Brahmos Supersonic Cruise Missile : News, Updates and Discussions

[marich01]

Some key takeaways from this interview:

1. BrahMos speed is 930+ meter per second which translates to around 3400kmph(@marich01 remember our discussion regarding the speed of BrahMos ).

2. Su-30MKI's high-altitude range with max-internal fuel is 3400kms translating to around 1700kms combat-radius @32:05 mark(@vstol Jockey, @randomradio, @Picdelamirand-oil).

3. Su-30MKI would carry 5 BrahMos-NGs. Fvcking awesome.

4. BrahMos-NG is indeed designed for air-to-air role against HVTs. This is now official.

Guys, give this whole interview a watch. It is very informative and absolutely amazing. Thanks to @Ashwin for posting this gem.

A2A HVT as in a very large awacs or load puller like IL76 ie planes that are much bigger than regular fighter jets. Since the weight of the missile has come down while speed has taken a bump to 3.5 mach plus, you can use the same airframe design for other purpose of course. The speed regime where brahmos NG is supposed to work is essentially where most a2a missiles work , over mach 3 upto mach 4.5 sort of. So it can be used in various way, a liquid or solid ramjet, a hybrid propulsion, even solid rocker multi pulse motor, maybe some other futuristic tech too. All we need is different tech building block available to us. Many tech building process are in the fire but drdo is yet to prove any one of these except the 2 pulse propulsion system.

But that long range aam, the actual product need to be tuned for such a role ie externally the missile airframe may look same but its guidance control algo would be different to a static ground attack role. This part is where the tricky game begins. lets say you are sending astra 2 against an HVT, with its 15kg warhead the damage would be minimal. But send a missile with 30 or 60kg warhead and the kill is possible. Most S400 class kusha interceptor would have 30 and 60 kg class warhead hence these are useful against such flying HVT. NG is supposed to have 200kg or more warhead which is obviously overkill but the airframe and tech base can be modified to make such an application.

otherwise it makes no sense. The actual takeaway is mentioning the launcher can be used for other missiles, which should pave way for a new article in same weight category. This is where we can make a heavy surface attack article by infusing new tech. Imagine a full composite body & crmc based missile, this will be able to deliver 500kg class payload while being within 2.5 ton tolerance limit.

But it will be very hard to maintain balance wrt the CG of the article. You see how the brahmos ALCM front tilts after launch since warhead is heavy. Same issue will come up when launching at mach no 0.7-0.8 release condition.

 

[CATS @hunter]

A2A HVT as in a very large awacs or load puller like IL76 ie planes that are much bigger than regular fighter jets. Since the weight of the missile has come down while speed has taken a bump to 3.5 mach plus, you can use the same airframe design for other purpose of course. The speed regime where brahmos NG is supposed to work is essentially where most a2a missiles work , over mach 3 upto mach 4.5 sort of. So it can be used in various way, a liquid or solid ramjet, a hybrid propulsion, even solid rocker multi pulse motor, maybe some other futuristic tech too. All we need is different tech building block available to us. Many tech building process are in the fire but drdo is yet to prove any one of these except the 2 pulse propulsion system.

But that long range aam, the actual product need to be tuned for such a role ie externally the missile airframe may look same but its guidance control algo would be different to a static ground attack role. This part is where the tricky game begins. lets say you are sending astra 2 against an HVT, with its 15kg warhead the damage would be minimal. But send a missile with 30 or 60kg warhead and the kill is possible. Most S400 class kusha interceptor would have 30 and 60 kg class warhead hence these are useful against such flying HVT. NG is supposed to have 200kg or more warhead which is obviously overkill but the airframe and tech base can be modified to make such an application.

otherwise it makes no sense. The actual takeaway is mentioning the launcher can be used for other missiles, which should pave way for a new article in same weight category. This is where we can make a heavy surface attack article by infusing new tech. Imagine a full composite body & crmc based missile, this will be able to deliver 500kg class payload while being within 2.5 ton tolerance limit.

But it will be very hard to maintain balance wrt the CG of the article. You see how the brahmos ALCM front tilts after launch since warhead is heavy. Same issue will come up when launching at mach no 0.7-0.8 release condition.

