbRaj

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How reliable are these games, saw mirage and jf17 ending in a tie, jf 17 even defeating f15 and su 30. Rafale unable to pick raptor at even 20 miles wheras su 35 picked it at a fairly long distance yet unable to kill.
Rafale, F22,Su35&57 all are unofficial mods
So not accurate. Rest all like Mirage V, Su29,Mig21& 29, F16, F15,F18,JF17 all are accurate and based on OEM provided parameters.
But also notice that not all weapons and systems are disclosed. Like Su/Migs on DCS don’t have newer BVR and WVR AAMs like R73 etc sane is true for Mirages

And JF17 shooting down Mirage, F16 , Su29 etc is very much possible given pilot is skilled.
 
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Lolwa

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Rafale, F22,Su35&57 all are unofficial mods
So not accurate. Rest all like Mirage V, Su29,Mig21& 29, F16, F15,F18,JF17 all are accurate and based on OEM provided parameters.
But also notice that not all weapons and systems are disclosed. Like Su/Migs on DCS don’t have newer BVR and WVR AAMs like R73 etc sane is true for Mirages

And JF17 shooting down Mirage, F16 , Su29 etc is very much possible given pilot is skilled.
I've heard the sd 10a on the jf 17 is too broken in DCS. Interesting considering it's just a r77 clone and the r77 is particularly weak in DCS..
 

AbRaj

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I've heard the sd 10a on the jf 17 is too broken in DCS. Interesting considering it's just a r77 clone and the r77 is particularly weak in DCS..
It doesn’t work like that in DCS. They reach to the OEM/User and if OEM provides the specs of particular weapon or vehicle, they feed it on their system library.
Copy or no copy is irrelevant.

Also a developer can modify existing platforms to mimic another like Su29 to Su30 or Mirage to Rafale or Gripen by changing certain performance parameters
Or Su 29 to Su57 and F15 to F22 by add ons like TVS, RCS reduction module or EW modules like IR blinder etc .
These types of mod are categorised in different section from official weapons and Jets.

PS: the developer team of DCS is mainly Russian
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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SEOUL, Feb. 20 -- South Korea's arms procurement agency said Saturday that Indonesia's reported plan to purchase F-15EX jets from the U.S. defense giant, Boeing, and France's Rafale fighters is "separate" from a joint warplane development project between the two countries.

Defense Acquisition Program Administration (DAPA) made the comment after reports emerged that the Southeast Asian country plans to purchase the fighters between 2021 and 2024 amid speculation that it might want to quit the KF-X joint fighter development program with Korea.
 

kor4116

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As a Korean, I don't think the PADA's judgment is true. Indonesia does not have the ability to handle both fighter entry projects at the same time. If the Indonesian government purchases 36+8 units of Rafale and F-15EX, I think that the production of KFX/IFX that Indonesia will introduce in the future will be hit hard. Of course, Indonesia has plans to expand its fighter jets to 180 in the future, but given their defense budget, it seems impossible in the short term. Currently, the Indonesian Air Force has only 50 fighters. From the perspective of the Indonesian government, I think that the KFX/IFX project could have been a simple R&D acquisition project rather than a fighter introduction. The Indonesian government has decided to invest $2.5 billion in KFX/IFX development, but continues to postpone the payment of the investment and is still negotiating with the Korean government. Some Koreans are questioning Indonesia's willingness to continue doing business together. The 36 Rafale sold to India were nearly $9 billion. For Indonesia, $9 billion is a very large budget.
 

randomradio

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As a Korean, I don't think the PADA's judgment is true. Indonesia does not have the ability to handle both fighter entry projects at the same time. If the Indonesian government purchases 36+8 units of Rafale and F-15EX, I think that the production of KFX/IFX that Indonesia will introduce in the future will be hit hard. Of course, Indonesia has plans to expand its fighter jets to 180 in the future, but given their defense budget, it seems impossible in the short term. Currently, the Indonesian Air Force has only 50 fighters. From the perspective of the Indonesian government, I think that the KFX/IFX project could have been a simple R&D acquisition project rather than a fighter introduction. The Indonesian government has decided to invest $2.5 billion in KFX/IFX development, but continues to postpone the payment of the investment and is still negotiating with the Korean government. Some Koreans are questioning Indonesia's willingness to continue doing business together. The 36 Rafale sold to India were nearly $9 billion. For Indonesia, $9 billion is a very large budget.

