Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

[TARGET]

Must be thrusters for slowing down the missile.

The braking system of this missile and the launching of the torpedo are very complex hybrid systems. This proves we can create any Hybrid launching system with a specific speed and angle. The High-speed separation of HSTDV seems to be much easier than this.

 

[RISING SUN]

The question is- if you are already detecting the submarine through a ship or MPA, why not use the helicopters on board the ship or the weapons on the MPA to kill it? What exactly is the requirement of this system?

Pushing submarines away from our shore by putting them at another layer of risk from road Mobile anti submarine missile assisted tarpedo. Once these munitions are deployed it will be extremely difficult decision for enemy boat to come closer considering if any detection will most certainly result in multiple launches of these missiles.

The question is- if you are already detecting the submarine through a ship or MPA, why not use the helicopters on board the ship or the weapons on the MPA to kill it? What exactly is the requirement of this system?

There are unmanned systems as well which can detect and assist in such munitions launch. Another thing is we can launch these missiles against a submarine which might be trying their luck to breach the territorial waters. Any detection from underwater systems like SOSUS can also result in these munitions release, without redirecting any other asset in the area.

 

[RISING SUN]

The braking system of this missile and the launching of the torpedo are very complex hybrid systems. This proves we can create any Hybrid launching system with a specific speed and angle. The High-speed separation of HSTDV seems to be much easier than this.

US submariner was discussing about this capability which is not only unique but also very difficult at such long ranges.

 

[Sathya]

The question is- if you are already detecting the submarine through a ship or MPA, why not use the helicopters on board the ship or the weapons on the MPA to kill it? What exactly is the requirement of this system?

Just an uneducated guess..

This is sort of like SAM cover in own territory.

 

[TARGET]

Just an uneducated guess..

This is sort of like SAM cover in own territory.

Once you have a capable missile ready with you there are endless possibilities to carry these missiles e.g. Boat or in a container hidden from the enemy. The interesting fact is the enemy will keep on guessing ... since its starts as a missile and is in the middle of the path it will convert to a Torpedo ,The reaction time will be very less.

 

[TARGET]

Here is the post where it all started


Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion

 

[Gautam]

Must be thrusters for slowing down the missile.

Possible. But using nose mounted thrusters for braking will cause the missile to roll. That roll has to be counteracted by the missile's rear mounted fins. Very complicated stuff.

I hope someday we have a video of the SMART's terminal phase.

 

[randomradio]

The question is- if you are already detecting the submarine through a ship or MPA, why not use the helicopters on board the ship or the weapons on the MPA to kill it? What exactly is the requirement of this system?

Our submarine detection capabilities and networking systems must have reached the point where we can use such missiles against subs. It can be used against ships as well.

 

[AbRaj]

Our submarine detection capabilities and networking systems must have reached the point where we can use such missiles against subs. It can be used against ships as well.

Only If IN promptly inducts it as well.
Right now it’s DRDO project and may very well be a piece in the puzzle.

 

[STEPHEN COHEN]

Our submarine detection capabilities and networking systems must have reached the point where we can use such missiles against subs. It can be used against ships as well.

Can we detect enemy submarines using a large number of small fast moving ships , so that a large area can be covered

But small ships have limited fuel carrying capacities

We need Underwater Drones

And I read on twitter that even UAVs can detect submarines

New Pods Will Allow Reaper Drones To Hunt Submarines And Launch Small Weapons And Drones

Recent tests show how the pods will enable MQ-9s to take on anti-submarine missions, but that's just the beginning.

www.thedrive.com

 

[STEPHEN COHEN]

This thread is on SANT ATGM

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1469731222330896385

 

[randomradio]

Only If IN promptly inducts it as well.
Right now it’s DRDO project and may very well be a piece in the puzzle.

So let's hope it meets IN requirements then.

Can we detect enemy submarines using a large number of small fast moving ships , so that a large area can be covered

But small ships have limited fuel carrying capacities

That's the point of the ASW corvettes. But that's meant for littorals.

 

[Shekhar Singh]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1471387389167869958

 

[TARGET]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1471389226889478147

 

[Parthu]

The question is- if you are already detecting the submarine through a ship or MPA, why not use the helicopters on board the ship or the weapons on the MPA to kill it? What exactly is the requirement of this system?

