PAK-FA / Sukhoi Su-57 - Updates and Discussions

randomradio

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19 March 2019, 06:10
There is no indication of the lifetime of the engine, otherwise it is quite impressive!

I knew that it was a variable bypass engine or variable geometry engine.

What's interesting is it will be the most advanced operational engine until the next American engine comes in during the 2030s. So at least for some time the Russians would have taken the lead in engine technology.
 
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Hydra

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What's interesting is it will be the most advanced operational engine until the next American engine comes in during the 2030s. So at least for some time the Russians would have taken the lead in engine technology.
Japanese have new engine, which could surpass russian one.
 

randomradio

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Japanese have new engine, which could surpass russian one.

Unlikely. The Japanese engine is a standard design similar in class to the F119 or F135. It's not VCE.

VCE is part of next gen American designs that came out of AETP. So the Russians got there first, after both countries failed in the 90s.
 
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Hydra

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Unlikely. The Japanese engine is a standard design similar in class to the F119 or F135. It's not VCE.

VCE is part of next gen American designs that came out of AETP. So the Russians got there first, after both countries failed in the 90s.
So what u are thinking now? We backed off from SU57 is an act of stupidity or not?
 

vstol Jockey

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What's interesting is it will be the most advanced operational engine until the next American engine comes in during the 2030s. So at least for some time the Russians would have taken the lead in engine technology.
Russians have reduced the gap already. The new engine for their new airliner is nearly same in performance as the latest from GE and PW. The difference in SFC is just about 1% between the geared fan design of PW and PS-14.
Japanese have new engine, which could surpass russian one.
There are two ways to optimise the performance of an engine? one is to design an engine which meets all your needs all across the operating spectrum or design an aircraft around an engine wherein the performance of the aircraft and the engine are optimum. Stealth aircraft do not need to fly low so an engine optimised for high altitude operations with VCE is better IMHO.
 

randomradio

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So what u are thinking now? We backed off from SU57 is an act of stupidity or not?

It's not. The Russians would create problems with ToT, just like they did with Brahmos, so it's not like we will actually benefit from their R&D capabilities. They have a habit of backtracking from promised committments as well. Also, the IAF is now much more interested in creating technologies inhouse rather than importing. Once MRFA is done with, only indigenous products will be produced in India.

We can always import 40-80 Su-57s if necessary, this much is more than enough considering drones will become the mainstay of airpower in the future. Plus the insane range of the Su-57 covers the entire Indian mainland with just one airbase, so two airbases with 2 squadrons each are more than enough to deal with both Pak and China.
 
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randomradio

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The Okhotnik is the Russian Ghatak.

The pilot of the fifth generation Su-57 fighter will simultaneously coordinate the actions of four newest Hunter heavy attack unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs). This was reported to TASS by a source in the aircraft industry.

"Now the possibilities of controlling several attack drones from the cockpit of the Su-57 are being worked out. It is assumed that the fighter will carry from two to four Hunters with it," he said.


TASS has no official confirmation of this information.

As previously reported to TASS in the press service of the United Aircraft Corporation (UAC), the newest UAV "Okhotnik" will hit air and ground targets as part of network-centric interaction with the Su-57 fighter. When used together, the drones will solve a full range of tasks, working on air and ground targets under the command of the leading manned vehicle.


The Su-57 is designed to destroy all types of air, ground and surface targets. The aircraft has a supersonic cruising speed, internal armament, radio-absorbing coating ("stealth" technology), as well as the latest complex of onboard equipment.

Developed in the Sukhoi design bureau, the S-70 Okhotnik UAV is made according to the "flying wing" scheme with the use of "stealth" technology, which reduces its radar signature. According to open sources, the takeoff weight of the vehicle is up to 20 tons, the maximum flight speed is about 1,000 km / h. Serial deliveries are planned to begin in 2024. The Hunter took to the air for the first time on August 3, 2019, the flight lasted more than 20 minutes under the control of the operator. On September 27 last year, the UAV flew together with the Su-57 fighter.
 
