Taliban wants positive relationship with India, welcomes New Delhi's contribution in Afghanistan

Ever heard of the quote, birds of same feather flock to together. They say different things but have the same goal. You can obviously categorize them according to your whims & fancies like shia, sunni, moderate,conservative, liberal.. ....etc for your convenience but the end result is same.

" Some are literally bored teens, disaffected youth etc. others religious hardliners and some just in it for the money. They aren't in any way homogeneous."

Seriously this is most dangerous assumption ppl in west can have and treat it just as another passing socio-economic problem. It is like saying if the monkeys had bananas instead of AK-47 they would have behaved well.

These ppl havent been like this for decade or two but for centuries together. If money could solve the problem then countries like SA should have been beacons of human rights instead of being primitive fanatics.
They have a core who have goals but a lot of them don't. It's like assuming that everyone in the US military understands the geopolitical and strategic objectives of the US government. I never said it was a socio-economic problem.

One century is how long it has existed to be more precise, it was the founders of Saudi Arabia who brought it about, it then branched off.
 
Not all Bin Laden's folk think/thought alike, just as not all Taliban folk think alike. Some are literally bored teens, disaffected youth etc. others religious hardliners and some just in it for the money. They aren't in any way homogeneous.
Yeah but from what I've understood most average muslims hate ISIS and consider them Israeli dogs. Even the more fundamentalist salafist muslims consider ISIS as fake muslims and would even call them Kafirs/kuffars. This is vastly different to the fact that the average muslim will sympathize with the Taliban and al Qaeda. Also the brutality shown by ISIS during their syrian stint was not according to the Qu'ran which also made a lot of muslims hate ISIS. It's vastly different to how the average muslims view the Taliban or Al-Qaeda or any othe r sunni terrorist groups..
 
They have a core who have goals but a lot of them don't. It's like assuming that everyone in the US military understands the geopolitical and strategic objectives of the US government. I never said it was a socio-economic problem.

One century is how long it has existed to be more precise, it was the founders of Saudi Arabia who brought it about, it then branched off.
Islamic extremist thought has always existed way before the Saudis. It has existed since the founding of Islam in Mecca and Medina. The Christians were also as radical. The Spanish and Portuguese during the reconquista and inquisitions and most of Europe during the crusades. And in general Christians have also shown similar levels of intolerance as muslims the difference is Renaissance reformed christianity to quite an extent. Islam never experienced there reformation. Saudis just mainstreamed their thought among other muslim ethnic groups..
 
Some are literally bored teens, disaffected youth etc. others religious hardliners and some just in it for the money. They aren't in any way homogeneous.

The muslims in arab countries are not same as muslims in south asian countries.
 
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Islamic extremist thought has always existed way before the Saudis. It has existed since the founding of Islam in Mecca and Medina. The Christians were also as radical. The Spanish and Portuguese during the reconquista and inquisitions and most of Europe during the crusades. And in general Christians have also shown similar levels of intolerance as muslims the difference is Renaissance reformed christianity to quite an extent. Islam never experienced there reformation. Saudis just mainstreamed their thought among other muslim ethnic groups..
Exactly most of the religions/countries/groups have over a period of time progressed ahead, some amount of reformation has take place gradually over period of time. Some of it due to their own making and then by having more contact with other cultures. One of the problems I see is that other than religion there is nothing to fallback on.
 
The muslims in arab countries are not same as muslims in south asian countries.
Not all ISIS members are even from the locality they're operating in though.

Yeah but from what I've understood most average muslims hate ISIS and consider them Israeli dogs. Even the more fundamentalist salafist muslims consider ISIS as fake muslims and would even call them Kafirs/kuffars. This is vastly different to the fact that the average muslim will sympathize with the Taliban and al Qaeda. Also the brutality shown by ISIS during their syrian stint was not according to the Qu'ran which also made a lot of muslims hate ISIS. It's vastly different to how the average muslims view the Taliban or Al-Qaeda or any othe r sunni terrorist groups..
Well plenty of Salafist Muslims joined them in Syria. The term 'average' is very questionable when applied to Muslims, the spectrum is far too broad to classify anything as average. Depends how you interpret the Qu'ran too. Don't forget that Al-Quaeda is an off-shoot of the Soviet-Afghan War, as were the Taliban, so in a way they're more American-derived than ISIS is in terms of origins.