Indonesia's plans for Rafale and F-15 are short term whereas the IFX is long term. While the Rafale and F-15 procurement are expected to end by 2024, IFX procurement is only expected to start a few years after that. So the IFX will be crucial to Indonesia's plans to build an indigenous industry and a large fighter jet fleet and the Rafale/F-15 procurement is unlikely to conflict with IFX.

Furthermore, you can bet Indonesia will use the Rafale deal as a negotiation tactic to get better terms for IFX. Even India has faced issues with some Korean businesses and I suppose Indonesia is facing similar issues.

But it's possible that the Indonesians feel they have bitten more than they can chew with the IFX since they have no experience. So they may also be delaying signature until they feel they are ready to take up such a project, or they may be waiting for the KFX to mature first before committing money to it. Can't dismiss foreign interference as well. But I don't believe Rafale/F-15 will pose a hurdle unless the French offer a production line with a larger order than just 36.
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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As a Korean, I don't think the PADA's judgment is true. Indonesia does not have the ability to handle both fighter entry projects at the same time. If the Indonesian government purchases 36+8 units of Rafale and F-15EX, I think that the production of KFX/IFX that Indonesia will introduce in the future will be hit hard. Of course, Indonesia has plans to expand its fighter jets to 180 in the future, but given their defense budget, it seems impossible in the short term. Currently, the Indonesian Air Force has only 50 fighters. From the perspective of the Indonesian government, I think that the KFX/IFX project could have been a simple R&D acquisition project rather than a fighter introduction. The Indonesian government has decided to invest $2.5 billion in KFX/IFX development, but continues to postpone the payment of the investment and is still negotiating with the Korean government. Some Koreans are questioning Indonesia's willingness to continue doing business together. The 36 Rafale sold to India were nearly $9 billion. For Indonesia, $9 billion is a very large budget.
But perhaps they won't ask for ISE (1.8 Billion) and improvement of two Bases (1.7 Billion)
 

kor4116

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But perhaps they won't ask for ISE (1.8 Billion) and improvement of two Bases (1.7 Billion)
Can Rafale be operated in an air base without improvements? Then, why did India request the expansion of expensive and advanced aircraft squadron facilities at two air bases (Ambala, Hashimara) in the purchase of Rafale? F-35s require expensive, standardized and dedicated infrastructure from adopting countries, and purchasing countries are concerned that this could lead to an explosive increase in the cost of introduction. Most F-35 adopters operate the F-35 from one airbase for this reason. South Korea also operates the F-35 at only one air base. The F-35 is also very expensive to operate. For this reason, I think Rafale has a good chance to win the competition in Switzerland and Finland. I'm curious about your opinion SO WHERE IS THE SCAM? The reality of the NDA’s (now) controversial 2016 Rafale deal - Strategic Frontier
 
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kor4116

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인도네시아의 Rafale 및 F-15 계획은 단기적인 반면 IFX는 장기적입니다. Rafale 및 F-15 조달은 2024 년까지 종료 될 예정입니다. IFX 조달은 그 후 몇 년 후에 시작될 예정입니다. 따라서 IFX는 인도네시아의 토착 산업과 대형 전투기를 건설하려는 계획에 매우 중요하며 Rafale / F-15 조달은 IFX와 충돌 할 가능성이 낮습니다.

또한 인도네시아가 IFX에 대한 더 나은 조건을 협상 협상 전술로 Rafale 거래를 사용할 수 있습니다. 인도조차도 일부 한국 기업과 문제에 직면하고 인도네시아도 문제에 직면하고 있습니다.

그러나 인도네시아 사람들은 경험이 없기 때문에 IFX로 씹을 수있는 것보다 더 많이 물었다 고 있습니다. 하기 전에 먼저 성숙되기 시작하기 전에 서명을 연기하거나 시작하기 전에 준비가 될 때까지 서명을 준비합니다. 외부 무시할 수 없습니다. 그러나 프랑스가 36 개 이상의 주문을 가진 생산 라인을 제공하지 않는 Rafale / F-15가 장애물이 될 생각하지 않습니다.