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randomradio

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The order for the latest fifth-generation fighters, the Su-57, may be measured in hundreds of units. This was announced by the General Director of the United Aircraft Corporation (UAC) Yuri Slyusar during a meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

"We hope that, of course, since this machine has been chosen as the platform, the main machine for solving a wide range of tasks, the order for these machines will be measured in hundreds," he said.

According to him, development of several versions of this machine is expected to begin this year. “This year we will deliver four cars already. And then our task is to reach the level of 12 cars a year together with cooperation,” Slyusar noted.

The general director of the UAC recalled that a contract has been signed with the Russian Ministry of Defense for the supply of 76 Su-57s.


The Su-57 is a fifth-generation Russian multifunctional fighter. Designed to destroy all types of air, ground and surface targets. It has a supersonic cruising speed, in-body armament, a radio-absorbing coating, as well as a state-of-the-art complex of onboard equipment.
 

_Anonymous_

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For a westerner ( he's Italian , ex Italian AF & an aeronautical engineer ) , his views & analysis are surprisingly free of the usual bias one expects of the Russians .

He's done a good job summing up the various features of the Su-57 along with a decent analysis of it's strengths & weaknesses & how it compares with similar western aircrafts namely ones USAF flies.


Your take on it . @Picdelamirand-oil ;
@vstol Jockey
 
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randomradio

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"Product 30": what is the uniqueness of the new engine for the Russian Su-57 aircraft, by Alexey Zakvasin for RT News in Russian. 11/11/2021.

On November 11, 2016, the first ground launch of the Product 30 demonstrator engine took place. The power plant is designed to equip the Russian fifth generation fighter Su-57. Now this aircraft flies on the AL-41F1 intermediate unit. According to the developers' estimates, the "Product 30" will significantly surpass modern engines in power and fuel efficiency. Experts believe that the carrier of the new power plant will be able to strike much faster and evade enemy attacks.

Five years ago, on the basis of the Lytkarinsky Machine-Building Plant (LM3), the first ground launch of the “Product 30” demonstrator engine, intended for the Russian fifth generation Su-57 fighter, took place .

On December 5, 2017, an aircraft with a new power plant made its debut flight, which lasted 17 minutes. It was run by the Hero of the Russian Federation, the chief pilot of the Sukhoi company, Sergei Bogdan.

Russian Industry and Trade Minister Denis Manturov said that the successful maiden flight of the Su-57 with the new engine would give an additional impetus to the fifth generation fighter program.

“This is proof of the high potential of the Russian aircraft industry, capable of creating highly intelligent advanced systems: a unique airframe, innovative digital filling, the latest engines,” Manturov emphasized.

LMZ is a subdivision of the A. Lyulka Experimental Design Bureau, which is part of the United Engine Corporation (UEC). The main task of LMZ is assembly, testing and fine-tuning of aircraft gas turbine engines and their units.

In non after-burning mode

"Product 30" is the designation of the so-called second stage engine of the fifth generation aircraft. Now the Su-57 flies on the AL-41F1 intermediate power unit ("Product 117"), which is also called the first stage engine. Its developer is the A. Lyulka Design Bureau.

Specialists of the enterprise attribute super-maneuverability, thrust-to-weight ratio, low visibility to enemy radars to the key characteristics of the AL-41F1.

The "Product 117" has an integrated oxygen-free plasma ignition system for the main and afterburner combustion chambers. It allows you to start the engine during flight without oxygen make-up. As experts interviewed by RT explained, providing an aircraft with oxygen requires the availability of appropriate infrastructure at the airfield and the placement of a certain set of equipment on board a combat vehicle.

In addition, the AL-41F1 became the first Russian aircraft engine to use a fully digital control system based on a domestic element base. The modification of the device will be integrated into the second stage engine as well.

“The AL-41F1 is the engine on which the Su-35S , the most modern Russian fourth-generation fighter jet, now flies . The power unit really has high performance, but it still belongs to the previous generation of aircraft engines, ”Dmitry Kornev, founder of the Military Russia portal, told RT.

As the expert explained, the AL-41F1, like other motors, “glows” quite strongly in the radar and infrared spectra. In addition, this engine is not able to provide cruising (normal) flight at supersonic speed in non-afterburner mode.

