INS Vikrant (IAC1) & INS Vikramaditya - News & Discussions

[_Anonymous_]

On Mondays, conflict'd break out in 2023.
On Tuesdays, we're ready in 2023 as I predicted, hence difficult to see any conflict this decade.

Besides the MSC or whatever we've raised by way of the MSC was ready by 2019 -20 itself minus the weapons which the IA started procuring on an emergency basis once the incidents on the LAC unfolded in 2020.

The IN is good enough for this decade. Even beyond that but not by much , with what they've planned & is under construction. Enough to deter but not counter or overwhelm the PLAN.

The danger would start manifesting itself from 2030 onwards & come late 2030's . That's when one's see a, PLAN equipped with 6-8 AC BGs, fully equipped & adequately trained but more importantly with their string of pearls in place to challenge the IN on it's turf.

 

[_Anonymous_]

I think the government is betting on not having a major conflict with China for the coming decade. That's my assumption considering their lack of urgency in upgrading IAF fleet for example. China is too bogged down in the Pacific at the moment. That should be their main focus for the time being. It would be a nightmare if Pakistan was in a strong position economically with an appetite for conflict. Thankfully for us, that's not the case.

It looks like that & I'm afraid it's going to haunt them for a very long time.

I would be very surprised if we saw any meaningful progress regarding IAC2 within the next 5 years.

I think you'd see a decision on it in a couple of yrs.

Like you said; better ASW capability, long range air launched torpedoes and better ISR integration with Japan and the US is the best card we can play for now.

The time is ripe for us steal a chunk of China's manufacturing exports. That will deal a bigger blow to them more than any carrier ever could.

WiP. But we've some way to go. Frankly I don't quite know what it is as there are no figures in the public domain but India should be targeting anywhere between 50-60% business exiting China. The US & Japan are backing us to the hilt. Not so much the EU. Then of course we've Taiwan , RoK, etc

 

[_Anonymous_]

IAF & IN unable to spend 48% & 44% of their CAPEX till 1st Feb.

Nothing wrong in not a big increase in defence budget if the forces continuously fail to fully exploit the allocated resources.

The FM's power of veto on spending after budget allocation is fixed for the Defence Forces ought to go. Other than that the surrendered monies should go into a non returnable fund & whatever budget is allocated for the succeeding yr shoult be added on to the previous years unspent monies .

 

[Ankit Kumar]

The FM's power of veto on spending after budget allocation is fixed for the Defence Forces ought to go. Other than that the surrendered monies should go into a non returnable fund & whatever budget is allocated for the succeeding yr shoult be added on to the previous years unspent monies .

The CCS approval on AMCA funding isn't pending due to gov delays, it's pending currently under IAF which is taking full stipulated time to sign it.

Finance Ministry has only flagged serious cases. They have been mostly correct.

IAF should stop trying to be an armed force in itself and actually start being an airforce. Start acting as an Airforce.

It's time we stop abusing only the IAS staff.

 

[Ankit Kumar]

It's a one-off situation. We were gonna pay 28k Cr to the Russians and that didn't pan out, either due to the failure in setting up a payment mechanism or the war itself. So the money was going towards signed contracts.

Read first.

Full CAPEX was 1.5 lakh crores. Only 80k crore spent. 28k crore for Russians.

That leaves how much? 42000 crores.

28k is miniscule in front of the 42k crores.

And this is not the 1st time. Last march we saw an order for maybe 15000 Konkurs & 10000 Milan 2Ts just so that the then left out funds are utilised. The Armed Forces are failing again and again, year after year to utilise the funds. And it's only getting worse.

 

[D68]

It looks like that & I'm afraid it's going to haunt them for a very long time.



I think you'd see a decision on it in a couple of yrs.






WiP. But we've some way to go. Frankly I don't quite know what it is as there are no figures in the public domain but India should be targeting anywhere between 50-60% business exiting China. The US & Japan are backing us to the hilt. Not so much the EU. Then of course we've Taiwan , RoK, etc

Numbers are not good. I can't find the info right now but with most corporations adapting the China plus one policy; Vietnam has attracted around 30 companies to set up shop in their country while we are at a paltry 3/4.

