LOC Flare up: Related news and Discussions

Parul

Red Devil
Dec 2, 2017
1,231
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Voronezh
Three Army soldiers martyred by Indian firing across LoC: ISPR

RAWALPINDI: Three Pakistan Army soldiers were martyred on Monday as Indian forces opened fire along the Line of Control, said a statement by the Inter-Services Public Relations.

The incident of firing occurredin theRakhchikri sector of the LoC.

One other soldier was injured in the unprovoked incident of firing by Indian troops.

Incidents of firing from across the border have increased after the right-wing government of Narendra Modi came to power and has caused significant material and human loss.

Indian forces have used medium and heavy weapons in recent times to target the civilian population of AJK and Army posts built along the LoC.

Pakistan's top civilian and military leadership has expressed serious concerns over repeated violations by India of the ceasefire agreement along the LoC.

Earlier in the month, two civilians were martyred after Indian forces opened fire on a funeral procession.

In November, the army chief and Prime Minister Shahid Khaqan Abbasi visited the LoC and condemned the unprofessional approach by Indian forces.

Another soldier of the Army was martyred in the same area of the LoC in September when Indian troops targeted civilian population with heavy weapons.

A patrol team of Pakistan Army, assisting evacuation of civilians, came under fire from across the LoC, which resulted in the martyrdom of Naib Subedar Nadeem and injuries to three other soldiers.

Three Army soldiers martyred by Indian firing across LoC: ISPR

Rest In Peace Soldiers! :(

@Avi @Aashish Can we have Sticky Thread about 'Loc Flares' between India-Pakistan? You might make changes to the Title Accordingly or if we already have a thread, point me towards it.

Edit: Or, I shall Post in this thread:

Kashmir : Counter Terror Operation Updates and Discussions
 

Srinivas

RED BERET
Dec 6, 2017
70
83
bangalore
Pakistani organised a total staged-for-camera drama. PR win for Pakistan which did little for the family.

Pakistan - 2
India - 0.

How is Pakistan 2 and India 0?

Do you believe what ISPR says?

Or you believe there are people who believe Pakistan Rona?
 
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nair

nair
Staff member
Administrator
Nov 30, 2017
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They do hide casualties, officially they say it’s to protect morale
Well question is whose morale???? Not soldiers for sure.... you cannot hide it from those who fights in LoC... as they are well connected..... but if you are talking about the morale of PA fanboys then yes.....

They did not even bothered to answer their parliament quarry on casualties
 

Guynextdoor

Banned
Dec 19, 2017
3,698
1,032
India
Well question is whose morale???? Not soldiers for sure.... you cannot hide it from those who fights in LoC... as they are well connected..... but if you are talking about the morale of PA fanboys then yes.....

They did not even bothered to answer their parliament quarry on casualties

I find several of these policies retrograde. Did you know that pa can legally take the whole family of suspected militants into custody?
 
Dec 25, 2017
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Pakistan
They do hide casualties, officially they say it’s to protect morale
Martyrdom in Pakistan is considered celebratory. Sweets are distributed throughout the whole village/neighborhood, feasts are held and songs/poems are sung in praise of the martyr. It brings great honor to family, clan and tribe and is never forgotten.

Our attitudes are different to yours when it comes to this topic, casualties don't affect our morale. I definitely think it does the opposite, whenever there are a series of casualties either civilian or military it hikes national unity and fury against the perpetrators.
 
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Guynextdoor

Banned
Dec 19, 2017
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Martyrdom in Pakistan is considered celebratory. Sweets are distributed throughout the whole village/neighborhood, feasts are held and songs/poems are sung in praise of the martyr. It brings great honor to family, clan and tribe and is never forgotten.

Our attitudes are different to yours when it comes to this topic, casualties don't affect our morale. I definitely think it does the opposite, whenever there are a series of casualties either civilian or military it hikes national unity and fury against the perpetrators.

I was quoting your army’s official line. We too consider martyrdom celebratory which is why at any time you till have an accurate statistic of how many people embraced it
 

_Anonymous_

Senior Member
Dec 4, 2017
12,354
8,906
Mumbai
and what evidence is there to back your claims? I could say the same for Indians.


Army’s refusal to share LoC casualty stats irks Rabbani - The Express Tribune


Even if the GoI wants to suppress casualties among civilians or the armed forces on the LoC or in J&K a robust opposition and a free press will prevent that .

This is underpinned by a robust if raucous democratic tradition , a subservient armed forces a free press and an independent and strong judiciary . None of the listed factors are present and if present is certainly not robust enough in Pakistan today .Not robust enough is being charitable . Its in far worse shape than what we'd like to believe and what you will acknowledge publicly .

The recent shenanigans concerning the Barelvi Tehreek e Labaik group with respect to Khatm e Nabuwat was witnessed by the whole world
 
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Dec 25, 2017
51
35
Pakistan
Army’s refusal to share LoC casualty stats irks Rabbani - The Express Tribune


Even if the GoI wants to suppress casualties among civilians or the armed forces on the LoC or in J&K a robust opposition and a free press will prevent that .