“Currently, supersonic flight leads to a significant increase in fuel consumption. As a rule, an aircraft is able to withstand supersonic sound for several minutes, and then, if it continues to fly at supersonic speed, it risks running into a fuel shortage. "Product 30" practically removes such a problem from the agenda, "Kornev emphasized.

According to the expert, cruising supersonic is becoming an important advantage in the modern theater of operations. In particular, it significantly improves the flight performance of the carrier.

“Such an aircraft is capable of avoiding enemy attacks much more rapidly, reaching the position of striking the enemy faster and safer, and intercepting and escorting foreign aircraft more quickly,” said Kornev.

According to the analyst's forecast, the second stage engine will increase the cruising speed of the Su-57 to about 1.5 Mach number. At the same time, in the RT commentary, Honored Pilot of Russia Major General Vladimir Popov estimated this figure at almost Mach 2.

"Special offer"


Little is known about the characteristics of Product 30. Earlier on the air of Sputnik radio, UEC representative Anton Chechukov said that in comparison with the AL-41F1, the thrust of the second stage engine would be increased to 17.5-19.5 tons. The engine would also be distinguished by increased fuel efficiency and a reduced life cycle cost.

In 2018, in an interview with the Zvezda TV channel, General Designer - Director of the A. Lyulka Design Bureau Evgeny Marchukov said that in terms of specific thrust, the Product 30 would surpass all foreign analogues. As a result, the carrier will be able to take off faster, gain altitude, and perform maneuvers with a large overload during air combat.

In March 2020, an article was published on the website of the Science and Technology journal with an analysis of the technical solutions implemented in Product 30. It reported that the oxygen-free ignition system is installed on modernized nozzles, which ensure the ignition of the fuel immediately after it enters the combustion chamber.

Thanks to this approach, the optimal combustion mode is maintained and the so-called torching is excluded - the ejection of a column of fire from the nozzle due to excess fuel in the combustion chamber. Also, the second stage engine is equipped with a new nozzle with thrust vector control function.

The article noted that the electronic-digital control system "Product 30" significantly simplifies the work of the pilot and facilitates the process of tuning the engine. She receives a command from the pilot, and then executes it "taking into account the current parameters and various factors."

Vladimir Popov stated that Russian designers have significantly changed the thermodynamic process used in previous generations of jet engines.

“This is due to the special ionization of the air flow, the air-fuel mixture. The afterburner is located in a traditional combustion chamber. In "Product 30" there will be no afterburner as such. Instead, a ring system appeared, which will create the combustion of fuel without its additional supply through pumping systems, which will be more economical. It is planned to increase the efficiency from fuel combustion by 1.2—1.5 times, ”the expert said.

Also, as Popov noted, the engine of the second stage provides for a complex of new fuel automation, which will regulate the flight mode due to thrust. According to him, in the non-afterburning mode, the thrust of the "Product 30" will be 1.5 times more than that of today's engines.

“In addition, technological and operational characteristics have been improved in the new engine. Now the testing process is underway. Upon their completion, I think, our industry will cope with setting up the production of the unit. The design office and manufacturing plants work simultaneously, so there should be no problems with production, ”Popov explained.

Answering a question from RT about the prospects for exporting "Product 30", the major general said that with the deployment of serial production, it is reasonable to focus on equipping the second stage of the Russian aircraft fleet with engines. In the future, as Popov argues, Russia can export the power unit to China, India, Turkey, Argentina and Brazil.

“There are too many technological positions that are inappropriate to give abroad. For now, it is in the interests of the Russian Federation to use "Product 30" to ensure our defense capability and combat readiness of the Aerospace Forces. Export is possible in five years after the start of production of this unit. Now we will continue to offer other countries deeply modernized samples of the previous generation, ”Popov said.

Dmitry Kornev adheres to a different point of view. In his opinion, Moscow can start exporting "Product 30" and aircraft with it to the most reliable partners in the area of military-technical cooperation. The expert is confident that such products will be very popular in the global arms market.

The interlocutor of RT recalled that Russia is actively promoting its fighters on the international market, so the aircraft flying on the "Product 30" will definitely become a "unique offer." According to Kornev, the new unit can be installed not only on the Su-57. With minor modifications, the second stage engine will most likely be mounted on the Su-35 and Su-34 as part of their modernization programs.

