Mirage 2000H, MiG-29UPG, Jaguar DARIN III - Medium Multirole Aircraft of IAF

According to industrial reports, that's what seems to have happened:

Honeywell was accommodating, even going so far as to equip itself with a reformed cell to validate the integration of the F125IN, but at one point had to react to Indian delays and unilaterally change the negotiation/invoicing mode, they significantly increased the bill to include some kind of Indian bullshit insurance policy.

In concrete terms, they made them a first good deal, the company invested out of their pocket to develop the engine and think about integration, they refined their industrial plan (especially in Taiwan), etc. etc.. But the Indians, as usual, dragged it out, procrastinated, and "go ahead and check that the supplier isn't trying to screw me", and that I'm nitpicking about the little lines of the contract, and that "I don't have the money right now but I swear next Wednesday you'll come back next Wednesday I have your 5000 dollars, Jack! Don't touch my children!", etc.

So when the Indians came back with a proposal for a rotten deal (basically they don't want to pay penalties if they reduce their order, or in case of spreading orders, that kind of nonsense), Honeywell gave them an enemy price, which was very badly taken/understood by the Indians - those who have the curious habit of considering what they are told as immutable and eternal whereas for themselves, everything is changeable.

Basically Honeywell wanted to be sure to recover their costs even if the Indians stop everything after 20 deliveries of engines. And I will give you the details of the atmosphere between the engine manufacturer and the integrator who is none other than.... HAL of course!!!

Rolls Royce had been disloyal from the very beginning of the consultation.

So as usual in India, it's not surprising: By being afraid of being plucked, Indians are losing billions of dollars and decades of industrial development and operational readiness.
May be they should have learned from the french on how to go back on RFI or jack up prices after signing the contract.
 
May be they should have learned from the french on how to go back on RFI or jack up prices after signing the contract.
May be they should have learned from the french on how to go back on RFI or jack up prices after signing the contract.
The only contract we signed for the Rafale is the one for the 36 aircraft we're going to deliver to you, I don't think we've increased the price of the contract we signed for the Mirage 2000 upgrade too, so I don't see what we could teach in the US.
 
The only contract we signed for the Rafale is the one for the 36 aircraft we're going to deliver to you, I don't think we've increased the price of the contract we signed for the Mirage 2000 upgrade too, so I don't see what we could teach in the US.
You conveniently forgot about scorpion deal ? or how HAL local production was part of the RFI which you participated but did not factor any related expenses to win L1. And derailed the whole process? don't get me started.
 
You conveniently forgot about scorpion deal ? or how HAL local production was part of the RFI which you participated but did not factor any related expenses to win L1. And derailed the whole process? don't get me started.
If we had really done that, the Indian side would have had to eliminate us from the competition. However, it did not do so and on the contrary agreed to order 36 Rafale from us in a context where HAL was eliminated, which shows who was really responsible for the problems.
 
If we had really done that, the Indian side would have had to eliminate us from the competition. However, it did not do so and on the contrary agreed to order 36 Rafale from us in a context where HAL was eliminated, which shows who was really responsible for the problems.
Yes they should have and thats part of the problem.

Of course, we have a broken procurement system. But, Don't bitch about it when you are milking it.
 
Yes they should have and thats part of the problem.

Of course, we have a broken procurement system. But, Don't bitch about it when you are milking it.
I don't see why we're being accused of anything. We have to adapt to your supply system and if we make a mistake we are eliminated from competition. But you are never satisfied, we should always do you extraordinary favors like selling you planes at half price. This is not how commerce works, for a contract to be signed, both parties must be satisfied or the contract is not signed. And finally I still have the impression that the French and the Indians are getting along better and better, so it can't be that unbalanced.
 
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Pinch of salt. The terminology for 2 and 5 are wrong and 5 may not necessarily be ready, and it doesn't make financial sense to buy it for just 1 squadron, although it will be welcome if true. No such thing as R-77RVV, there's only RVV-AE and RVV-SD. Could be referring to RVV-SD. And it's FGA-35, not FGA50.

Everything else is already on Mig-29UPG.

Because of the mistakes made, I wouldn't pay too much attention to it.
 
Status Update :

Mirage 2000 : Service Use Clearance was accorded by RCMA for the FOC upgraded Mirage 2000 I/TI aircraft on 29th May 2018..In-house developed MC2 Mission Computer has been cleared for service use and series upgrade commenced during the year 2018-19. Provisional clearance for DASHIV Helmet was also accorded by RCMA during the year.The first upgraded Mirage 2000 aircraft to IOC standard with indigenous modification kits was delivered by the company to IAF on 1st January, 2019.

Jaguar DARIN III : Final Operational Clearance (FOC) Weapon trials carried out in May 2018. During the year, ServiceClearance & Production clearance for Jaguar DARIN-IIIMission Computer (MC) has been received and series manufacturing commenced in March, 2019. Clearances for all the LRU obtained from RCMA except for RWR, TCU & Lighting panel (Trainer). So far 436 flight trails have been completed and the programme is moving closer to FOC.
 
Status Update :

Mirage 2000 : Service Use Clearance was accorded by RCMA for the FOC upgraded Mirage 2000 I/TI aircraft on 29th May 2018..In-house developed MC2 Mission Computer has been cleared for service use and series upgrade commenced during the year 2018-19. Provisional clearance for DASHIV Helmet was also accorded by RCMA during the year.The first upgraded Mirage 2000 aircraft to IOC standard with indigenous modification kits was delivered by the company to IAF on 1st January, 2019.

