Turkey - Pakistan - Saudi Arabia joint defense pact
- Thread starter Ashwin
- Start date
Will the believers of Allah unite against the better believers of Allah?
As i said earlier. They can't build a motorcycle. So whats there to fear from these inbr*ds. Remember, they're already assembling Chinese stuff and theyre gonna get the J35 (this is a serious threat, the only serious threat). Even then we whooped them.
So them assembling some Turkish drones makes no difference. In any real conflict all of their factories are within range of our missiles and can be flattened.
As for the Arabs, a monkey armed with a twig is a more formidable soldier than the best soldier in an Arab army. These guys got licked by a handful of Jews in the desert (3 times). What else is to say about them.
This is essentially a tripartite of jokers.
I believe this alliance is primarily aimed at the UAE . It could also be against non state actors like the Houthis.
Here's what I posted in the other forum.
This alliance is not so much against the Iranians , (although that's a consideration too but you don't exactly get into an alliance in the middle of a conflict as jointmanship is a factor which can't materialise in such a short timespan on the go . This isn't juggad ) as it is against the UAE I suspect.
With Qatar out of the equation thanks to Iran taking out a few gas fields which'd take a few years to get back online , Turdogan needs a new sponsor for his weapons program.
That's where KSA comes in with Paxtan to provide the boots on the ground. Paxtan can't afford to go up against Iran with anywhere between 15-20% of its population comprising of Shi'a . Besides why would Turkey open up a front against Iran ?
As far as India goes given KSA has considerable investments in India they'd be cautious not to be drawn into an Indo Pak conflagration which Paxtan would try its best to do.
Turkey doesn't need a second invitation though its participation would be restricted to arms supply & occasional technical support on ground like last time .
India needs to draw KSA into investing more into India & get Indian businesses to invest in KSA. There's no mutual enmity between the two countries though having said that UAE would try to use us against them if this alliance is brought to bear upon the UAE.
As long as the US is still the sole super power they won't let things cross a certain threshold but with the US distracted & over stretched this alliance essentially is also a hedge for the future.
Nonetheless the ME is a snake pit with rapidly shifting loyalties & alliances where people say something think something else & do something entirely different.
Basically like Paxtan all the ME states including Iran & Turkey believe in punching above their weight. We're the exact opposite of these states. Having said that , the deeper we get involved in the ME the more we have our task cut out .
Once again we should've been proactive here & developed ties with Somaliland if we didn't want to establish formal diplomatic ties with them by recognising Somaliland .
Ostensibly the reason we aren't doing so is because Somaliland is a breakaway province of Somalia which is to say our BA Hons in Eng Lit babooos in the MEA are hesitant about setting a precedent given the repercussions it'd have say in Kashmir.
While this is understandable given none of the African countries have recognised it too , it hasn't prevented some of them from having informal ties with Somaliland which we could too given the strategic implications of Turkey having deep strategic & defence ties with Somalia.
This directly impinges on our interest in the IOR especially given Turkey's aim of having an Aircraft Carrier fleet which in all likelihood would be based in Somalia , a base for its space ventures & boots on the ground in the form of bases for its Air Force & Army .
None of the major powers have recognised Somaliland which for all practical purposes is an independent country though not a sovereign state except for Israel. Not even the UAE has done so in spite of having close ties with Somaliland.
I suspect we'd be using our ties with UAE to further our interests in Somaliland which is the wrong way to go about things as there's no convergence of interests between us in that region except for the fact both Turkey & UAE are supporting opposing sides in Africa.
If you want to know another reason Turkey is in an alliance with KSA & Paxtan check out the opposing sides Turkey & the UAE support in active conflicts across Asia & Africa.
This is one of the reasons I suspect this alliance while on the face of it seems aimed at Iran is actually meant to undermine the UAE.
Google Search
I think it should be clear now why the President of the UAE Al Nahyan also the ruler of Abu Dhabi made a whistle stop tour of India in January this year with his cabinet meeting Modi for only a couple of hours elevating relations between the UAE & India into a strategic partnership which is short hand for an alliance given India's aversion to formal alliances.
Another example of why the ME is a snake pit & the wheels within wheels within wheels now increasingly becoming a characteristic of foreign affairs throughout the world especially in our immediate & extended neighborhood.
Here's what I posted in the other forum.
This alliance is not so much against the Iranians , (although that's a consideration too but you don't exactly get into an alliance in the middle of a conflict as jointmanship is a factor which can't materialise in such a short timespan on the go . This isn't juggad ) as it is against the UAE I suspect.
With Qatar out of the equation thanks to Iran taking out a few gas fields which'd take a few years to get back online , Turdogan needs a new sponsor for his weapons program.
That's where KSA comes in with Paxtan to provide the boots on the ground. Paxtan can't afford to go up against Iran with anywhere between 15-20% of its population comprising of Shi'a . Besides why would Turkey open up a front against Iran ?
As far as India goes given KSA has considerable investments in India they'd be cautious not to be drawn into an Indo Pak conflagration which Paxtan would try its best to do.
Turkey doesn't need a second invitation though its participation would be restricted to arms supply & occasional technical support on ground like last time .
India needs to draw KSA into investing more into India & get Indian businesses to invest in KSA. There's no mutual enmity between the two countries though having said that UAE would try to use us against them if this alliance is brought to bear upon the UAE.
As long as the US is still the sole super power they won't let things cross a certain threshold but with the US distracted & over stretched this alliance essentially is also a hedge for the future.
Nonetheless the ME is a snake pit with rapidly shifting loyalties & alliances where people say something think something else & do something entirely different.