Is it necessary to use brahmos NG for A2A roles, when Astra mk3 can go upto 380km,

 

[marich01]

4. BrahMos-NG is indeed designed for air-to-air role against HVTs. This is now official.

After watching the segment, it is quite similar to what I posted above without watching full program that time. Aerial high value target would be solely large platforms, big enough that can be hit at extended ranges. Choice of tech can vary, liquid ramjet is not the only choice for such application, but the criteria fits given a2a missiles for long range need to cover the large distance very fast while being of low RCS and also leave enough legroom for maneuvering in different phases of flight. In this regard NG can offer a solution, by reducing warhead to 60kg from 200-300kg, missile is lighter aka maneuver capable, some more fuel for long range greater than 300km and airframe is suited for high mach flight already. Next need updated guidance system, a better seeker, power supply option etc and we got some air launched S-400 interceptor option vs refueler/awacs type big planes.

 

[Speedster1]

BrahMos speed is 930+ meter per second which translates to around 3400kmph(@marich01 remember our discussion regarding the speed of BrahMos )

While the official top speed is given as M2.8, you could easily tell that the real figure was M3.0+. Reason: the original Onyx could itself do M3. Drdo has an old habit of understating capabilities while foriegn manufacturers typically overstate theirs. Interesting contrast.

Let's not forget that there is also an anti radiation version of NG under dev for the IN. Imagine what that could do (PHH seeker) to enemy HVA in the A2A role.

 

[marich01]

Is it necessary to use brahmos NG for A2A roles, when Astra mk3 can go upto 380km,

The concept is not using brahmos NG, rather using the same tech and airframe mostly. A missile is combination of certain technology building blocks combined as a product. In this case a liquid ramjet fueled air to air engagement article.

It can also be a solid fuel ramjet , a scramjet if you are willing , a DMRJ , a three/multi pulse solid motor, a RDE miniaturised as well provided each tech base satisfies certain conditions that are suited for a mission.

 

[snakeeyes07]

It is a balanced Pakistani assessment of Brahmos employment in Op Sindoor.

My counter points:
Re Pakistan navy front, I don't think 12 CAMM-ER per frigate will make that much of a difference. They will have to launch 2-3 missiles for each Brahmos to increase kill probability. That means even granting them the best case scenario, only 4-6 could be defended by each frigate. One hit onto these frigates would be a total kill.

Indian navy surface fleet ships carry 8 and 16 each. Given our geography, in near future we should be able to place ER version and LRASHM coastal batteries around Bhuj interlined into INS network to target PNS ships in their EEZ all the way till Gwadar. This will save Brahmos on INS ships as they are harder to replenish during war time.

Also, if they switch to a submarine heavy force then given their geography they are good candidate for SOSUS type sensor wall to be created, just like NATO did in GIUK gap during cold war. GIUK was more than 3x length than a possible SOSUS network against Pakistan. SMART missile off the coast could be an option in the kill chain too.

Re their defense option against Brahmos, they might increase their interception rate but a sophisticated employment strategy by India can make sure that the balance would still be heavily in our favor. We can have time on target based attacks employing waves of loitering munition & older stocks of Brahmos coming in first then more lethal newer ones coming behind them. Given Pakistan economy, I think each of their potential sites will run out of interceptors after 2-3 such TOT attacks.

 

[CATS @hunter]

The concept is not using brahmos NG, rather using the same tech and airframe mostly. A missile is combination of certain technology building blocks combined as a product. In this case a liquid ramjet fueled air to air engagement article.

It can also be a solid fuel ramjet , a scramjet if you are willing , a DMRJ , a three/multi pulse solid motor, a RDE miniaturised as well provided each tech base satisfies certain conditions that are suited for a mission.

We now already have solid fuel ramjet & liquid fueled ramjet inhouse currently, we can convert STAR for A2A roles, it fulfills every criteria, it's smaller, less weight, supersonic speed,
But converting brahmos NG into A2A missile is a financial burden,
They should fast-track upgrade current ramjet engine to 4.5 Mach, oynx will now get the 4.5 mach speed, brahmos should not take it's time, and brahmos NG is now a crucial project for Us, with Chinese freebies to pakistan J-35, Pl-17, HQ-19, KJ-500, getting NG is within timeline is necessary for us,

They should look STAR beyond aireal target practice missile, we can convert it into S2S,A2A, A2G, missile