Jaguar DARIN III : Final Operational Clearance (FOC) Weapon trials carried out in May 2018. During the year, ServiceClearance & Production clearance for Jaguar DARIN-IIIMission Computer (MC) has been received and series manufacturing commenced in March, 2019. Clearances for all the LRU obtained from RCMA except for RWR, TCU & Lighting panel (Trainer). So far 436 flight trails have been completed and the programme is moving closer to FOC.
Do we know the final cause of the M2000 Crash at HAL? at one point - the fault was put at this MC2 mission computer correct?
 
The afforadability increased. Post 2011 to Modi's rule was 4% era, with a recession-filled future. That ended all chances of tenders going anywhere. Now we are in 7% era with promising future growth.

Euro Dollar exchange rates did also change.
 
28 Sep, 28 Sqn tarmac buzzed with roars of last 02 Legacy Mig29.A/c tookoff& carried out flypast over Ojhar to mark end of an era. A/c were received at 11BRD #IAF for upgrade& OH. To mark the historic event, Air Cmde SV Borade AOC handed over the souvenir plaque to CO.

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History headline: Mirage-2000 to Rafale, the story in between

It is time we get over our hang-ups and get more professional in what we do. The noise of politicising over every military acquisition is now deafening.
Written by S Krishnaswamy |Updated: October 13, 2019 11:16:33 am

The writer is a former Chief of Air Staff

Mirage-759.jpg

The first Mirage-2000 squadron was flown to Gwalior from France in June 1985. (Express photo)

IN NOVEMBER 1980, a few of us were assembled under the leadership of then Air Commodore Prithi Singh, an experienced test pilot, and given some papers to study. These were about the Mirage-2000. We were to evaluate the aircraft in France as a possible counter to Pakistan’s F-16. At the time, we did not have any aircraft that could directly take on an F-16 in air. Soviets were far more secretive and offered the MIG-23MF which was no match against the highly manoeuvrable F-16. The MIG-29 was still unknown at the time.

We were pulled out from various places. I was then commanding a squadron and was chosen to be the team’s second test pilot. There were five engineers led by Group Captain I G Krishna. It was the first fly-by-wire combat aircraft, still in prototype stage, that the Indian Air Force would be exposed to. On December 8, 1980, Air Commodore Singh took the first flight and I flew the fifth Mirage-2000 prototype the next day. We flew a few more sorties, thereafter, covering supersonic speeds to very low-level flight over the sea. It was a remarkable aircraft as was the experience. The aircraft employed technology and concepts outclassing any other that we had experienced and brought a totally new dimension to prosecuting air war.

Last week, as Defence Minister Rajnath Singh took a sortie in a Rafale fighter aircraft after an official handover ceremony of the first jet acquired by the Indian Air Force, my mind went back to another aircraft from the Dassault stable, the Mirage-2000.

The first Mirage-2000 squadron was flown to Gwalior from France in June 1985 — of the 40 Mirage-2000s acquired by the IAF, 26 with the M53-5 engine were flown down. These engines were subsequently replaced by the more powerful P2. The RDM Radar that the aircraft had needed to undergo many improvements and software changes. The two squadrons flew a lot and became operational in record time. The aircraft proved highly reliable and the support from the French manufacturer was excellent.

Since induction, the capability of the fleet was continually improved. We managed to integrate excellent sensors, weapons and upgrade the avionics.

Two years later, in 1987, I was at the Air Headquarters as the head of Air Staff Requirement where one of my missions was to follow up on the Mirage-2000 fleet, and to focus on the development of LCA (Light Combat Aircraft) which was evolving with support from the designers of the Mirage-2000. Very soon, all hell broke loose. Many criticisms started appearing in news media. The Sunday Mail came out with an article on October 18, 1987, with the headline, ‘How the French Duped India’. It was nasty and incorrect.

The two Mirage squadrons were working continually towards improving their mission capability. They got operational on mid-air refuelling during day and night. They proved their worth in dramatic ways during the Kargil conflict and recently at the Balakot strike. With a very limited fleet of some 50 aircraft, they kept their lead, evolving tactics and strategy to combat enemy in the air as well to strike strategic targets.

Mirage-2000 systems and avionics became the examples to evolve those of LCA and for upgrading other fleets. TACDE (Tactics and Air Combat Development Establishment), the premier institution for evolving aerial warfare tactics, started working closely with the Mirage-2000 squadrons. The contribution of the Mirage-2000 to the IAF is enormous and it proved those who branded the aircraft as mere air show pieces as liars and venomous.

When we acquired the Mirage-2000 in 1982, there was an option to build 150 of these under license. The option was never exercised. It is a pity that in 2019, we target the LCA Mk-2 to have at least the same capability as that of the Mirage-2000. We could well have produced these at HAL under license.

In the ’90s, we acquired second hand MIG-21 Trainers to overcome shortage and we now plan to buy second hand MIG-29s. The MIG-29 is superb in its air superiority role but it does not have the same quality and versatility as that of the Mirage-2000. At the end of the day, the Air Force bears the responsibility and the bureaucracy exercises the power to say yes or no, while the government takes a distant stand.

It is time we get over our hang-ups and get more professional in what we do. The noise of politicising over every military acquisition is now deafening.

History headline: Mirage-2000 to Rafale, the story in between
 
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When we acquired the Mirage-2000 in 1982, there was an option to build 150 of these under license. The option was never exercised. It is a pity that in 2019, we target the LCA Mk-2 to have at least the same capability as that of the Mirage-2000. We could well have produced these at HAL under license.

We should not repeat the mistake in case of Rafale.
 
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