This is underpinned by a robust of raucous democratic tradition , a subservient armed forces a free press and an independent and strong judiciary . None of the listed factors are present and if present is certainly not robust enough in Pakistan today .Not robust enough is being charitable . Its in far worse shape than what we'd like to believe and what you will acknowledge publicly .

The recent shenanigans concerning the Barelvi Tehreek e Labaik group with respect to Khatm e Nabuwat was witnessed by the whole world
It's mutual.
Over 4,500 soldiers killed along LoC in Pak firing since 2001: Army

Darve said, “Ever since the Uri terror attack in September, there has been much noise around the ongoing ceasefire violations. I filed the RTI to understand what the armed forces have faced in the last few years since Kargil (conflict). The figures are shocking and indicate that we lose our jawans more frequently in ceasefire violations than we are told. I plan to write to the government to make all these instances known to the people.”

It's not unusual, casualties are sometimes reported later on as reporting a casualty right away with the time and location is a valuable intel for your enemies.
 

_Anonymous_

Senior Member
Dec 4, 2017
12,354
8,906
Mumbai
It's mutual.
Over 4,500 soldiers killed along LoC in Pak firing since 2001: Army

Darve said, “Ever since the Uri terror attack in September, there has been much noise around the ongoing ceasefire violations. I filed the RTI to understand what the armed forces have faced in the last few years since Kargil (conflict). The figures are shocking and indicate that we lose our jawans more frequently in ceasefire violations than we are told. I plan to write to the government to make all these instances known to the people.”

It's not unusual, casualties are sometimes reported later on as reporting a casualty right away with the time and location is a valuable intel for your enemies.

Its not . The PA refused to part with info . That's what the article I've quoted from The Express Tribune is all about . A fact unthinkable here in India where as I've explained earlier the armed forces are subservient to the civilian leadership .

Whereas what you've quoted from sources are common men accessing info through the RTI - Right To Information . Does such a mechanism exist in Pakistan ? Can you sincerely tell us of any civilian accessing such info through such an act as the RTI from the PA or the Senate ?

Furthermore , your army if it so chooses can also declare casualties with details of the sector in which it occurs as well like this news report from yesterday by the ToI -
J&K: Army Major, 3 soldiers killed in firing by Pakistan along LoC - Times of India

What you're bandying about - the PA delaying release of such information for fear of not giving out sensitive info w.r.t their location - are excuses .

Your nation is subservient to your army not the other way around and what happened with the meeting of Lt CDR Jadhav with his family was an opportunity for pure propoganda on behalf of the PA which it did want to miss .

On the one hand an impression is sought to be created that the Pakistan state is a responsible & reasonable one which lets someone like Lt CDR Jadhav who's accused of serious crimes attracting capital punishment like espionage meet up with his family while 3 of their soldiers were martyred whereas India never allowed any such gesture for Ajmal Kasab accused in the 26/11 case and OTOH is being the aggressor by upping the ante along the LoC .That is the narrative of the Pakistan state.


How much of it is for domestic consumption and how much of it is for international consumption is not hard to see as at the moment except for China there are no serious takers for either Pakistan or its narrative among nations whose influence in world affairs matter..
 
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bonobashi

Well-Known member
Dec 3, 2017
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@_Anonymous_
@nair
@Talwar e Pakistan

Gentlemen, we are all of us aware that the conditions that we face are unique on either side of the border. There is no point in using Pakistani criteria of judging and evaluating information to matter coming from the Indian side, nor in using Indian criteria on matter coming from the Pakistani side. The sooner we acknowledge this simple fact the better for our mutual relations.

One of the inhibiting factors for @Talwar e Pakistan might be a sense that this is in some ways an Indian forum. However, he must have felt by now the very light touch of the managers; at worst, he might have crossed swords with a particularly forceful member. Personally, I find the religious fanatics difficult to deal with, but am sure that the situation will ease off very shortly.

Let us give them time, and give ourselves time.
 

_Anonymous_

Senior Member
Dec 4, 2017
12,354
8,906
Mumbai
@_Anonymous_
@nair
@Talwar e Pakistan

Gentlemen, we are all of us aware that the conditions that we face are unique on either side of the border. There is no point in using Pakistani criteria of judging and evaluating information to matter coming from the Indian side, nor in using Indian criteria on matter coming from the Pakistani side. The sooner we acknowledge this simple fact the better for our mutual relations.

One of the inhibiting factors for @Talwar e Pakistan might be a sense that this is in some ways an Indian forum. However, he must have felt by now the very light touch of the managers; at worst, he might have crossed swords with a particularly forceful member. Personally, I find the religious fanatics difficult to deal with, but am sure that the situation will ease off very shortly.

Let us give them time, and give ourselves time.

"Blessed Are The Peacemakers , For They Shall Be Called The Sons Of God ."
 

RATHORE

Lion of Rajputana
Dec 2, 2017
1,552
1,949
USA
Pakistan itself admits 3 killed, 1 grievously injured. And the Indian side basically confirms it was a cross border raid. And considering the fact that Pakistan always underreports casualties, I'm sure it was one hell of a revenge raid. Pakistan can play this game if it wants, we'll always play it better.

 
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