Islamic extremist thought has always existed way before the Saudis. It has existed since the founding of Islam in Mecca and Medina. The Christians were also as radical. The Spanish and Portuguese during the reconquista and inquisitions and most of Europe during the crusades. And in general Christians have also shown similar levels of intolerance as muslims the difference is Renaissance reformed christianity to quite an extent. Islam never experienced there reformation. Saudis just mainstreamed their thought among other muslim ethnic groups..
It has but the current brand - Salafism - is more clearly traceable to the birth of Saudi Arabia and started late 19th century but that was influenced by Wahhabism (18th century), which again goes back to the Hanbali school and then to Sunni.
 
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Not all ISIS members are even from the locality they're operating in though

India has threat from Pakistani backed Taliban and from IS because India's situation is similar to Israel. India doesnt not differentiate between good terrorists and bad terrorists. India is clear and knows the problem better than europeans. India has taken head on with the sponsoror of terrorism that's Pakistan. And India will hit there directly. No p*ssy games.

To be blunt If you use terrorist for your world conquering goals then you should also eliminate it once your job is complete. But US and Britain coalition has failed multiple times on crisis management and the aftermath. I thought English men are good administrators.

Money and capitalism is a fine thing but too much greed is not good for health because you never know what hits back. Pakistan along with Taliban are taking back a lot of arsenal what American and British forces have left there. This is insane. Only the iota of that arsenal is made defunct and a lot of it can be repaired.
 
India has threat from Pakistani backed Taliban and from IS because India's situation is similar to Israel. India doesnt not differentiate between good terrorists and bad terrorists. India is clear and knows the problem better than europeans. India has taken head on with the sponsoror of terrorism that's Pakistan. And India will hit there directly. No p*ssy games.

To be blunt If you use terrorist for your world conquering goals then you should also eliminate it once your job is complete. But US and Britain coalition has failed multiple times on crisis management and the aftermath. I thought English men are good administrators.

Money and capitalism is a fine thing but too much greed is not good for health because you never know what hits back. Pakistan along with Taliban are taking back a lot of arsenal what American and British forces have left there. This is insane. Only the iota of that arsenal is made defunct and a lot of it can be repaired.
The EU doesn't even differentiate between terrorists and slightly novel ethnic minorities.

Nobody in the west is using terrorists for world conquering goals. They're highly unpredictable and not very good at it.

Correct, we should have destroyed all that before we left, another good reason for drone strikes.
 
The EU doesn't even differentiate between terrorists and slightly novel ethnic minorities.

Nobody in the west is using terrorists for world conquering goals. They're highly unpredictable and not very good at it.

Correct, we should have destroyed all that before we left, another good reason for drone strikes.
Lost the element of surprise honestly. Now it's too late. A lot of newer powers are filling the void to assist the Taliban left by the west. Qatar,UAE,China ,Russia and Pakistan all thrive with the new Taliban.
Honestly it's a choice between the bad and worse.
The Northern Alliace guys had bachabazi while Taliban are just backward violent Islamist. Thought they seem to have matured quite a lot. The amount of sophisticated propaganda pakistan and the taliban are doing on twitter is far more impressive than we experienced during the post-balakot. Heck the entire narrative has been kinda hijacked by them..
 
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Lost the element of surprise honestly. Now it's too late. A lot of newer powers are filling the void to assist the Taliban left by the west. Qatar,UAE,China ,Russia and Pakistan all thrive with the new Taliban.
Honestly it's a choice between the bad and worse.
The Northern Alliace guys had bachabazi while Taliban are just backward violent Islamist. Thought they seem to have matured quite a lot. The amount of sophisticated propaganda pakistan and the taliban are doing on twitter is far more impressive than we experienced during the post-balakot. Heck the entire narrative has been kinda hijacked by them..
The problem is that moderate Muslims, if there is such a thing, never seem to fight for their country, or at least not as many of them.
 
