Indian Army : Updates & Discussions

There's only 1 which can cause such a defence on their side
Superior military here =Combined military might of european countries plus military might projected by US on european continent.
Especially aerial might.

Our case is kinda similar, the biggest weakness of our military with respect to china is in air.
Air defense maxxing and offensive missiles maxxing is logical.
 
Its a local production, means we are becoming part of supply chain for this missile for NATO. You people aren't getting what is this for Indo US relationship.
Its not a wonder weapon, it will be another assembly line job for India which will help them cut cost of their expensive thrash. After software services India is now going to become the cheap factory destination to cut costs. But unlike china they know corrupt India can never out compete with them.
 
Its not a wonder weapon, it will be another assembly line job for India which will help them cut cost of their expensive thrash. After software services India is now going to become the cheap factory destination to cut costs. But unlike china they know corrupt India can never out compete with them.
We will be payed, thats what more important than Javelin or anyother assembly line. Even goi plolicy is to become a manufacturing hub for defense equipment. So this assembly line is aligning with goi's policy well.

And, FYI its not the lack of funding making india in backfoot.
 
Very Good Points made by a Former LT GEN of Indian Army

drones are more efficient killing machines and the results are immediate. Not just military even terrorists will take to drones just like they took to AK 47. The side which can churn out cheap reliable drones will gain upper hand in a sustained long war.

Flip side is that technology absorption & refinement by countries like India & putting it to military use will take time.
 
We will be payed, thats what more important than Javelin or anyother assembly line. Even goi plolicy is to become a manufacturing hub for defense equipment. So this assembly line is aligning with goi's policy well.

And, FYI its not the lack of funding making india in backfoot.
Rubbish , europeans are not doing it , why only India ? bcos it has literally zero value addition. We should put our technical manpower to good use not assemble junk weapons. Let them buy our weapons instead. It will add more cash to our economy.
 
Rubbish , europeans are not doing it , why only India ? bcos it has literally zero value addition. We should put our technical manpower to good use not assemble junk weapons. Let them buy our weapons instead. It will add more cash to our economy.
Zero value addition or not, money addition is there. It matters.
Europeans are not manufacturing car also these year, china does that for them. Chinese ecenomy got benefited by this act
 
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We should put our technical manpower to good use not assemble junk weapons. Let them buy our weapons instead. It will add more cash to our economy.
We have all kind of people from different parts of population pyramid sir..who need job..if we don't have industry in some sector already..no harm in having it..when it will mature and evolve to the point they will be used for some "good use" work..till then it's all part of process and journey...and even if we have industry I think we have more than enough people for the job.
 
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drones are more efficient killing machines and the results are immediate. Not just military even terrorists will take to drones just like they took to AK 47. The side which can churn out cheap reliable drones will gain upper hand in a sustained long war.

Flip side is that technology absorption & refinement by countries like India & putting it to military use will take time.
A laser weapon aka DEW with firing rate of machine guns and AI for precision.

And maybe unlike D4 System, it could be static, and integrated into the grid along LoC and IB perhaps. Cheaper and dispensable version.

For power, electric lines + battery backup. Since it's part of an integrated grid, any damage can be reported in real time.

And in future, and now I am moving to scifi zone.. dew against terrorist incursion too. If it can penetrate metal, surely has potential to penetrate terrorist too ( scary)
 
The ATGM profile of Indian army is a mess to say
You have got
French- millan
Russian- konkurs, kornet, shturm, Ivar,
Isareli- spike,
Indian- nag mk1,
Now you want to operate javelin,
When the MPATGM is going on for user trials, which does the same job as what javelin does,
Javelin is a gold plated weapon, and to be honest we are using ATGM for more hardened targets bunkers rather as compared to Anti armour roles,

ATGM in indian army have been like collecting infinity stones,

If the MOD wants the deal for political purposes then, they should go for ordering more chinooks for the army, or go for CIWS systems, not for ATGM when you have already multiple options at house to begin with
It's the same pattern the IA followed with AK-203 + SiG 716. One for bulk use, the front-on frontline units. Mainly because of the cost factor. But after Kalyani entered into a JV with Rafael for producing Spike among other things, I must say Javelin was a bolt out of the blue. Esp since it had already failed IA trials some years back.
 
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The ATGM profile of Indian army is a mess to say
You have got
French- millan
Russian- konkurs, kornet, shturm, Ivar,
Isareli- spike,
Indian- nag mk1,
Now you want to operate javelin,
When the MPATGM is going on for user trials, which does the same job as what javelin does,
Javelin is a gold plated weapon, and to be honest we are using ATGM for more hardened targets bunkers rather as compared to Anti armour roles,

ATGM in indian army have been like collecting infinity stones,

If the MOD wants the deal for political purposes then, they should go for ordering more chinooks for the army, or go for CIWS systems, not for ATGM when you have already multiple options at house to begin with
I won't say it's a mess. The infantry is more or less standardized on Milan-2T and Konkurs-M on the common FLAME launcher.

But yea I agree with your overall context.
 