“Creation of jet engines for combat aviation is a most difficult technological task for any state. In my opinion, testing and work on the "Product 30" will continue for several more years. All these gains are not in vain. Our country is close to getting the first power unit since the 1990s, practically devoid of Soviet ancestry. "Product 30" will serve for at least 40 years and will certainly become a platform for the development of various modifications, "summed up Kornev.
 

randomradio

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The sheer size of the fuselage. The internal volume of the jet will be massive.

screen56.jpg


One can fold the entire wing for use on carriers.

screen58.jpg
 

randomradio

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Radars will gain eyes

A group of specialists on the basis of the Research Institute of Long-Range Radar is developing a fundamentally new X-band radar station operating on the basis of radio-photon technologies.

The work is headed by the head of the working group of the Scientific and Technical Council of the Military-Industrial Commission on Radiophotonics Alexei Nikolaevich Shulunov. The first steps have been taken, which can be considered successful. It looks like a new era is opening in classic radar, which now seems like a fantasy.

Probably everyone who graduated from high school knows what radar is. And what a radio-photon location is, is not known to a very large circle of specialists. To put it simply, the new technology makes it possible to combine the incompatible - radio waves and light. In this case, the flow of electrons must be converted into a flow of photons and vice versa. The problem, which yesterday was beyond the bounds of reality, can be solved in the near future. What will it give?

For example, the basis of radar systems for missile defense and tracking of space objects is made up of huge radar complexes. The rooms in which the equipment is located are multi-storey buildings. The use of photonic technologies will make it possible to fit all control and data processing systems in significantly smaller dimensions - literally in a few rooms. At the same time, the technical capabilities of radars to detect even small objects at a distance of thousands of kilometers will only increase. Moreover, due to the use of photonic technologies, not a target mark will appear on the radar screen, but its image, which is unattainable with classical radar. That is, instead of the usual luminous point, the operator will see what is actually flying - an airplane, a rocket, a flock of birds or a meteorite, it is worth repeating, even thousands of kilometers from the radar.

Now all radar systems - military and civilian - operate in a strictly defined frequency range, which complicates technical design and leads to a variety of radar nomenclature. Photonic radars will allow for the highest degree of uniformity. They are able to instantly tune in a very wide range of operating frequencies - from meter values to millimeter ones.

It has long been no secret that the so-called stealth planes are clearly visible in the meter range, but most accurately their coordinates are better given by centimeter and millimeter-wave stations. Therefore, in air defense systems, both meter stations with very large antennas and more compact centimeter ones work at the same time. But a photonic radar, scanning space in a long frequency range, will easily detect the same "invisibility" and, instantly reconfiguring to a broadband signal and a high frequency, will determine its exact coordinates in height and range.

This is only about the location. Revolutionary changes will also take place in electronic warfare, in the transmission of information and its protection, in computing technologies and much more. It is easier to say that it will not affect radio photonics.

In fact, a fundamentally new branch of the high-tech industry will be created. The task is extremely difficult, therefore, many leading research centers of the country, university science, and a number of industrial enterprises are involved in its solution. According to Shulunov, work is going on in close connection with the Ministry of Defense, the Ministry of Economic Development, the Ministry of Science and Education. The President of Russia recently took control of them.
 
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randomradio

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Su-57 fifth-generation fighter may get flat nozzle for stealth purposes — pilot

The flat nozzle technology is a breakthrough in modern aircraft-building, Major-General Vladimir Popov noted.

MOSCOW, December 14. /TASS/. The unique flat nozzle demonstrated during the roll-out of the latest S-70 ‘Okhotnik’ (‘Hunter’) heavy strike drone will most likely be installed on the next modifications of the Su-57 fifth-generation fighter for stealth purposes, Russian Air Force merited pilot Major-General Vladimir Popov told TASS on Tuesday.

Russia’s Defense Ministry uploaded a video clip earlier on Tuesday showing the roll-out of the latest version of the S-70 ‘Okhotnik’ stealth heavy strike drone furnished with a unique flat nozzle thruster to cut its signature for enemy radars.