인도네시아의 Rafale 및 F-15 계획은 단기적인 반면 IFX는 장기적입니다. Rafale 및 F-15 조달은 2024 년까지 종료 될 것으로 예상되지만 IFX 조달은 그 후 몇 년 후에 시작될 것으로 예상됩니다. 따라서 IFX는 인도네시아의 토착 산업과 대형 전투기를 건설하려는 계획에 매우 중요하며 Rafale / F-15 조달은 IFX와 충돌 할 가능성이 낮습니다.

또한 인도네시아가 IFX에 대한 더 나은 조건을 얻기위한 협상 전술로 Rafale 거래를 사용할 것이라고 장담 할 수 있습니다. 인도조차도 일부 한국 기업과 문제에 직면했고 인도네시아도 비슷한 문제에 직면했다고 생각합니다.

그러나 인도네시아 사람들은 경험이 없기 때문에 IFX로 씹을 수있는 것보다 더 많이 물었다 고 느낄 수 있습니다. 따라서 그들은 또한 그러한 프로젝트를 시작할 준비가되었다고 느낄 때까지 서명을 연기하거나 KFX가 돈을 지불하기 전에 먼저 성숙되기를 기다리고있을 수 있습니다. 외부 간섭도 무시할 수 없습니다. 그러나 프랑스가 36 개 이상의 주문을 가진 생산 라인을 제공하지 않는 한 Rafale / F-15가 장애물이 될 것이라고 생각하지 않습니다.
귀하의 의견에 동의합니다. 한국에서 KFX / IFX 전투기의 본격적인 양산은 테스트 작업이 끝나는 2028 년경에 시작됩니다. 인도네시아에서의 생산은 그보다 조금 늦을 것 같습니다. 대부분의 한국인은 KFX / IFX 전투기 개발 프로젝트가 아무런 문제없이 진행되어 인도네시아 공군이 Rapal, F-15EX와 함께 KFX / IFX를 운영하기를 희망합니다.
 

randomradio

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귀하의 의견에 동의합니다. 한국에서 KFX / IFX 전투기의 본격적인 양산은 테스트 작업이 끝나는 2028 년경에 시작됩니다. 인도네시아에서의 생산은 그보다 조금 늦을 것 같습니다. 대부분의 한국인은 KFX / IFX 전투기 개발 프로젝트가 아무런 문제없이 진행되어 인도네시아 공군이 Rapal, F-15EX와 함께 KFX / IFX를 운영하기를 희망합니다.

They need 100 new jets. So with 36+8 being the Rafale and F-15, the rest can be the IFX.
 
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Lolwa

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As a Korean, I don't think the PADA's judgment is true. Indonesia does not have the ability to handle both fighter entry projects at the same time. If the Indonesian government purchases 36+8 units of Rafale and F-15EX, I think that the production of KFX/IFX that Indonesia will introduce in the future will be hit hard. Of course, Indonesia has plans to expand its fighter jets to 180 in the future, but given their defense budget, it seems impossible in the short term. Currently, the Indonesian Air Force has only 50 fighters. From the perspective of the Indonesian government, I think that the KFX/IFX project could have been a simple R&D acquisition project rather than a fighter introduction. The Indonesian government has decided to invest $2.5 billion in KFX/IFX development, but continues to postpone the payment of the investment and is still negotiating with the Korean government. Some Koreans are questioning Indonesia's willingness to continue doing business together. The 36 Rafale sold to India were nearly $9 billion. For Indonesia, $9 billion is a very large budget.
Interestingly Indonesia also has a bunch of Sukhoi mkk's and f16's could be a very expensive replacement when you can just upgrade them since Indonesia isn't facing the Chinese anytime soon...
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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Can Rafale be operated in an air base without improvements? Then, why did India request the expansion of expensive and advanced aircraft squadron facilities at two air bases (Ambala, Hashimara) in the purchase of Rafale? F-35s require expensive, standardized and dedicated infrastructure from adopting countries, and purchasing countries are concerned that this could lead to an explosive increase in the cost of introduction. Most F-35 adopters operate the F-35 from one airbase for this reason. South Korea also operates the F-35 at only one air base. The F-35 is also very expensive to operate. For this reason, I think Rafale has a good chance to win the competition in Switzerland and Finland. I'm curious about your opinion SO WHERE IS THE SCAM? The reality of the NDA’s (now) controversial 2016 Rafale deal - Strategic Frontier
There are two types of improvements in the updating of the bases:
  • infrastructural improvements such as concrete shelters, an electrical network without interruptions, air-conditioned areas, pneumatic easements, etc... which can either already be present or can be carried out locally.
  • And there is equipment that will come to populate these infrastructures such as maintenance equipment, trainers, flight simulators.
The cost of improvements is shared more or less equally between these two categories but the requirements for the second category are not the same from one country to another.

