Two words! Eastern-Europeans! They have some really good folks in Belarus, Ukraine etc.
Pradhanmantri Pakoda Rozgar Yojna
- Thread starter BlackOpsIndia
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Who is going to skill them? Why are not those colleges funded to impart quality? Why focus major chunk of education budget only on IIT and IIM which are already swelling with funds due to strong alumni network.
Why not spend on those colleges on which majority study and need funds most. If you ever see the education budget its do badly skewed to higher institutions that normal colleges are completely left out.
No matter how fancy it sounds in saying min government max governance govt still affect every sphere of everyday life. Forget focusing on quality they are busy in creating controversies, if a bunch of students can hold any institution ransom what good are those 282 MP for? There is literally no movement in education beside boasting speeches and grandstanding.
Personally speaking the IT sector along with the pharma sector are super skilled ones . We're meandering away from the crux of the issue . This thread was about Everyman - the ordinary graduate with a B.Com / B.Sc / B.A. degree and their employment prospects . Engineers will be employed eventually based on their knowledge , skill sets , aptitude and of course their marksheets and the Institute they've graduated from .
No Sir. You are overlooking the real problem. My example is just a sampler and it precisely explains what the real issue is. BTW, what kind of skill sets do you believe these engineers have? How many of them can actually write even a basic program?? If they can't do programming, what exactly shall we hire them for?
Most of these low tech IT jobs will literally vanish over next 5 years. AI is being deployed at a rapid pace and unless Indian engineers re skill themselves, will simply loose their jobs. No Modi or Rahul can save these people.
You know, I hate to blow my own horn but thats the best reference point I have.
Hi! Pleasure to make acquaintance! Myself Shajida Khan! I started out as a college student trying to major in General Studies. However, I found no one is hiring anything any-Study. So here is what I did. I took MIT 18.02 on youtube. I got no credits of-course! Then I took 18.06 Linear algebra again on MIT OpencourseWare. I hate maths now seriously, however it was still better than being un-employable. Then I took Andrew Ng's introduction to ML with certificate. I trawled entire Seattle for an internship in an AI related firm but it got nowhere. Finally I found one in Vancouver. Oh well! Now I shuttle between two cities every now and then. I got shit job of labelling training sets in the beginning. But they have put me in a new project starting summer for building a world-class model of counterfiet detection based on Faster R-CNNs. If I complete it successfully, it will be a hard experience enough to get me a job in this field.
Now tell me, how do I get sympathy for any MOFO who thinks that they are entitled for a well paying bank job -- which are soon to be history! Or any engineer who cann't write a FizzBuzz program!
You are still not getting it, who gives them degree? Who monitor those colleges? If govt of India institutions are declaring them pass who is at fault?
AICTE UGC under whose control are they? Every college is struggling for faculty, if they need 20 govt hire 2 rest 8 are filled by ad hoc to avoid paying salary and 10 are never filled.
This is the situation when tax collection is at record high, tax base is at all time high and economy is at all time high. When everyone is struggling for funds where is all that money going? What is it if not making mess of education? Who is responsible? You set a standard and the students responsibilty is it to clear it, when they are doing it and it's still not enough don't you think problem is with that standard and the one setting n monitoring it?
Nothing you said wrong. On the contrary.
OK, let me explain.
From 1988 to 1995, I was an independent; largely a choice born out of sheer anger at the organisation that wouldn't listen to me screaming as loud as anyone could that the B20 was too advanced to sell in this country, and we needed a UNIX box (six months after I quit, they brought in the U6000). During the first year, I taught myself (with some help from IISc friends) software programming. Afterwards, I made programmes for small clinics and hospitals with multiple sites, who needed to pull together their data, track excess cash, plan where to deploy resources, and how to divert patients and not lose them due to lack of capacity at one point while they had excess at other locations. Beyond a point, I couldn't do it alone; one reason being that after working in Pascal, I hated working in DBase and FoxPro and that kind of shit, and I wasn't too enamoured of either C or the rapidly onrushing C++. So, inevitably, I started hiring students straight from college.
It took me three months or more to work with them on analysis and design (nothing fancy; we still weren't using object oriented equivalents, I did most of my work manually due to lack of funds and therefore lack of a design tool). These were engineers from the best colleges in Bangalore and Hyderabad. The deal was straightforward; I paid them chump change, but they got a thorough grounding, exposure to live development, and, even more important, testing, that NO college taught them, and a fair chance of getting to a decent job.
I live in Hyderabad now. Two weeks ago, there was a strange phone call; the caller was teasing me refusing to identify himself, but clearly knew me very, very well. It was rattling. Finally, it turned out to be one of those kids. He was now a COO in a big name in IT, earning in a couple of months what I would be glad to earn in a year. I checked on the batch of eight of them who had come in together; each of them was set and doing very well indeed, thank you very much.
It's the bringing up to date, practical exposure to business and learning to work in a team, and to work in a process-rich environment that the kids lacked, when they left college.
Five years ago, having nursed an aging parent through his last years, I found myself dead broke and on the wrong side of a retirement age, with nothing to fall back upon. A lucky chance got me a teaching assignment and plunged me into four years of hell.