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The amount of sophisticated propaganda pakistan and the taliban are doing on twitter is far more impressive than we experienced during the post-balakot. Heck the entire narrative has been kinda hijacked by them..
They have always been good at it & they dedicate a lot of resources not just human but financially as well. Why they succeed is consistency , they never change in spite of glaring evidence and loss of face. India on the other hand is reactive and wake up when everything is out of control.
Now the whole narrative abt taliban will shift to from how worst they were earlier and better they are now., they no longer shoot ppl in public but in private....of the media glare.
 

Most incompetent babus in Government of India are MEA officials.

These two news from foreign intel thread.
Kashmir al-Qaeda Wing Says Delhi Riots, Taliban Peace Agreement Have Energised Jihad
Kashmir al-Qaeda Wing Says Delhi Riots, Taliban Peace Agreement Have Energised Jihad
The statement comes amid mounting concerns that Taliban could offer safe havens to Kashmiri jihadist groups as the US withdraws from the region.

New Delhi: Last week’s agreement between the United States and the Taliban, as well as the communal violence in Delhi, have energised jihadists in Kashmir, al-Qaeda wing has said, hailing “these glorious times when the crusaders army in Khorasan have signed the final document of their defeat and in such a hopeful season when Indian Muslims have decided not to bear the atrocity and oppression of Hindu polytheist groups”.
The statement from Ansar Ghazwa’tul Hind, the Kashmir-based wing of al-Qaeda, was its first since the Government of India ended Kashmir’s special constitutional status in August.
The statement hailed the killing of ethnic-Kashmiri jihadists Jehangir Rafiq Wani Raja Umar Maqbool, Saadat Thokar, last month on the outskirts of Tral in southern Kashmir. “We give glad tidings to the ummah [Muslim nation] of the martyrdom of its sincere and loyal sons”.
In its statement, the jihadist group vows that it will “free the land of Kashmir from the Hindu polytheists, and will implement the shari’a law”. It also said it would continue fighting until the Masjid-e-Aqsa [in Jerusalem] and Babri Masjid are not free from kuffar [the unbelievers]”.
The statement comes amid mounting concerns that the Taliban could offer safe havens to Kashmiri jihadist groups as the United States withdraws from the region. The Taliban has long worked alongside al-Qaeda’s South Asian wing, led until last year by Indian-born jihadist Sana-ul-Haq, and the terms of its recent peace agreement with the United States do not require it to severe the relationship.
Even though al-Qaeda remains marginal in Kashmir’s jihadist landscape, there have been signs that its influence is growing among a section of young people, amid a cutback in Islamabad’s support for organisations like the Lashkar-e-Taiba and Jaish-e-Muhammad. In turn, organisations like the Hizb-ul-Mujahideen have claimed al-Qaeda is a front for India’s intelligence services, and a tool to divide the jihadist movement.
An estimated 2,500 people in Tral’s Drumbal village, local government sources said, attended three separate funeral prayers for slain jihadist Wani, led by local clerics Umar Lone and Ghulam Qadir. Wani is believed to have joined the Hizb-ul-Mujahideen in the summer of 2018, serving under the recently-slain commander Hammad Khan, before joining al-Qaeda some months ago.
Local residents also turned out in crowds of over 2,000, the sources said, for the burials of Umar Maqbool Bhat and Sadat Ahmad Thoker, both of whom also had two rounds of funeral rites, led by local clerics and their families.
“These crowds aren’t huge compared to the tens of thousands who have come out on some occasions in the past”, an intelligence official observed, “but they do reflect an undercurrent of sympathy for jihadists, which is a cause for concern”.
In September, Shi’a residents of Budgam, who were allowed to march to commemorate the martyrdom of the Imam Ali Ibn Abi Talib, the grandson of the Prophet Muhammad, shouted slogans hailing the memory of the Ansar Ghazwa’tul Hind jihadist Zakir Ahmed Bhat, also known as Zakir Musa.
Even though Bhat was part of al-Qaeda—which, as an affiliate of the al-Qaeda, views Shi'as as heretics, and had been responsible for a series of genocidal attacks on them — he was valourised as a hero who fought Hindu hegemony.
Zakir Rashid Bhat, an engineering college dropout, had founded al-Qaeda’s Kashmir unit in the summer of 2017. In one video, Bhat appeared under the al-Qaeda banner, accusing Indian Muslims of cowardice, and calling on them to engage in jihad against the government.
Then in July, 2017, al-Qaeda had announced the formation of the Ansar Ghazwa’tul Hind, saying, “The jihad in Kashmir has reached a stage of awakening as the Muslim nation of Kashmir has committed to carry the flag of jihad to repel the aggression of tyrant Indian invaders”.
From its outset, al-Qaeda’s Kashmir wing sought to distinguish itself from other jihadist groups, saying it would focus on high-value targets across India. In December 2017, South Asia-region al-Qaeda chief Usama Mehmood argued that the key to victory in Kashmir lay in attacking Indian cities.
“India is already using 6,00,000 troops just to hold on to Kashmir,” Mehmood said in a statement. “If it is attacked in Kolkata, Bengaluru and New Delhi, it will come to its senses and release its grip on Kashmir”
.
Then in February 2018, Zakir Bhat called for targeting “companies which are associated with the Government of India, or those foreign companies which have invested or wish to invest in India".
However, last month’s encounter, intelligence sources said, indicated that Ansar Ghazwat’ul Hind’s ambitions and capacities. Notably, an official pointed out, Ansar Ghazwa’tul Hind faced problems acquiring weapons, since the three men between them possessed only two Kalashnikov assault rifles, a pistol, and some 50 rounds of ammunition.
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Altough some facts in the above article are disoriented but not very far for actual situation on ground. Pulwama was just a tip of an iceberg of what could actually happen, if India still stays bureaucratic dealing with Pakistan. All these AD, JS and all will one day doom India because of their lethargic policies. I am more pointing towards Home Ministry, MEA and Indian military especially airforce.