Apple is a big one but they did force change in labour laws allowing for 12hr shifts and 48hrs max per week, which in all fairness is pretty standard across the world.

 

[D68]

I have been to industry connects with US companies, and the media won't quote this but they have openly showed their disconnect with the local/state level government.

Paper work regarding water & electricity are even blocked by state governments in India. The only way we steal China's manufacturing is that we totally abolish/restrict powers of state & local level governments.

A certain multi national IT company even revealed that for setting up a simple office space in Patna , they were harrassed so much so that they are now focusing on other locations.

Not surprising. India still ranks poorly in ease of doing business, although it has improved significantly in the last decade. Burecracy is what's been slowing our growth since we became a nation. I believe it's a remnant of crown rule. Government needs to do more to tackle this in order to attract investors. 'Gati shakti' is a great initiative though, results will be visible in 5yrs probably. Complete control by central gov is not the solution. We may be a republic but we function more like to a federation. Inter-state competition can be healthy once the right guidelines are laid down by central gov.

World Bank Open Data

Free and open access to global development data

data.worldbank.org

 

[_Anonymous_]

The CCS approval on AMCA funding isn't pending due to gov delays, it's pending currently under IAF which is taking full stipulated time to sign it.

Finance Ministry has only flagged serious cases. They have been mostly correct.

IAF should stop trying to be an armed force in itself and actually start being an airforce. Start acting as an Airforce.

It's time we stop abusing only the IAS staff.

You're getting into specifics. I made a generic statement . Besides once the allocation has been made under what right is the FM going / should be to object / objecting ?

My larger point was the FM allocating monies to the Defence Ministry & then refusing to release it citing exigencies. What's the point in budgeting then ? And this opprobrious practise has been on since Chacha's time . In fact he initiated the trend .

 

[_Anonymous_]

Numbers are not good. I can't find the info right now but with most corporations adapting the China plus one policy; Vietnam has attracted around 30 companies to set up shop in their country while we are at a paltry 3/4.

Going to remain the trend for some time unfortunately.

Apple is a big one but they did force change in labour laws allowing for 12hr shifts and 48hrs max per week, which in all fairness is pretty standard across the world.

Frankly we've always had 48 hr / week shifts since ages . For those unaware this law changed the number of working hours / day & the allowing of women to work such shifts any time of the day . Women normally are prohibited working graveyard shifts in Indian factories . That's what this law amended .

 

[_Anonymous_]

Not surprising. India still ranks poorly in ease of doing business, although it has improved significantly in the last decade. Burecracy is what's been slowing our growth since we became a nation. I believe it's a remnant of crown rule. Government needs to do more to tackle this in order to attract investors. 'Gati shakti' is a great initiative though, results will be visible in 5yrs probably. Complete control by central gov is not the solution. We may be a republic but we function more like to a federation. Inter-state competition can be healthy once the right guidelines are laid down by central gov.

World Bank Open Data

Free and open access to global development data

data.worldbank.org

View attachment 27037

The idea should be to identify such states where the investment climate is more conducive to welcoming biz. China started out with establishing a handful of SEZs in coastal cities / states . That should be our cue . Don't cast youe net too wide . Target 4-5 states & ensure all biz is concentrated there .

This helps for you can then focus & design your infrastructure & legal / adminstrative laws accordingly. This also helps for the revenue then accrued can be deployed into improving the infrastructure across the nation for once these 4-5 centres reach saturation / become high cost production centres in the next 15-20 yrs , you can then shift into the hinterland.

Right now we ought to focus on TN , Karnataka , TLG , Maharashtra , Gujarat maybe UP. The next phase of mass industrialization can then move into MP , WB , AP , Rajasthan , etc . That there is the roadmap on how you develop the country thru mass industrialization .