At the IIM, earlier in a premier college that kind of out-Ivy Leagued Ivy League, I was used to fierce peer pressure to know, and to be rigorous applying knowledge to a problem, I was used to working unusual hours to get a job done, I was used to gauging when competition was appropriate and when to sink differences to work towards common goals. Now, on the other side, teaching, I found the ghastly truth about teaching.
My colleagues (in B Schools, both times) were NOT interested in the Indian business situation. They were clear; they had their PhD, they had paid their dues and learning was over. They concentrated on teaching exactly what they had been taught, nothing more and on maintaining their ivory tower positions against any enemy action, such as, for instance, student panic at not getting jobs. I worked out, through my personal network, teams to support both the engineering and management faculties, to sit with them and to tweak the syllabus from time to time to update it, and to keep us relevant. Nobody was interested; least of all the VC in either of the two places I worked.
The Indian education system is broken, both at an operational and at a philosophical level. The kind of junk that comes into posts is a symptom of that fatal lack of viability of the system; we have literate people who are uneducated, employed people who cannot comprehend a simple issue or elementary wording, we have the detritus of an industrial failure parading around giving themselves airs because they are better off than the millions who have no jobs, no houses, no clothes, no food, no prospects.
So when I read your post, I nearly wept. As a race, we come out last in TShirt sloganeering; compared to other Indians, we cannot Keep Calm and Whatever; genetically, it is a proven fact that we cannot keep calm. I am no exception, and that is why I felt utterly defeated. Don't get me wrong; your posts are generally sensible and well-crafted. But if you take a 360 deg. view of the forum, do you feel that there is no reason to burst into tears? I have twelve on my ignore list, having just substituted a quarrelsome and utterly dense woman for a cynical, wise-cracking, smart-talking shallow fribble, who is still at least readable. But on this thread and another, there are enough bigots and crude, bad-smelling, bad-thinking, badly equipped mountain trolls picking snot out and tasting it to sicken any sensitised observer.
I don't know what I'm doing here, to be honest.
Why the laughter? The food's good. I've tasted it, and ballooned from 85 kgs to 105.
You don't need to have any sympathy, you are not the person responsible for it that's why govt is elected.
There are no free lunches, true, but you cant get a free pass for your incompetence by blaming it on others. Britishers were over thrown cuz they didn't let us have a "responsible govt." If the govt is still not responsible for anything what was this whole process for?
You are right. IT, Pharma, Aerospace etc are indeed placed at the top of job market and require certain skill sets. But since they are relatively well paying jobs, they create a number of indirect jobs. The real estate boom in cities like Bangalore, Chennai, Hyderabad etc were driven mostly by IT sector. So are the other services like restaurants, salons, apparel stores, automobiles, hospitals etc. So when these top sectors go down due to lack of skills, other sectors are immediately affected.
Most of the BA/BSc grads employed in the services sectors and require some amount of soft skills. The missing skill set issue is not only present in IT sector, it's there everywhere. Starting from waiters at restaurants to car salesmen, you can clearly observe lack of professionalism. It's mostly an attitude problem and can't be solved by any government. People who want to go up will advance in their carrier, others will simply crib.
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You missed the point! Technology atleast or skills in general are moving so much so fast that you cann't deal with them at a policy level. You will have to delegate it to the rank and file, the last line. ie Student. I am sorry but that is how you can deal with the present world. Keep your eyes open and look for opportunities. It won't come from government anymore.
If you draw a lens from Riga to Istanbul, about a 100 kms apart at the widest point, it will contain 70 to 80% of the available talent in eastern Europe. Check it out.
The advantage in India is that you can set up a strong, robust team in a matter of weeks. For Liberty Mutual, it proved possible to drag together a (nearly) 300 strong crew of mainframe programmers in 15 weeks. In Hungary, which I know from having worked there, the biggest shops were Nokia, Ericsson, Siemens and I forget who else; they were all 500 or 600 strong. I had 25 brilliant Hungarians, TCS had 60 odd. In 2006, I went back there en famille for a visit, and the TCS manager was sitting there, looking doleful. I drew his wife aside and asked her with concern what was wrong. Had he been released? Not that; it was the other way around. They were 350 strong, and he had just been called to HQ and told that they had to grow to 600!! Hungary then was 10 million people, less than the size of a mammoth, sprawling Indian mega-city; where do you think you will get the people? At that time, Turks were available at some dreadful low competitive busting prices, but nobody was sure how to do business there, except Thomson, and everybody waited for somebody else to make the first move.
And, of course, nobody wanted to go to Russia.
Again , you focus on the service sector . That sector will take care of itself . The issue lies in the other 2 sectors - agriculture which is neglected and manufacturing where to be honest we've missed the bus . Those 10 years under the UPA , in retrospect , has proved to be more damaging than anything we've had in the past.
I focussed on services sector, since it generates approx 54% of India's GDP while employing only 31% of population. I don't see any future regarding agriculture. I come from a family of farmers and understand the ground level issues reasonably well.