None of them are master in Islamic studies, or geostrategy except for Doval who has actually worked on the land and know Islam and psychology of people in Pakistan and Afghanistan inside out. I get a relief when I hear CDS is Gen Rawat and NSA a Ajit Doval , Shah and Modi and Yogi. But same time there are many backstabbers in the hierarchy as well who are incompetent and do not have a pinch of idea what could may happen.

Reason: Their families sons and kids are abroad. They have no sensitivity towards Indian security which is itself a threat.

Edit: These are all ISI mouth pieces, who are actually looking for funding to create trouble in India. This also means that Pakistan's economy is not directly involved, the money is all abroad and this is a call for funding. The ISI is trying to involve as much as people to trouble Indians.

India is only giving time to and opportunity to Pakistan and others to destabilize growing India. Pakistanis will not learn due to their extremists ideology and they will always get provoked either by Chinese or others and sell themselves only to hurt India and Indian interests.

No matter how much diplomacy you, do no country will ever want one more competetor like India to come into world economics. And thus all this unrest.

100 Pakistan mercenaries in Syria to fight on behalf of Turkey, says US journalist
Pakistani Shia mercenaries Pakistan have earlier fought in Syria on behalf of Iran, but this will be the first time its nationals collaborate with Turkey in the war-torn country.
Snehesh Alex Philip 2 March, 2020 6:36 pm IST


New Delhi: A batch of 100 Pakistani mercenaries has landed in war-torn Syria to fight alongside the Turkey-backed Free Syrian Army (FSA), with more expected to come in the near future, ThePrint has learnt.

Sources in the Indian defence establishment said they were trying to find out more about the development.
The fact that Pakistani mercenaries have landed in Syria has been revealed by Lindsey Snell, an American journalist who has covered the nine-year-long-and-counting Syrian war.

Snell, who has reportedly been abducted by an al-Qaida affiliate and even jailed by Turkey, told ThePrint that the information was given to her by a “source in the FSA”.

