IAF looking to acquire 2-3 squadrons of fifth-generation fighter jets from foreign sources

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IAF looking to acquire 2-3 squadrons of fifth-generation fighter jets from foreign sources
The IAF recently made a detailed presentation to the government outlining its future requirements for maintaining an edge over adversaries, defence sources told ANI.

New Delhi [India], July 24 (ANI): The Indian Air Force (IAF) is looking to acquire two to three squadrons of fifth-generation fighter jets from foreign sources to strengthen its combat capabilities until the indigenous Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA) project becomes operational.

A fighter squadron typically consists of 18 to 20 jets.

The IAF recently made a detailed presentation to the government outlining its future requirements for maintaining an edge over adversaries, defence sources told ANI. They said the IAF is looking to acquire around two to three squadrons (40-60 aircraft) in the interim till the indigenous project gets ready for meeting its operational requirements.

An empowered committee led by Defence Secretary RK Singh recommended the induction of fifth-generation fighter jets to enhance the force's deterrence and preparedness, especially along the northern and western borders.

The Indian side is showing interest in acquiring the fifth-generation fighter aircraft, when reports suggest that China is already working on sixth-generation fighter jets and may also provide its fifth-generation fighters to the Pakistan Air Force in the next few years.

The two countries from which India could potentially procure fifth-generation aircraft were the United States and Russia. However, the government has not taken any decision on the issue of fifth-generation fighter jets, but discussions are going on in this regard.

The US has offered the F-35 fighter jet, while Russia has proposed its Su-57 jets for India's consideration.India had opted out of the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGfA) project many years ago, but there is an option to rejoin it.

The F-35 has been sold to various countries by the US in Europe and outside.

India is also looking at a programme to build 114 modern 4.5 plus generation fighters in partnership with a foreign country under Make in India, and may go for a government-to-government deal after a tender.The Indian Air Force is looking to use these planes to prepare a strong deterrence all along the western and northern fronts. (ANI)
 
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IAF babus have probably got some reality check with the record breaking stealth fighter and drone production for PLAAF and PLAN that they realised that AMCope dependency will be too little too late and now want another stopgap wunderwaffe like the Rafales.
 
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FalconSlayers said:
IAF babus have probably got some reality check with the record breaking stealth fighter and drone production for PLAAF and PLAN that they realised that AMCope dependency will be too little too late and now want another stopgap wunderwaffe like the Rafales.
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So they got reality check that they decided to Import 5th Gen Wunderwaffe in numbers of such that is is produced by China in mere year. Some how Giga brained IAF thinks importing 100 5th Gen jets will save them from 100 Jets Per year PLAAF.
 
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mamiam23 said:
So they got reality check that they decided to Import 5th Gen Wunderwaffe in numbers of such that is is produced by China in mere year. Some how Giga brained IAF thinks importing 100 5th Gen jets will save them from 100 Jets Per year PLAAF.
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Even having few next generation systems changes tactical/ strategic consideration in major way when someone planning engagement with enemy. I understand this number is less but still worth it, as India is looking for necessary defense measurements as of now. It is similar case when party-A equipped with Assault rifles going to attack party-B who is equipped with Bolt action rifles, and then Party-A come to know that party-B also have couple of assault rifles with them.

I am very positive about improving our defense position in future.
 
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South block said:
We need F 35 period
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No. F35 needs a range of sensors to act as complement, America likely wont let us integrate F35 data link with our own which means it can't effectively recieve data and inputs from our AWACS and other assets, not to mention we cannot integrate our homegrown Astra or Rudram missiles on it. F35 will essentially remain a silver bullet like Rafale rather than an effective weapon part of an integrated kill chain network.

In the one in a million chance America is ok with integrating F35 with our AWACS, ground radars, sats and Astra then we should definitely go for 20-30 of such jets. Then in such a case, F35 is a true game changer for India. It means our Tejas or Sukhoi can launch Astra missiles and F35 with its powerful radar can guide it to the target while using its robust EW capability to keep the enemy blind.
 
