Mirage 2000H, MiG-29UPG, Jaguar DARIN III - Medium Multirole Aircraft of IAF

Parthu

Gessler
Team StratFront
Dec 1, 2017
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Agree with most of your post except the part where you refer to jags being Agile.

Doesn't have the agility of aerodynamically unstable aircraft, but otherwise it's a fine plane I believe.

a statement like Jags being agile is akin to saying A.K Hangal is a hunk.

Looked kinda okay back in the day.

Screenshot_20181215_024721.JPG
 

Milspec

सर्वदा शक्तिशाली; सर्वत्र विजय
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Dec 2, 2017
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Doesn't have the agility of aerodynamically unstable aircraft, but otherwise it's a fine plane I believe.

One of the jokes among pilots was Jags take off the runway because of the curvature of the earth, it's lack of power is legendary. It can barely turn tight, if it encounters another adversary, wit will not be able to outfly the adversary, It was decent bomb truck 20 years ago, where it does shine is it's cheap to operate, extremely over engineered, the airframe could be subjected to twice the thrust it currently has and will still hold up, cockpit is comfortable. It can be a good EW platform though.
 

Ashwin

Agent_47
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Nov 30, 2017
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The Contract for upgradation of 61 Jaguar Display, Attack, Range and Inertial Navigation-I (DARIN-I) aircraft to DARIN-III standard was signed with HAL in December 2009. Contractual timelines for Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) and Final Operational Clearance (FOC) were December 2012 & June 2013 respectively. Contractual timelines for delivery of all the Series Upgrade aircraft was December 2017. IOC has been obtained in February 2017. FOC has not yet been achieved. The delay in the project is due to following reasons:-

  • Introduction of certain new requirements projected by IAF which required additional software design, implementation and flight trials efforts.
  • Delay in supply of certain Buyers Furnished Equipments by IAF.
  • Up gradation of certain equipment like Smart Multi- Function Display sought by IAF.


The development of Mission Computer was taken up by HAL through its Joint Venture Company, HAL Edgewood Technologies Limited (HETL). After some initial delay, the development of Mission Computer has now been completed.



Regarding Smart Multi Function Display (SMFD), as per the revised requirement of IAF, a suitable alternative has been identified by HAL. This SMFD has also attained certification.



The progress of Jaguar DARIN-III upgrade programme is regularly reviewed by Ministry of Defence through meetings with HAL & IAF.

Press Information Bureau
 

halloweene

Well-Known member
Dec 1, 2017
266
331
Paris
One of the jokes among pilots was Jags take off the runway because of the curvature of the earth, it's lack of power is legendary. It can barely turn tight, if it encounters another adversary, wit will not be able to outfly the adversary, It was decent bomb truck 20 years ago, where it does shine is it's cheap to operate, extremely over engineered, the airframe could be subjected to twice the thrust it currently has and will still hold up, cockpit is comfortable. It can be a good EW platform though.

A friend of mine, late Peter James Collins, told me that you knew that you had taken off from X airbase with a jaguar when you saw a certain chrchtower on your right...
 

Bharath

Technical Staff
Dec 1, 2017
791
996
Boston
signed with HAL in December 2009. Contractual timelines for Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) and Final Operational Clearance (FOC) were December 2012 & June 2013 respectively. Contractual timelines for delivery of all the Series Upgrade aircraft was December 2017. IOC has been obtained in February 2017. FOC has not yet been achieved.

I mean seriously - how many such projects will get delayed years together? anyone would not only be fired but deemed absolutely unhirable if this was the effort to keep to the timelines.
 

Sathya

Senior member
Dec 2, 2017
2,230
1,234
India
I mean seriously - how many such projects will get delayed years together? anyone would not only be fired but deemed absolutely unhirable if this was the effort to keep to the timelines.

At least they should say " No "
New requirements can't be done in that time.
 