According to her source, she said, a total of 1,400 Pakistani mercenaries are to join the Turkish-backed group, which is one of the many non-government militias involved in the Syrian civil war.

Snell, however, added that the information had not been independently verified.

The Syrian civil war started in 2011 over concerns such as employment, corruption and democracy but has since transformed into a chaotic conflict involving multiple entities and nations. It is estimated to have killed over 3.6 lakh people until December 2018.

The FSA is one of multiple opposition forces involved in the war, each of them driven by different agendas. Different groups involved in the war are backed by different countries, with Turkish support for the FSA primarily aimed at keeping a Kurdish militia in check in light of a decades-long insurgency at home.

If Pakistan mercenaries have indeed entered Syria, it will not be the first time they play a role in the West Asian nation. In the past, several have fought under the Hezbollah flag, backed by Iran.

“There is a Zainebiyoun militia of Pakistani Shias deployed by Iran in Syria. We are looking into this new development involving Turkey and Pakistan,” a source in the security establishment said.

Sources added that the use of mercenaries in support of Turkey could not have occurred without the blessings of the Pakistani deep state — the ISI.
It remains unclear whether the mercenaries in question are drawn from terror groups backed by the ISI or former servicemen.

There are several organisations that recruit former and current Pakistani soldiers as well as civilians to work in security-related jobs in West Asia, where they play a role similar to personnel of the US’ controversial Blackwater private security firm, the Washington-based think-tank Middle East Media Research Institute had said in 2011 while talking about Pakistan’s mercenary business.

Pakistan also formally sent its troops to ally Saudi Arabia, which backs some opposition fighters in Syria (rival Iran supports the Bashar al-Assad administration) on a “training and advice mission” in 2018.

Former Pakistan Army chief General Raheel Sharif (Retd) commands the Saudi-led Islamic military alliance to fight terrorism.
100 Pakistan mercenaries in Syria to fight on behalf of Turkey, says US journalist
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This is the penetration of ISI into islamic world, they are front players. They can divert all their resources into India via Nepal and create trouble and this is exactly they will do. Remember after Af-Soviet war, they diverted all the resources into Kashmir.

India really has to tighten their pants. This is not going to be easy the way it seems. Because through Pakistanis, the west also gets an access into Islamic world.

In No way a diplomacy can really work, no matter what you do. They have been trying hard to get access into shia muslims and manipulate, same they will do in India as well. Pakistanis have be the main interlocutors between Saudi Aran, Iran and Iraq. They are trying to create a Bagdhdad pact type of block and use it against India.

And India can't even get any news out POJK or spot jet shot by IAF. Whatever is happening is inside Indian Kashmir not theirs. And they have created Nooristan/khorsan and Zehdan as their buffers.

And babus in Indian establishment are watching Kapil sharma show.
 
Our conduct in this entire fiasco has been shameful. Zero Principles and now Panjshir is collapsing.

We can't do anything since Afghanistan is landlocked. Any forces we send will be at the mercy of Iran. They change their minds on a whim and our forces get stranded, we won't even be able to get supplies to them.

Quite literally, our only option to help Afghanistan is to go through Pakistan.

This is completely America's fault.
 
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We can't do anything since Afghanistan is landlocked. Any forces we send will be at the mercy of Iran. They change their minds on a whim and our forces get stranded, we won't even be able to get supplies to them.

Quite literally, our only option to help Afghanistan is to go through Pakistan.

This is completely America's fault.
Today's situation is two decades in the making. US was always going to leave, Iraq was a clear giveaway. What did Indian agencies do other than hanging on to US coat tails? Add to that the breather India gave to Pakistan on the borders.

Let's face it, Post Narsimha Rao, most of the dispensations have demonstrated zero clues of strategic affairs. For the past decade and a half neither could we secure direct logistics through chabahar, neither could we convince America of direct military advisors from India within Afghanistan, we couldn't even convince US from not abandoning Drone strikes in Pakistan which was extremely effective. We gave up on Russian hedge to ensure Panshir and NA could have fall back defences.