Basically like Paxtan all the ME states including Iran & Turkey believe in punching above their weight. We're the exact opposite of these states. Having said that , the deeper we get involved in the ME the more we have our task cut out .
Once again we should've been proactive here & developed ties with Somaliland if we didn't want to establish formal diplomatic ties with them by recognising Somaliland .
Ostensibly the reason we aren't doing so is because Somaliland is a breakaway province of Somalia which is to say our BA Hons in Eng Lit babooos in the MEA are hesitant about setting a precedent given the repercussions it'd have say in Kashmir.
While this is understandable given none of the African countries have recognised it too , it hasn't prevented some of them from having informal ties with Somaliland which we could too given the strategic implications of Turkey having deep strategic & defence ties with Somalia.
This directly impinges on our interest in the IOR especially given Turkey's aim of having an Aircraft Carrier fleet which in all likelihood would be based in Somalia , a base for its space ventures & boots on the ground in the form of bases for its Air Force & Army .
None of the major powers have recognised Somaliland which for all practical purposes is an independent country though not a sovereign state except for Israel. Not even the UAE has done so in spite of having close ties with Somaliland.
I suspect we'd be using our ties with UAE to further our interests in Somaliland which is the wrong way to go about things as there's no convergence of interests between us in that region except for the fact both Turkey & UAE are supporting opposing sides in Africa.
If you want to know another reason Turkey is in an alliance with KSA & Paxtan check out the opposing sides Turkey & the UAE support in active conflicts across Asia & Africa.
This is one of the reasons I suspect this alliance while on the face of it seems aimed at Iran is actually meant to undermine the UAE.
Google Search
I think it should be clear now why the President of the UAE Al Nahyan also the ruler of Abu Dhabi made a whistle stop tour of India in January this year with his cabinet meeting Modi for only a couple of hours elevating relations between the UAE & India into a strategic partnership which is short hand for an alliance given India's aversion to formal alliances.
Another example of why the ME is a snake pit & the wheels within wheels within wheels now increasingly becoming a characteristic of foreign affairs throughout the world especially in our immediate & extended neighborhood.
Diplomatically, the Pakistanis get a lot of mileage out of forums like OIC on Kashmir, etc. An 'Islamic NATO' mutual defence agreement would be the mil equivalent, facilitating a free flow of tech, plugging gaps in Pak's arsenal and eventually their MIC.
So far, they were largely reliant on Chinese hardware which let them down badly during Op Sindoor. Top of the line Euro stuff remained out of bounds for lack of hard cash (except for some naval SAMs from Italy).
Turkey gives them access to Euro tech, at friendship prices. Plus integration into Turkish defence supply chains (even if as a Tier 3 partner) brings them valuable forex and upskilling opportunities that would eventually end up flowing into strategic progs.
Bayraktar is helping Pak develop small SOWs like Kagem V3/Kemankes which are similar to those being provided by the US/NATO to Ukraine. The Russians have had a tough time against this class of weapon.
For the Arabs, Pak has historically been nothing more than a gun for hire, but recognition as a 'partner', gives them an ego boost and emboldens the PA to target Kashmir.
To launch those SOWs they would have to come within range of our SAMs. 200 km aint gonna cut it, M2 or S400 would have long fired several shots to intercept those aircraft.
And what type of Euro tech are they gonna get access to? I think its a stretch to say Turkish stuff can match Euro stuff. Only hair in the soup is Kaan and its euro electronics. But its more likely they will get J35 instead as Kaan will need more time.
For one, they were close to getting French RC400 and MICA AAMs for their JF-17s.
As a NATO member, Turkey can easily tap into Western electronics and components for their local products. Its why some of their projects like the Hurkus AJT have had such a short development cycle.
Third party exports might need approval but the Turks can get around that hurdle by using alternative suppliers like Ukraine (for helicopter engines, etc).
No AD system has a 100% intercept rate and Chinese elint could well sniff out gaps in our radar coverage like NATO is doing for Ukraine. We need more elint/infrared assets in space to detect missile launches, datalinks, etc and provide early warning. These could help our jets avoid pop-up attacks by PL-15/16, too. Hopefully SBS-3 will arrive on time to plug those gaps.
Def. X and some even in def. forums spend lot of time chasing 5th Gen. tech and hyping up various other aerial platforms. ELINT, AWACS, SAT ISR, and ECM are left aside like step children.
In the next round they will try Thier 100% for a visible damage in india, they might have planned & gathered most of the info about Indian AD system where it's strong and where it's weak by now with the Chinese help, they will get additional SAM from turkey & SOW,
We can't neturalise every aerial target but we have to minimise them,
We need more AD rich environment, and for that BMD -1 can't be restricted to Delhi NCR & mumbai, it has to cover punjab, j&k, himachal, rajasthan, gujrat, & other area's,
And the navy first targets should be hunting down those subs from the first hours, asserting complete dominance over indian Ocean & gulf sea,
And for the air force & army striking every major airbases & radar installation, SAM sites form the get go with volumes of fire, which will push them in defensive position, then picking out thier SPG units to limit the causality & damage off in the north, & cutting the KKH-1 highway completely, so that the reinforcement can be delayed for them, the first blow has to big & powerful simultaneously,
The quickly we make the realise they are venerable the sooner they will fold and we minimise our attrition rate, the longer we strech our attrition increases, yes we will come out top due to prolonged war, due to sheer economical & industrial capacity but there will be some serious infra & other damages we have to endure, the longer it takes more players get involved the messier it becomes, the equation changes very often,
The production line of akash variants, qrsam, BMD also should go to private vendors, we need multiple production line, and the pralay & lrlacm lines too, the more the volume the sooner pakistan will surrender