Mega Made-In-India Kalashnikov Assault Rifle Deal Before Year End

Milspec

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Dec 2, 2017
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Well the thing is
1.The european and american options are much more costlier.Army is cash strapped atm.We have to equip a million men.
2.Reliability of AK is legendary.Given the acute environments we have to operate in from jungles,to desert to mountains we need a reliable gun.
3.Our infantry is already fully acquainted with kalashnikovs and so transition is smooth.
4.Ak-103 is actually a very effective rifle,only slightly inferior to its AR counterparts.

For marksmen we need to replace the dragunovs.And every battalion posted at Loc should be equipped with specialized sniper platoons armed with barretts/steyr.

Respectfully Disagree;

1. In today's date a PSA or a BCA AR15 costs in the civilian market about $299 compare that to American made AK from PSA at $500; AR15 type platforms have only become cheaper with time.

Next about being cash strapped, lets say you can broker a decent 6.5 grendel or a 5.56N, or even a 7.62x39; Short stroke piston gun from US for say $600 which is significant given the volume; you are looking at 600 million dollars to equip the army with a modern accurate long range multi caliber system (Every AR15 type platform is a multicaliber system). If the government can spend 460 Million for a statue, I am sure 600 million for a Decent rifle system is not a tall task.

2. Sure it is, but lets not assume one caliber is going to solve it all for india. I have nothing against the AK, Own one and I love it, but if you want your infantry to be able to shoot further, shoot consistent, you ought to look at solutions which are more accurate. At longer ranges ranges AKM's become challenging.

3. Transitioning from a AK to AR type ergonomics ( which includes bren, scar, acr, 416, ) is not a tall task. This is not akin to teaching Fourier transforms to infantry, if Infantry can cope with tavor and it's funky mag release, modern system will be a breeze.

4. AK's are great rifles, there is no doubt about it. It's not inferior when it comes to reliability or quality. It's not inferior but different in comparison to say M16 type system, with which you will be able to engage targets upto a longer ranges with lesser bullet drop. For scoped variants you will be able to see your target rather than completely loosing it from the sight picture, you will be able to direct sustained fire at a closer grouping, you will be able to use the comb on your stock for a better shooting stance and better hit probability, your follow up shots will be less effected due to offset piston, you can have an adjustable trigger pull for better shot placement, you can adjust your length of pull if you are a taller individual, you can change your upper receiver to swap to a different caliber within stanag offerings. These are not any feature that are superior to AK, these are just features inherent to the AR derivative platforms which can be utilized by a modern force to reduce workload, engage faster and perform more effectively as a squad in operational theaters.

SVD Dragonuvs: This is one of the rifles which I have no complains about, it is not a sniper system, its a DMR system and it stacks up right there with the M110 DMR system. This is one system if we can produce in wide numbers we absolutely should, or buy them if still available from isveshk if we can. That PSO scope on it is the most effective man killing scope ever fielded. If anything get them to make a 8x scope and call it day.

Sniper systems are essential to be fielded but not as replacements for Dragonuvs, but I really really hope they dont get that new Steyr rifle that replaced the 69, the Schmidt and bender glass on the rifle costs about $5000, twice the cost of rifle it sits on. There are far better options in .338 LM out there that can make excellent Sniper system. Even the 300 winmag and 6.5 creedmoor today are very good round for snipers.
 
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Milspec

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There is actually no dearth of funds, only the trend for funds to lapse due to the glacial pace of decision making at the MoD and mandatory 'volunteering savings' needs to be stopped (but then, how will the govt show control of fiscal deficit?). But for that, the armed forces need to get their act together, a fat chance, as they have their own turf wars, egged on gleefully by the bureaucracy, to fight. Eg of the Attack Helicopters.
Maybe the Army should talk to Anil bhai? :devilish:
 

vikata

Well-Known member
Jan 5, 2018
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305
delhi

Very favourable review for AK 103and colonel has declared insas as DEAD WOOD

Wish he could have invited some one from drdo as well to get the other side
 
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randomradio

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Nov 30, 2017
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There is actually no dearth of funds, only the trend for funds to lapse due to the glacial pace of decision making at the MoD and mandatory 'volunteering savings' needs to be stopped (but then, how will the govt show control of fiscal deficit?). But for that, the armed forces need to get their act together, a fat chance, as they have their own turf wars, egged on gleefully by the bureaucracy, to fight. Eg of the Attack Helicopters.

Procurement has to be consolidated through a joint chiefs. Turf wars will largely end with a single boss.
 

randomradio

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Nov 30, 2017
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Or PMO can step in.

What do you want the PMO to do, take sides? That would overstep their mandate. This will end up handing over military procurement completely to bureaucrats.

The forces need to be more professional about it, nothing else. Once the joint chiefs system is set up, the procurement process from the military's side will be headed by one man, not 3 men, where the chief of staff can shut down the other 3 service chiefs. Weapons will then be purchased based on a more concrete priority list and not because one side has lobbied better than the other.
 

Milspec

सर्वदा शक्तिशाली; सर्वत्र विजय
Moderator
Dec 2, 2017
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What do you want the PMO to do, take sides? That would overstep their mandate. This will end up handing over military procurement completely to bureaucrats.

The forces need to be more professional about it, nothing else. Once the joint chiefs system is set up, the procurement process from the military's side will be headed by one man, not 3 men, where the chief of staff can shut down the other 3 service chiefs. Weapons will then be purchased based on a more concrete priority list and not because one side has lobbied better than the other.
Relax, that was a rafale joke.
 

TrueSpirit

New member
Mar 24, 2019
7
1
SomeWhere

Very favourable review for AK 103and colonel has declared insas as DEAD WOOD

Wish he could have invited some one from drdo as well to get the other side

Excellent discussion. Frank & to-the-point. Rajya Sabha TV is the probably the only sane TV channel in India