Absolutely Pathetic.
 
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We can't do anything since Afghanistan is landlocked. Any forces we send will be at the mercy of Iran. They change their minds on a whim and our forces get stranded, we won't even be able to get supplies to them.

Quite literally, our only option to help Afghanistan is to go through Pakistan.

This is completely America's fault.
You are partially right, but India with its resources & size can do more. Its simply our govts whichever in power lacked substance to take decisions or creativity to approach a problem in a different manner. They neither have ideas nor have the political will to commit resources for long term strategy.
 
Today's situation is two decades in the making. US was always going to leave, Iraq was a clear giveaway. What did Indian agencies do other than hanging on to US coat tails? Add to that the breather India gave to Pakistan on the borders.

Let's face it, Post Narsimha Rao, most of the dispensations have demonstrated zero clues of strategic affairs. For the past decade and a half neither could we secure direct logistics through chabahar, neither could we convince America of direct military advisors from India within Afghanistan, we couldn't even convince US from not abandoning Drone strikes in Pakistan which was extremely effective. We gave up on Russian hedge to ensure Panshir and NA could have fall back defences.


Absolutely Pathetic.
Frankly India simply does not behave like a power thats need to be reckoned with. Minus the resources our foreign policy is comparable to some small inconsequential country . Either we are totally inward looking or absolutely pathetic in long term strategy.

This whole idea of keeping arms length distance from the issues is good until the danger comes home. India will wake up when pakistan starts diverting those experienced taliban fighters to kashmir. Only good thing is that we are better prepared this time compared to 90's.

If not material at least we should certainly provide tactical support like intelligence, we certainly have satellites that can do the job.

I am sure US will cut & run from south east asia in another 20 years and India will be left wondering what is happening.
 
Today's situation is two decades in the making. US was always going to leave, Iraq was a clear giveaway. What did Indian agencies do other than hanging on to US coat tails? Add to that the breather India gave to Pakistan on the borders.

Let's face it, Post Narsimha Rao, most of the dispensations have demonstrated zero clues of strategic affairs. For the past decade and a half neither could we secure direct logistics through chabahar, neither could we convince America of direct military advisors from India within Afghanistan, we couldn't even convince US from not abandoning Drone strikes in Pakistan which was extremely effective. We gave up on Russian hedge to ensure Panshir and NA could have fall back defences.


Absolutely Pathetic.

No, no one expected the US to leave the way they did. Hell, not even the Pentagon. What India did was correct in its response. We didn't want to create an environment in Afghanistan which would help unite the factions within Pakistan, and create new problems for both the US and India. Both TTP and Islamic State were working against Pakistan and we didn't want to solve this problem for the Pakistanis. Biden screwed up, big time.

As for Chabahar, as per GoI, it was Iran. They kicked us out of their new gas fields, and then they decided to go slow on Chabahar as well. People wrongly assume we went slow on Chabahar, but it's the opposite. It was both in India's and America's interest for India to develop Chabahar.

As for Russia, they seem to be doing their own thing. We didn't have access from their side anyway.

And we can't teleport.

You are partially right, but India with its resources & size can do more. Its simply our govts whichever in power lacked substance to take decisions or creativity to approach a problem in a different manner. They neither have ideas nor have the political will to commit resources for long term strategy.

It has nothing to do with will or resources. Even if you do consider resources, we don't have the resources or capability to send troops outside India. At best we can only do special forces operations, but that's not enough, and it's obvious even the US wouldn't have allowed such operations anyway. When there's a will, there's a way doesn't apply to geography.

You guys are forgetting the dynamics at play here. India cannot do anything in Afghanistan without the US, and the US cannot do anything without Pakistan. And Pakistan's assistance came with the caveat that India is not allowed to get involved. Have you guys already forgotten how Pakistan held NATO supplies at ransom a few years ago? Had Pakistan chosen Taliban over the US in 2001, then we would have been playing in Afghanistan as well, having started off with both the Americans and Indians invading Pakistan.