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mamiam23 said:
So they got reality check that they decided to Import 5th Gen Wunderwaffe in numbers of such that is is produced by China in mere year. Some how Giga brained IAF thinks importing 100 5th Gen jets will save them from 100 Jets Per year PLAAF.
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Well 100 5th gen is better than 0 5th gen. And even with 2 squadrons of F35 (provided its integrated with our data link and Astras) we can hold our own against PLAAF and definitely crush PAF.
BHARAT KA BETA said:
First of all buying of a 5th generation fighter will be a geopolitical pressure game for India for both the fighters... Secondly, in my personal opinion, if buying any becomes an essential then India should go for the F35 fighter but, it should be on the following terms like: I) Integration of AIM 260 , II) Integration of Indigenous weapons, III) No enforcement for de-activation of S400 systems, IV) Allowance for using it against any of our adversaries ( excluding USA ) in any condition, V) MRO facility in India, VI) Assistance in AMCA development, VII) No enforcement for buying other 4.5 gen fighters like F21/ F16/F15 etc.... In my opinion, Su 57 is not a complete 5th generation fighter as per as the definition.... But the negotiation tactics of India with USA will be tricky & tough by having Su57 as the closest competitor
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Imo not necessarily because Su 57 is not as good as F35 but is still a LO or even VLO aircraft which can engage in BVR combat. It's electronics is definitely inferior to the F35 but we can say Russia is offering to integrate our Virupaksha and other radar on it.
 
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Shan said:
A take that deserves views:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1948456915157352710

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The GoI is making changes to the defence acquisition process to close deals within 2 yrs as against 7 years currently. There is a clause where trails could be simulated or even skipped altogether for proven equipment in service with a major military.

I think this will expedite MRFA (in any case Rafale is flying already with the IAF. Avionics and sensor trails will likely take place at DA facilities in France.) Su-57 is anybody guess. It's still WIP.
 
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Apparently an ex IN personnel on another forum now pursuing a career in the Pvt Sector with an organisation deeply embedded in the Indian defence ecosystem as far as electronics go is insisting we'd be getting the F-35 with israeli type carve outs at the very minimum & may well surpass it.

The entire process of negotiations culminating in the signing of an agreement could take upto a year or 2.

Now now sweetie , I can understand your disappointment. But we're equally disappointed too. What're we supposed to do with an FA which can't be synchronised with the IACCS & other such local protocol. Ja ? @Innominate
 
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> Without local mfg made available like with the russian platforms, no foreign procured jet will see numbers such as su30 or mig 21 sort.
> IAF consciously will not buy a fighter jet that comes with operational strings attached to it dictated by foreign OEM country
> If the platform is heavyweight class, that platform may be nuke delivery enabled ie will be considered part of triad (some nos)
> if selling country is not willing to offer localisation [and / or] indigenous weapon integration, that jet will see low sqn nos aka few gold plated items.
> We are yet to see any diversion from our chalked out strategy irrespective of pressure from foreign countries (so far).

I think the above points are sort of proven and established rule for any import case now and will be bedrock for whatever 5th gen jet we get.
if USA agree to offer their run down product in their terms, it will be small 2 sqn. Same goes for rus 5th gen esp if tied with a 4.5gen.
If local mfg allowed that jet will see higher nos inducted & MRO set up.
 
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I think , as per my personal opinion, India will not receive any of these 2 5th gen jets before 2031-2032 if it is ordered this year, which highly unlikely to be possible... Pakistan is trying to achieve aerial superiority over IAF with J35 because they are now lacking it due to presence of Rafale with Meteor... Even if India acquires a 5th gen jet ( say F35) but with not extra long range BVRAAM, then the jet makes no sense.... Even without a 5th gen fighter India can counter J35 well with help of Rafale and Upcomming Tejas Mk2 with help of extra long range BVRAAM (300+ km) with jamm proff capabilities ( I'm hoping for GANDIVA ) ...To counter PAKISTAN & CHINA successfully in long term , we can't rely on imported systems... Let's say India acquires F35 in response to J35 to Pakistan, and then Pakistan gets Chinese J36 stealth 6th generation jet in response, then what India will do ? Going to buy F47 of USA?... India should develop its own capabilities rather than getting trapped into CAT & MOUSE plot of CHINA... I don't know what our policy makers and security analysts are thinking but it is evident that India has to invest in R&D of future technologies much more and an increase in Defence Budget is need of time... We can't trust anyone, be it USA/RUSSIA/ISRAEL/FRANCE, completely.
 
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Stupid to buy FA from foreign. What's the use of jets when we lack the network around them.

Just pour money, power into AMCA to make it a success at any cost. Kick hal if they misbehave.