What is very expensive with the F-35 is that it requires a heavy computer infrastructure with very strong cyber security because the squadron is permanently connected with the United States. This infrastructure must be housed in secret defence zones.
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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Could you elaborate on this please?
Because the F-35 is a stealth jet that processes large amounts of classified information, many of the installations linked with its operations must meet certain security specifications. Building those structures to both U.S. and U.K. standards while using a foreign workforce of U.K. citizens posed challenges that the U.S. Air Force did not foresee during the design process, Warner said.
  • The Autonomic Logistics Operating Unit (ALOU). The ALOU is the central computer unit that all F-35 data are sent through. As part of the unit, the ALOU consists of two servers that process and store classified and unclassified data respectively. There is only one ALOU, and it is owned by the prime contractor.
  • The Central Point of Entry (CPE). The CPE is a server unit configured to provide software and data distribution for a country’s entire F-35 fleet. It is the node between the ALOU and each country’s Standard Operating Units (generally housed at F-35 installations). The CPE consists of two servers that process and store classified and unclassified data respectively. There is typically one operational CPE per country, although the United States has separate CPEs for its operational commands and training sites.
  • The Standard Operating Unit (SOU). The SOU is a server that is intended to provide all ALIS capabilities to support flying, maintenance, and training at F-35 installations. Typically, each F-35 squadron has at least one SOU. It is the node local to each F-35 squadron. There are two types of SOUs: a classified SOU that supports the flow of classified aircraft-related data and an unclassified SOU that supports the flow of unclassified aircraft-related data.
  • The Portable Memory Device (PMD). The PMD is informally referred to as the “brick” that F-35 pilots use to upload information such as mission planning data. F-35 personnel use the PMD to store mission and maintenance data generated during flight which may then be downloaded into the ALIS SOU to support maintenance and mission debrief activities.
  • The Portable Memory Device Reader (PMD Reader). The PMD Reader is a device intended to be used to remove maintenance data, including health-related codes, off of the Portable Memory Device and load into the SOU. • The Portable Maintenance Aid (PMA). The PMA is an unclassified ruggedized laptop used by F-35 maintainers and flight-line supervisors to view unclassified technical data, and perform and document maintenance activities.
 
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randomradio

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  • The Autonomic Logistics Operating Unit (ALOU). The ALOU is the central computer unit that all F-35 data are sent through. As part of the unit, the ALOU consists of two servers that process and store classified and unclassified data respectively. There is only one ALOU, and it is owned by the prime contractor.
  • The Central Point of Entry (CPE). The CPE is a server unit configured to provide software and data distribution for a country’s entire F-35 fleet. It is the node between the ALOU and each country’s Standard Operating Units (generally housed at F-35 installations). The CPE consists of two servers that process and store classified and unclassified data respectively. There is typically one operational CPE per country, although the United States has separate CPEs for its operational commands and training sites.
  • The Standard Operating Unit (SOU). The SOU is a server that is intended to provide all ALIS capabilities to support flying, maintenance, and training at F-35 installations. Typically, each F-35 squadron has at least one SOU. It is the node local to each F-35 squadron. There are two types of SOUs: a classified SOU that supports the flow of classified aircraft-related data and an unclassified SOU that supports the flow of unclassified aircraft-related data.
  • The Portable Memory Device (PMD). The PMD is informally referred to as the “brick” that F-35 pilots use to upload information such as mission planning data. F-35 personnel use the PMD to store mission and maintenance data generated during flight which may then be downloaded into the ALIS SOU to support maintenance and mission debrief activities.
  • The Portable Memory Device Reader (PMD Reader). The PMD Reader is a device intended to be used to remove maintenance data, including health-related codes, off of the Portable Memory Device and load into the SOU. • The Portable Maintenance Aid (PMA). The PMA is an unclassified ruggedized laptop used by F-35 maintainers and flight-line supervisors to view unclassified technical data, and perform and document maintenance activities.