In 15-20 yrs when the first tier production centers become financially unviable due to high costs of production we should move up the value chain there . That's what China was planning / implementing before COVID & geopolitics intervened. Arguably it's still being implemented on a smaller scale with international investment & on a larger scale with domestic industries.

 

[Bali78]

I have been to industry connects with US companies, and the media won't quote this but they have openly showed their disconnect with the local/state level government.

Paper work regarding water & electricity are even blocked by state governments in India. The only way we steal China's manufacturing is that we totally abolish/restrict powers of state & local level governments.

A certain multi national IT company even revealed that for setting up a simple office space in Patna , they were harrassed so much so that they are now focusing on other locations.

That’s the reason some states loose out big time and Bihar is one of them. My friend moved his office from Gurgaon to Bangalore and his experience has been pretty good. Everything was online and he didn’t pay a dime to anyone. That’s a big change compared to my experience a decade back.

 

[randomradio]

Read first.

Full CAPEX was 1.5 lakh crores. Only 80k crore spent. 28k crore for Russians.

That leaves how much? 42000 crores.

28k is miniscule in front of the 42k crores.

And this is not the 1st time. Last march we saw an order for maybe 15000 Konkurs & 10000 Milan 2Ts just so that the then left out funds are utilised. The Armed Forces are failing again and again, year after year to utilise the funds. And it's only getting worse.

I don't know how true that information is.

Defence gets ₹5.94 tn; ₹1.62 tn for modernization

The budget includes a revenue expenditure of ₹2.7 trillion and pension outlay of ₹1.38 trillion.

www.livemint.com

Revised estimates in the budget documents show that the armed forces were unable to spend ₹2,369 crore out of last year’s capital outlay of ₹1.52 trillion.

Also:
Last year, the armed forces spent around ₹21,000 crore on top of the previous year’s budget allocation, amid the lingering border row with China that saw India make a raft of emergency purchases and sharpen its focus on building infrastructure in forward areas.

Budget 2023 | Defence budget rises 13%; revised estimate for pension rises

Capital expenditure for military modernisation also sees 6.7% rise to ₹1.62 lakh crore

www.thehindu.com

Budget documents show that the Defence Ministry has returned about ₹2,370 crore from the capital component, a major part accounted for by the IAF, which has unspent funds of ₹1,837 crore.

With the exception of the 28k Cr for the Russians, I don't think there's enough truth being peddled. It's very likely that even the 28k Cr has already been spent by making some payments early, not counting any last minute CCS clearance for domestic projects. We are already spending more than what was allocated.

 

[randomradio]

Numbers are not good. I can't find the info right now but with most corporations adapting the China plus one policy; Vietnam has attracted around 30 companies to set up shop in their country while we are at a paltry 3/4.

Apple is a big one but they did force change in labour laws allowing for 12hr shifts and 48hrs max per week, which in all fairness is pretty standard across the world.

India is not on the top of the list for shifting industries. The US govt is encouraging businesses to opt for non-Indian countries first.

Our ease of business is pretty good, ranked alongside some European countries as well, and the govt is making concessions on a case-by-case basis, but we are being seen as a long term economic threat. Vietnam has a way worse ranking than India for example. It's all politics.

 

[_Anonymous_]

Read first.

Full CAPEX was 1.5 lakh crores. Only 80k crore spent. 28k crore for Russians.

That leaves how much? 42000 crores.

28k is miniscule in front of the 42k crores.

And this is not the 1st time. Last march we saw an order for maybe 15000 Konkurs & 10000 Milan 2Ts just so that the then left out funds are utilised. The Armed Forces are failing again and again, year after year to utilise the funds. And it's only getting worse.

Clear all OROP dues by Feb 28, 2024, Supreme Court directs Centre

Although your post pertains to CAPEX, but given this is the GoI which is capricious by nature, I wouldn't be surprised if the armed forces proposals were kept in abeyance & payments withheld to cater to this exigency. Implausible perhaps not impossible.