The best way to help farmers is to provide them jobs in service sector and if possible, in manufacturing. Establishing manufacturing plants take time and it's a medium term solution. It will take at least 10 years for manufacturing sector to increase any significant number of employment. BTW we have not missed the bus. Yes we missed the bus of 90s and then again in 2000s. But China is getting expensive and Asian countries are grabbing some of the opportunities in this segment. See how Bangadesh is number one garment exporter now!! If government can solve logistics, taxation, finance and labor issues, India can still be competitive. Current government is working on first three issues. I hope they bring reforms in labor laws as well.
How is US dealing with it? Is it not policy that created Ivy League even when the students are not so bright at primary level? Yeah talent across the globe do add to reputation but majority is still US students. I think it is well established that Indian kids are better at primary level than US counterpart even after a fcked up system. How come they lose it after having a head start?
I think the answer is at primary level there is ample of guidance and monitoring but at higher levels neither there is much guidance due to lack of faculty and infrastructure nor does a proper monitoring of how they are doing. Where they are lack, what do they need. Total indifference, live or die, this indifference kills what could have been a talent pool if nurtured. I think there is only one institution that can monitor it no matter how much you deny. Just because few exemplary students are making it at own doesn't give licence to govt to give up every responsibility and leave it all ram bharose.
You are again and again insisting on service sector jobs by asking for the skill. India lacks manufacturing sector which employs lesser skilled people. India has only service sector, that too for export oriented high skilled segment. This is resulting in high demand for high skilled sector while no demand for low skilled people. In every society, extremely intelligent people are limited. The huge skew of service sector in India whereby 40% of exports are services means that the jobs generated are limited to the top tier people only. Skilling is not the way forward but developing manufacturing sector is. Also, the result of foreign exports and higher foreign wages, the service sector people get extraordinarily high wages which is disproportionate to the resources available in India and is mostly funded by foreign resources
India's main problem is its reliance on foreign resource, lack of natural resources, high population and Indian National Congress. Unlike India, China has huge natural resources and enabled it to give rise to massive manufacturing sector. The Chinese government were also conducive to setting up manufacturing units. Indian government on the other hand, never emphasised on manufacturing. The private industry just took advantage of the supercomputing era and started to export services. India having a high population and low resources, had large number of intelligent people ready to work for low wages. The service sector didn't even need government approvals as much as manufacturing sector did and hence the service sector cam to dominate. But, this sector can hire only highly talented people while the masses are left out, resulting in massive inequality.
The only solution to this is by investing in technology intensive manufacturing, labour intensive manufacturing and labour intensive service sector. The technology intensive manufacturing will reduce the flight of capital from India in the form of imports, thus increasing the domestic circulation of resources and labour intensive manufactuing like textiles, construction sector, cottage industry etc will help production of jobs and replace the lower end household goods. The labour intensive service sector like rastaurants (including your Pakoda stall), tourism etc are extremely important in generating employment by providing opportunity for consumption for both Indians with high networth and foreigners which is also called "trickle down" effect.
PS: Pakoda stall owners don't earn 6000 per month. The earnings is about 30000 per month or more. I have personally calculated the sales of a pani puri guy every week between 4:00-4:30PM to exceed 500 rupees on average. Of that, about 40-50% is profit. He works for 4 hours a day. I see his profits at over 50k per month. I have relatives who are dance teachers, cooks who make handsome money compared to engineers. These people also have a fantastic life as they only have to work for less than 200 hours a month.
how can anyone side with these mostly jobless B.techs. don't we know how these degrees are acquired by people in Bihar, UP, bengal etc? Most of these guys are unfit to even pass 10th standard but have an engineering degree with them. Mass cheating and copying has resulted in such a situation that B.Techs are selling pakodas and what is wrong with this? Even tatas sell pakodas in their five stars.
You are not paying attention to the most important aspect of industrialization: natural resource, especially petroleum oil. USA controls world oil supply by having dollar as international currency. USA itself also has massive oil reserves an in 1900 its reserves matched Saudi Arabia. The natural resource is what propelled USA. USA also gave away its resource to Korea, Japan as a result of which they became manufacturing hubs. Europe also grew by riding on USA marshall plan. USSR also had huge natural resource and was once a superpower. But, USA took the support of Arabs and pumped oil supply at record levels bankrupting USSR and resulting in its collapse.
It is because of natural resource, especially petroleum oil, that the west is so dominant. IVY league etc are a result of this resource boom.
It is because of natural resource, especially petroleum oil, that the west is so dominant. IVY league etc are a result of this resource boom.
So pakora is not employment, not aaloo parantha, dahi bhalle and not aaloo tikki. No chat, no pani puri....
Where I am supposed to get those stuff then?
But then I guess everyone in India must directly jump to white collar job, and we can visit BDesh to eat pakoras, and Pakistan to eat pani puri.
@safriz what is the current rate of gol gappa/pani poori in Pakistan now a days? Or even 100 gm of mix veg pakoras?
Where I am supposed to get those stuff then?
But then I guess everyone in India must directly jump to white collar job, and we can visit BDesh to eat pakoras, and Pakistan to eat pani puri.
@safriz what is the current rate of gol gappa/pani poori in Pakistan now a days? Or even 100 gm of mix veg pakoras?