Everybody once had that question... ALIS, ALIS, who the F is ALIS?


It took America 30 years to answer that question.

And it turned out to be a big scam.
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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The evaluation of the Rafale by the Croats

The bests extracts from the video:
  • Canard and airframe joint, also reflective, is hidden behind SPECTRA EW system sensors
  • But it also has an active stealth capability, and analyzes enemy radar signals to disrupt and degrade their returns.
  • With a payload, the RCS increases, but there's a solution for that as well: SPECTRA electronic warfare suite.
  • All of that gives the Rafale a radar cross section of around 0.1 m2, possibly even smaller.
  • I believe that Rafale is worth every euro, so for cost benefit, I'mgiving it a 10.
And the last:


And it is not a Frenchman who says that. :cool: :cool:
 
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kor4116

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[URL unfurl = "true"] https://www.defensenews.com/smr/nat...acilities-for-american-f-35-jets-are-delayed- 예산 초과 / [/ URL]

  • 자율 물류 운영 단위 (ALOU). ALOU는 모든 F-35 데이터가 전송되는 중앙 컴퓨터 장치입니다. 장치의 일부인 ALOU는 분류 된 데이터와 분류되지 않은 데이터를 각각 처리하고 저장하는 두 개의 서버로 구성됩니다. ALOU는 하나 뿐이며 주 계약자가 소유합니다.
  • 중앙 진입 점 (CPE). CPE는 한 국가의 전체 F-35 함대에 소프트웨어 및 데이터 배포를 제공하도록 구성된 서버 장치입니다. ALOU와 각 국가의 표준 운영 단위 (일반적으로 F-35 설치에 수용) 사이의 노드입니다. CPE는 분류 된 데이터와 분류되지 않은 데이터를 각각 처리하고 저장하는 두 개의 서버로 구성됩니다. 미국에는 운영 명령 및 교육 사이트에 대해 별도의 CPE가 있지만 일반적으로 국가 당 하나의 운영 CPE가 있습니다.
  • 표준 운영 단위 (SOU). SOU는 F-35 설치에서 비행, 유지 관리 및 교육을 지원하기 위해 모든 ALIS 기능을 제공하기위한 서버입니다. 일반적으로 각 F-35 편대에는 SOU가 하나 이상 있습니다. 각 F-35 편대에 로컬 노드입니다. 분류 된 항공기 관련 데이터의 흐름을 지원하는 분류 된 SOU와 분류되지 않은 항공기 관련 데이터의 흐름을 지원하는 분류되지 않은 SOU의 두 가지 유형이 있습니다.
  • PMD (휴대용 메모리 장치). PMD는 F-35 조종사가 임무 계획 데이터와 같은 정보를 업로드하는 데 사용하는 비공식적으로 "벽돌"이라고합니다. F-35 요원은 PMD를 사용하여 비행 중에 생성 된 임무 및 유지 관리 데이터를 저장 한 다음 ALIS SOU에 다운로드하여 유지 관리 및 임무보고 활동을 지원합니다.
  • PMD 리더 (Portable Memory Device Reader). PMD 리더는 휴대용 메모리 장치에서 건강 관련 코드를 포함한 유지 관리 데이터를 제거하고 SOU에로드하는 데 사용되는 장치입니다. • PMA (Portable Maintenance Aid). PMA는 F-35 유지 보수 담당자와 비행선 감독관이 분류되지 않은 기술 데이터를보고 유지 보수 활동을 수행 및 문서화하기 위해 사용하는 분류되지 않은 견고한 노트북입니다.
[URL unfurl = "true"] https://www.gao.gov/assets/710/705154.pdf [/ URL]
Finland also seems to be very concerned about this problem with the F-35. The Finnish Air Force is a small air force and they will want to distribute their fighters to multiple air bases rather than one, which would cost enormous amounts of money to build the F-35 related infrastructure at each air base. This will definitely serve as a negative factor in the MX Challenge.
Suomi varautuu satojen miljoonien eurojen rakennustöihin uusien hävittäjien tullessa: rahan käyttökohteet hämärän peitossa - Suomenkuvalehti.fi
 
  • Agree
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