Himanshu

Senior member
Dec 3, 2017
912
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New Delhi
indopacfront.blogspot.com
Slow HAL impacting India's air combat strength: IAF to Govt



Production delays by state run Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) have seriously impacted air combat strength, particularly when it comes to its Mirage 2000 and Jaguar fighter fleets that are currently undergoing upgrades, the air force has informed the government. Pointing to delays ranging from two to six years, the air force has brought out that HAL has not been able to meet delivery schedules, resulting in both fleets being in a sub optimal state, besides raising questions on the trainer aircraft being developed by the agency. The Mirage 2000 is India’s cutting edge fighter, tasked with a nuclear weapon delivery role as well. The Jaguar fleet was purchased in the late 1970s but is still a potent ground attack fighter designed for surgical, deep penetration missions. However, in a review of the aeronautic company late last year, the air force has said that the series upgrade of 47 Mirage 2000 fighters that was signed in July 2011 has seen three production schedule delays already. It has informed the government that as per schedule, HAL should have delivered 21 upgraded jets but has actually been able to send only six. Sources informed ET that since the review, one more jet has been delivered. HAL has blamed the delay on the non-availability of kits from France but the air force is not impressed by the argument, given that the contract was signed over seven years ago. Officials say this delay has seriously impacted operational preparedness as well as availability rate for the ‘very competent fighter’. Besides the 47 Mirage fighters, the air force has also red flagged a six year delay in the upgrade of the Jaguar fleet to DARIN III standard. The contract to upgrade 61 of these fighters was signed in December 2009, with the understanding that all of them would be ready by December 2017. However, not a single aircraft has yet been delivered to the air force with HAL struggling to integrate a new radar on the jets. IAF has informed the government that it now expects the upgraded fighters to join service only by 2024. Sources said the delay has again come at the cost of combat strength as it has pushed down availability of fighters. At present, an entire squadron strength of 20 fighters is not operational, awaiting the upgrade. HAL’s record on the delivery of Su 30 MKI fighters has also been questioned, with the government being informed that there is an overall delay of three years in the production schedule. While all aircraft were to be delivered by 2017, HAL still has at least 23 of the fighters to deliver to the air force. On trainer aircraft, the air force has raised questions on the development schedule of the HTT 40 basic trainer. While the timeline for certification of the trainer was February 2015, the air force says the project is running behind time and it is not expected that HAL will manage even to certify the aircraft as fit for service before 2021.
 

Sathya

Senior member
Dec 2, 2017
2,230
1,234
India
Seems recently upgraded twin seater trainer . Pilots are not alive . 1 confirm , other was seriously injured doubtful.

Acceptance trail ..

Upgraded at the rate of 1 per year.

They managed to crash Su 30 too..

Looks like HAL is in trouble.

Can we simultaneously upgrade rest in DRAL ?
 

vstol Jockey

Professional
Dec 1, 2017
5,908
11,482
New Delhi
Ejecting at low levels at low speeds and landing on the crashed aircraft is a real danger during take off. I got saved in my second ejection as the aircraft had pitched up nearly 60* and so my ejection took me backwards nearly parallel to the runway which created the separation between me and the aircraft. But at the same time i did not get the correct height and hit the ground without the parachute fully deploying resulting in serious injuries.
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
11,315
8,564
India
This crash was a huge loss to the country. We lost two senior pilots and an upgraded trainer version. The aircraft can be replaced, but not the pilots.

This is entirely HAL's fault. This was a disaster from HAL's PoV as well. The timing was so bad, when the IAF is currently criticising HAL.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: RATHORE

A Person

Well-Known member
Dec 1, 2017
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A Place
Read on another forum:
  • Seems one of the rear landing gear lost an element and crumbled just before take-off, destabilizing the aircraft and causing the tragedy.
  • It was the first aircraft modernized entirely by HAL without Dassault and Thales supervising.
 

Sathya

Senior member
Dec 2, 2017
2,230
1,234
India
Read on another forum:
  • Seems one of the rear landing gear lost an element and crumbled just before take-off, destabilizing the aircraft and causing the tragedy.
  • It was the first aircraft modernized entirely by HAL without Dassault and Thales supervising.

French supervision is time specific or number of aircraft s bound ?