Buy small yet critical things from foreign with smaller bills. While build a *censored*ing armada of sensors, radars, detection capability , satellite around our hemisphere that even stealth gets useless.
You don't beat enemies by copy cat but by hitting them where it hurts. Render their J-20 stealth useless and pak will 📉.

Sure will take time for R&D to and setting up. But so will FA from outside. Build AWACS, ground radar, static sensors, AI based systems, drone ISR, more AWACS, a constellation of satellites to monitor in real time...

And become so dense networked that AMCA becomes the final piece of the puzzle. A spear head, a counter offensive weapon.. This F-35 and Su-57 both are shit for Indian needs and operations. They want big fruits when they don't even have low hanging ones.

How can forces be so negligible. It's the era of Detection. Whoever detects first has the advantage.
Curtail infra expenditure? Just curtail revadis and freebies and defense forces can have double the budget. Why go after infra.. that's the backbone of economy where the budget comes from.
_Anonymous_ said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1948408379191574534

https://twitter.com/x/status/1948623564464398563

~130 billion USD involving above mentioned imports + MII wherever possible & local projects amounts to 10-13 billion USD CAPEX outgoing for the IAF over a period of 10-13 years.

Difficult yes but entirely doable except Leaderji has open up the purse strings & curtail infrastructure expenditure a tad. Will he? I've no clue.
Click to expand...
 
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Subgradewalker said:
Stupid to buy FA from foreign. What's the use of jets when we lack the network around them.

Just pour money, power into AMCA to make it a success at any cost. Kick hal if they misbehave.

Buy small yet critical things from foreign with smaller bills. While build a *censored*ing armada of sensors, radars, detection capability , satellite around our hemisphere that even stealth gets useless.
You don't beat enemies by copy cat but by hitting them where it hurts. Render their J-20 stealth useless and pak will 📉.

Sure will take time for R&D to and setting up. But so will FA from outside. Build AWACS, ground radar, static sensors, AI based systems, drone ISR, more AWACS, a constellation of satellites to monitor in real time...

And become so dense networked that AMCA becomes the final piece of the puzzle. A spear head, a counter offensive weapon.. This F-35 and Su-57 both are shit for Indian needs and operations. They want big fruits when they don't even have low hanging ones.

How can forces be so negligible. It's the era of Detection. Whoever detects first has the advantage.
Curtail infra expenditure? Just curtail revadis and freebies and defense forces can have double the budget. Why go after infra.. that's the backbone of economy where the budget comes from.
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You're referring to the shield. Where's the sword? For us to penetrate Chinese ADS + ISR particularly space based assets we need the tip of the spear to be VLO. Where's it?

Otherwise we'd be reduced to fighting a defensive air war. I don't need to emphasize what that leads to especially in the wake of the war in Ukraine or the just concluded Iran Israel war
 
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_Anonymous_ said:
You're referring to the shield. Where's the sword? For us to penetrate Chinese ADS + ISR particularly space based assets we need the tip of the spear to be VLO. Where's it?

Otherwise we'd be reduced to fighting a defensive air war. I don't need to emphasize what that leads to especially in the wake of the war in Ukraine or the just concluded Iran Israel war
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Any war with China will immediately become a Two Front war

China will order Pakistan to attack India

China knows the Limitations that Tibet and Himalayas create for Aircraft , so they will transfer Most of their Assets to Pakistan

And we can take out their Bases with Missiles

We cannot match China Aircraft for Aircraft

So we to rely on missiles
 
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marich01 said:
> Without local mfg made available like with the russian platforms, no foreign procured jet will see numbers such as su30 or mig 21 sort.
> IAF consciously will not buy a fighter jet that comes with operational strings attached to it dictated by foreign OEM country
> If the platform is heavyweight class, that platform may be nuke delivery enabled ie will be considered part of triad (some nos)
> if selling country is not willing to offer localisation [and / or] indigenous weapon integration, that jet will see low sqn nos aka few gold plated items.
> We are yet to see any diversion from our chalked out strategy irrespective of pressure from foreign countries (so far).

I think the above points are sort of proven and established rule for any import case now and will be bedrock for whatever 5th gen jet we get.
if USA agree to offer their run down product in their terms, it will be small 2 sqn. Same goes for rus 5th gen esp if tied with a 4.5gen.
If local mfg allowed that jet will see higher nos inducted & MRO set up.
Click to expand...
If Russia offers full production of Su 57 by 2030 and integration of Astra, Virupaksha, then we can make it our 5th gen Su 30 MKI.
 
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