"Similar measures will most likely be taken for the Su-57 but this will be, perhaps, the second stage of its development. A new engine will be mounted on it," the military pilot said, commenting on the roll-out of the first flight prototype of the latest Okhotnik heavy strike drone at the Novosibirsk Aviation Enterprise on December 14.

A modified engine will most likely feature a flat nozzle, he said. "However, considering that the fighter employs afterburner acceleration modes, this nozzle must have the option of altering its configuration," Popov said.

"Mounted on the fighter, it must both expand and narrow its throughput capacity," the pilot said, adding that the flat nozzle technology was undoubtedly a breakthrough in modern aircraft-building.

Reducing vulnerabilities

The new nozzle for the Okhotnik heavy strike drone will considerably cut its vulnerabilities to enemy heat-seeking missile warheads, the military pilot explained.

"A flat nozzle is designed to cut infrared radiation of the engine’s exhaust gas flow. The flow’s infrared radiation enables air defense capabilities with thermal radiation homing warheads to take aim at the drone," Popov said.

"The incoming airflow kind of compresses and blurs the gases coming out of the nozzle. There is no big [nozzle] torch and thus the flow of gases escaping from the engine is invisible. It is the torch that basically ‘attracts’ thermal homing missiles, be it air-to-air or surface-to-air weapons," the military pilot explained.

The flat nozzle also cuts the aircraft’s optical signature, he added.

Invisible to radars

The new nozzle has altered the drone’s fuselage shape, which has cut its radar signature, the merited military pilot said.

"The aircraft’s radar signature is also reduced after the flat nozzle is installed. The cross section that reflects radio beams is also narrowed because the airplane now has no rough features in its design and it almost becomes flat," he pointed out.

The drone’s fuselage now actually looks like one wing, he said. "If we recall the first version of the Okhotnik, the engine clearly protruded there and now this is not the case. Now all the features are smooth and as a result the cross section has been cut and the radar beam deflection has magnified," the military pilot said.

Latest Okhotnik drone and Su-57 fifth-generation fighter

The S-70 ‘Okhotnik’ drone developed by the Sukhoi Design Bureau features stealth technology and the flying wing design (it lacks a tail), which diminishes its radar signature. According to the data of open sources, the drone has a take-off weight of 20 tonnes and can accelerate to roughly 1,000 km/h. Serial delivery of the drone to the troops is expected to begin in 2024.

The Okhotnik heavy attack drone performed its debut flight on August 3, 2019. The flight lasted over 20 minutes under operator control. On September 27, 2019, the Okhotnik performed a flight together with a Su-57 fifth-generation fighter jet. The drone maneuvered in the air in automated mode at an altitude of around 1,600 meters and its flight lasted over 30 minutes.

Speaking to journalists during the roll-out of the S-70 ‘Okhotnik’ flight prototype with a flat nozzle, Russian Deputy Defense Minister Alexey Krivoruchko said that a serial contract for its delivery to the troops would be signed in the next six months. As the defense official said, the Okhotnik is a highly intelligent system capable of coping with a broad range of tasks on its own, in a group and jointly with manned aircraft. Rostec said that work was underway to set up a new ground-based control post for the Okhotnik drone.

The Sukhoi Su-57 is a Russian-made fifth-generation multi-role fighter designated to destroy all types of air, ground and naval targets. The Su-57 fighter jet is capable of developing supersonic cruising speed, has its armament placed inside its fuselage and radar absorbing coatings and the most advanced onboard radio-electronic equipment. Russia’s Aerospace Force will receive 22 Su-57 fighters by late 2024 and their number will increase to 76 by 2028. The first Su-57 fighter was delivered to the Russian troops in 2020.

As the United Aircraft Corporation (part of Rostec) earlier told TASS, the latest Okhotnik drone would be capable of operating in conjunction with Su-57 fifth-generation fighters. The Okhotnik drone will be able to strike aerial and ground targets as part of network-centric interaction with the fighter, it specified.

TASS also reported that a pilot of the Sukhoi Su-57 fifth-generation fighter jet would simultaneously coordinate the operations of four latest Okhotnik heavy strike drones. Moreover, a group of drones will most likely be controlled from a new Su-57 special two-seat version, it specified.
 
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