In all likelihood this is an indication of the presence of passive sensors such as seabed hydrophone arrays (i.e. SOSUS) which can detect presence of surface or subsurface targets over a wide frontage (SOSUS arrays can span thousands of kms).

Once a threat has been localized (at this stage it may or may not be positively identified, which introduces complexity into the mix), a ballistic missile like SMART can deploy a torpedo in the region at only a fraction of the time it would take a MPA like P-8 to arrive in the location, let alone the much slower shipborne helos.

If SMART is anything like Shaurya, it should be able to attain hypersonic velocity inside the atmosphere (above Mach 7) for most of the trajectory. Time is everything for a submarine interception, and SMART can address a big part of that problem.

Another possible advantage is that it would afford a standoff option to deploy ASW weapons into an area where you lack air dominance (like inside the A2/AD influence of a hostile Surface task force, with a submarine escorting it underwater). It wouldn't be possible to safely penetrate that airspace with P-8s or helos...and as long as the enemy surface ship's A2/AD is up, the enemy subsurface element is free of air threats in that region. SMART can fix that.

 

[randomradio]

Once a threat has been localized (at this stage it may or may not be positively identified, which introduces complexity into the mix)

During war, we are gonna restrict access over large areas of water. And when we fail to identify a sub-surface threat as our own within the confines of that region, which will be public knowledge, we are gonna blow it right up. It's an us or them situation, doesn't matter if them includes neutral parties, they are not supposed to be there.

If SMART is anything like Shaurya, it should be able to attain hypersonic velocity inside the atmosphere (above Mach 7) for most of the trajectory. Time is everything for a submarine interception, and SMART can address a big part of that problem.

The S stands for Supersonic, so definitely below mach 5.

 

[_Anonymous_]

I wonder how much of this is our jugaad mindset at work. Since apart from the Scorpenes, the Only certainty regarding future induction of subs is that there's no certainty about prospective timelines of such inductions. We've certainly come up with some smart ad hoc measures that other nations experimented with in the 80's & 90's but didn't proceed with.

I suspect a great deal of the success of these systems would depend on the inputs we receive from our Quad partners since our own platforms whether air, sea, submerged or ocean floor based would be inadequate to tackle the Chinese ( this isn't aimed much at Paxtan, although towards the end of this decade given the sheer numbers of subs they plan to induct , they'd have to be factored in as well).

 

[AbRaj]

I wonder how much of this is our jugaad mindset at work. Since apart from the Scorpenes, the Only certainty regarding future induction of subs is that there's no certainty about prospective timelines of such inductions. We've certainly come up with some smart ad hoc measures that other nations experimented with in the 80's & 90's but didn't proceed with.

I suspect a great deal of the success of these systems would depend on the inputs we receive from our Quad partners since our own platforms whether air, sea, submerged or ocean floor based would be inadequate to tackle the Chinese ( this isn't aimed much at Paxtan, although towards the end of this decade given the sheer numbers of subs they plan to induct , they'd have to be factored in as well).

May be IN is looking for mass induction of autonomous underwater vehicles equipped with required sensor suite for surveillance in IOR, in conjunction with P8I and Predator drones and also SOSUS and naval assets of alliance partners.
If we can deploy enough sensors, we can fully utilise this SMART system to target the intruder ships and subs in IOR

 

[Chain Smoker]

May be IN is looking for mass induction of autonomous underwater vehicles equipped with required sensor suite for surveillance in IOR, in conjunction with P8I and Predator drones and also SOSUS and naval assets of alliance partners.
If we can deploy enough sensors, we can fully utilise this SMART system to target the intruder ships and subs in IOR

HEAUV and under water swarm are under Development.

 

[AbRaj]

View attachment 22076
HEAUV and under water swarm are under Development.

Do these type of AUVs have capability to interact with each other like true swarms ?
A fully networked swarms of these AUVs with other naval assets will drastically reduce dependence on costly assets like subs and P8i MPAs. Couple that with our own version of Predator UAVs and we don’t have to buy Billion dollar Subs and MPAs just to cover the Indian Ocean.