 

[Amarante]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1638057561294340101

 

[marich01]

There are some chatter going around now that CCS is going to clear the MRCBF 26 jets today, rafale M. No credible source reported yet so not posting tweets.
There are some chatter going around now that CCS is going to clear the MRCBF 26 jets today, rafale M. No credible source reported yet so not posting tweets.

 

[marich01]

Source is here

Cabinet Committee on Security likely to seal Rafale-M deal today​

Navy prefers it over F-18 Super Hornet for deployment on its aircraft carrier INS Vikrant
NEW DELHI: The Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) headed by Prime Minister Narendra Modi is likely to clear the multi-billion dollar acquisition of 26 Rafale Marine fighters at its meeting on Wednesday.
Sources said that the Indian Navy has expressed its preference for the French fighter aircraft Rafale Marine over US’ F-18 Super Hornet. A proposal for the purchase of Rafale Marine has been sent to the CCS.
The Indian Air Force has already acquired 36 Rafale fighters. The commonality of the fleet and the resultant savings on training, repairs and maintenance have reportedly tilted the scale in favour of Dassault’s Rafale Marine. The two versions of the aircraft have over 80 per cent common features.
These aircraft will be deployed on India’s indigenously developed aircraft carrier INS Vikrant. According to sources, the Ministry of Defence has worked out a comprehensive contract, including Performance-based Logistics, which will ensure that the Original Equipment Manufacturer will be responsible for the overall maintenance of the aircraft and the supply of spares. Dassault will also build a maintenance facility for the Rafales on INS Vikrant, besides one in Goa. The company will train the naval aviation ground crew, besides training the pilots.
The fighters will be fully loaded with all maritime systems, including the maritime search radar that is capable of detecting submarines and warships in the sea. The price of the aircraft has not been revealed yet, but sources said it will be considerably lower than the IAF version. The government has decided to make the acquisition through an inter-governmental agreement rather than going in for an open tender.
Rafale-M has been locked in a tight fight with Boeing’s Super Hornet. Sources said the Indian Navy brass was mighty impressed by the Rafale’s capabilities during a joint exercise in India recently and asked the ministry of defence to close the deal with the French vendor.
The Indian Navy has been exploring options to replace its ageing MiG-29K as a short-term solution. India has been working on developing its own twin-engine deck-based fighters as a long-term solution to its need for carrier-based fighters. But since there are still some years before the aircraft is indigenously developed, the Navy has decided to go in for the acquisition to meet its requirement. The CCS includes the ministers for defence, home, finance, and external affairs and the national security advisor.

Cabinet Committee on Security likely to seal Rafale-M deal today

NEW DELHI: The Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) headed by Prime Minister Narendra Modi is likely to clear the multi-billion dollar acquisition of 26 Rafale M

www.newindianexpress.com

 

[Amarante]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1642939081792589824

 

[Guynextdoor]

The idea should be to identify such states where the investment climate is more conducive to welcoming biz. China started out with establishing a handful of SEZs in coastal cities / states . That should be our cue . Don't cast youe net too wide . Target 4-5 states & ensure all biz is concentrated there .

This helps for you can then focus & design your infrastructure & legal / adminstrative laws accordingly. This also helps for the revenue then accrued can be deployed into improving the infrastructure across the nation for once these 4-5 centres reach saturation / become high cost production centres in the next 15-20 yrs , you can then shift into the hinterland.

Right now we ought to focus on TN , Karnataka , TLG , Maharashtra , Gujarat maybe UP. The next phase of mass industrialization can then move into MP , WB , AP , Rajasthan , etc . That there is the roadmap on how you develop the country thru mass industrialization .

In 15-20 yrs when the first tier production centers become financially unviable due to high costs of production we should move up the value chain there . That's what China was planning / implementing before COVID & geopolitics intervened. Arguably it's still being implemented on a smaller scale with international investment & on a larger scale with domestic industries.

i think the state of denial is very investible right now

 

[Fatalis]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1645026912845148161