We have all kind of people from different parts of population pyramid sir..who need job..if we don't have industry in some sector already..no harm in having it..when it will mature and evolve to the point they will be used for some "good use" work..till then it's all part of process and journey...and even if we have industry I think we have more than enough people for the job.
cheap money from US will take best of your ppl and put them into low value jobs. There are enuf ppl yes, but best & brightest will go after cheap money US companies throws leaving 2nd class talent for the rest of the critical jobs that require them.
 
cheap money from US will take best of your ppl and put them into low value jobs. There are enuf ppl yes, but best & brightest will go after cheap money US companies throws leaving 2nd class talent for the rest of the critical jobs that require them.
I am not understanding what do you mean by "cheap money". Indians have shown what they are capable of seeing indian origin CEOs and innovators, industrialist business leaders...so if brightest agree for low value job---->either job is not low value or they are not brightest and if they are brightest they will have better job to do----->because who will get/do what job will be decided by demand and supply play..anyway this is not important and not my main argument...my argument is ..we already have too many talent/people(for low mid and high end job) (and that's why Companies creating their GCC here) so there will always be someone to replace if one goes...so it should not be problematic...India as a nation has not been able to create business friendly environment --> not enough business--->not enough job wrt no of people. So any business indian or foreign of whatever kind(low,mid or high end) should be welcome provided it doesn't threaten our national security.

This is my take based on my broader understanding of things...if you have counter argument with finer details please do reply.thank you.
 
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I am not understanding what do you mean by "cheap money". Indians have shown what they are capable of seeing indian origin CEOs and innovators, industrialist business leaders...so if brightest agree for low value job---->either job is not low value or they are not brightest and if they are brightest they will have better job to do----->because who will get/do what job will be decided by demand and supply play..anyway this is not important and not my main argument...my argument is ..we already have too many talent/people(for low mid and high end job) (and that's why Companies creating their GCC here) so there will always be someone to replace if one goes...so it should not be problematic...India as a nation has not been able to create business friendly environment --> not enough business--->not enough job wrt no of people. So any business indian or foreign of whatever kind(low,mid or high end) should be welcome provided it doesn't threaten our national security.

This is my take based on my broader understanding of things...if you have counter argument with finer details please do reply.thank you.
that mentality works only for the normal jobs. For the jobs in the critical & specialty sector, we need to nurture & grow talent, who will take it forward to next 2 or 3 decades. You cant simply replace or get ppl whenever you want. "cheap money" US prints money at will and buys your services and obviously even the best talent will work for more money which competes & starves your industry of required talent. If you have hired ppl you will know what I am talking of.

Unless India retains & puts its best talent to work for itself rather than some other company , it will not just remain backward, but also pay a big price as it has to buy services from them. simply put there is a competition for best talent , any company/country which says we can do with other ppl have already lost the race. There is a good reason why china beats us square & fair. They think like competitors , channel their resources, and get the best. While we just hanker after , all we need is a job.
 
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that mentality works only for the normal jobs. For the jobs in the critical & specialty sector, we need to nurture & grow talent, who will take it forward to next 2 or 3 decades. You cant simply replace or get ppl whenever you want. "cheap money" US prints money at will and buys your services and obviously even the best talent will work for more money which competes & starves your industry of required talent. If you have hired ppl you will know what I am talking of.

Unless India retains & puts its best talent to work for itself rather than some other company , it will not just remain backward, but also pay a big price as it has to buy services from them. simply put there is a competition for best talent , any company/country which says we can do with other ppl have already lost the race. There is a good reason why china beats us square & fair. They think like competitors , channel their resources, and get the best. While we just hanker after , all we need is a job.
What about ecosystem, if ecosystem for certain things don't even exist why will people specializing in that area stay. Ik a very talented Indian cyber warfare guy who said there isn't much focus on cyber warfare or defence at all in India, so what can he do by staying lol. In another case, AI ecosystem is not there, they use models from other countries to build LLMs.

India can be at the forefront of these areas only when economic growth and the average situation of the Indian improves. Right now we have large number of poor people with low education, especially in the UP Bihar Jharkhand belt where a lot of talented people are there but are in desperate poverty with 0 educational opportunities.

China started making breakthroughs when GDP reached above $5 trillion, per capita above $5,000 HDI of 0.7 etc. Before China reached these milestones it was another Asian backward country. They reached it in 2010, we will reach it in 2033. Expect to see massive progress for India in 2030s and 2040s.
 
What about ecosystem, if ecosystem for certain things don't even exist why will people specializing in that area stay. Ik a very talented Indian cyber warfare guy who said there isn't much focus on cyber warfare or defence at all in India, so what can he do by staying lol. In another case, AI ecosystem is not there, they use models from other countries to build LLMs.
Thats where leadership & strategic vision comes into play. If the monkeys at the top dont care ppl will leave. They need to go out pay competitive salary and show them future growth...etc . These are called starting troubles and it will be tough as the govt lacks credibility. But thats what they need to build. Unless you pay them top salary and promise the future , ppl will not come and eco system will not grow.

India can be at the forefront of these areas only when economic growth and the average situation of the Indian improves.
For that you need to compete, throw your best money and make more money. Economic growth does not come from selling same banians/vests that bangladesh/sri lanka sells. They will drag you to the bottom of the cost ladder. We need to cut down our biggest expenses that is buying billion ticket items that can only happen if you can build them at home and also export it.

China started making breakthroughs when GDP reached above $5 trillion, per capita above $5,000 HDI of 0.7 etc. Before China reached these milestones it was another Asian backward country. They reached it in 2010, we will reach it in 2033. Expect to see massive progress for India in 2030s and 2040s.
Not every one in the western cntries or developed cntries work on high tech and make more money. Its just 5-10% of the population which works on niche sector which makes more money. This averages out and helps rest of the 90% population bcos it helps to keep its currency stable. What you need is more money to invest in the poor areas and that will happen only when we cut down imports , stabilize the currency which will help the rest of the poor buy goods & services at a affordable cost.
 
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