Cabinet nod for Semi hi-speed rail in Kerala

I dont like much train travel in Kerala. We were on a pan TN- Kerala tour with friends and after doing some activities boarded train to Kerala in sleeper. Was so much tired and we guys were sleeping. And it was morning, we entered Kerala and people, educated class boarded sleeping compartments and woke us all up.
Told its now morning and in Kerala express trains are now regular trains and sleeper is now just seater and its the rule. I was like WTF. I couldnt believe. I protested. And 5-6 people were waiting to lower our beds down. Then my friends asked me to cool down and its just another 2 hours of travel anyway.
This used to happen a lot in Bihar earlier. Don't know the current scenario though.
 
I dont like much train travel in Kerala. We were on a pan TN- Kerala tour with friends and after doing some activities boarded train to Kerala in sleeper. Was so much tired and we guys were sleeping. And it was morning, we entered Kerala and people, educated class boarded sleeping compartments and woke us all up.
Told its now morning and in Kerala express trains are now regular trains and sleeper is now just seater and its the rule. I was like WTF. I couldnt believe. I protested. And 5-6 people were waiting to lower our beds down. Then my friends asked me to cool down and its just another 2 hours of travel anyway.

This must have been somewhere between Trivandrum and Thrissur. There is a morning rush(also evening rush) as students, teachers, office workers rush to their respective destinations. I know its a bit rude, when you protest the logic given is that sleeper berths are only valid from dusk to dawn and after that it becomes a Seater.

Never understood the logic. These days only book reservations in the A/c compartment. It's hassle free this way.
 
This must have been somewhere between Trivandrum and Thrissur. There is a morning rush(also evening rush) as students, teachers, office workers rush to their respective destinations. I know its a bit rude, when you protest the logic given is that sleeper berths are only valid from dusk to dawn and after that it becomes a Seater.

Never understood the logic. These days only book reservations in the A/c compartment. It's hassle free this way.

Never faced this situation in TN though. I dont know how this system work in long distance train travel when you travel over 2 days. So people will just leave when its time to use our beds? I think it was in Palakkad though.
 
Centre gives approval for semi-high speed rail project in Kerala

Thiruvananthapuram (Kerala) [India], Dec 18 (ANI): The Centre has given in-principle approval to the Silver Line, a semi-high speed railway project from Thiruvananthapuram to Kasaragod.
Once commissioned, the semi-high speed rail corridor will reduce the travel time from Thiruvananthapuram to Kasaragod from 12 hours to 4 hours. The project is being implemented by Kerala Rail Development Corporation Limited (KRDCL), formed by the Indian Railways and the state government. The double line project can cover up to 200 km/hr.
The preliminary feasibility study had found the project viable. The proposal was sent to the Union Railway Ministry after the state cabinet approved it.
Welcoming the Centre's nod, Chief Minister Pinarayi Vijayan said the government is coming up with a plan for investment mobilization. "It is envisioned as an eco-friendly project. The 532 km railway line from Kochuveli to Kasaragod will be constructed. The rail corridor will provide half a million jobs. Up to 11,000 people will get jobs when the project is completed," he said in a statement.
The project is estimated to cost Rs 66,079 crore and at the time of the approval, the Cabinet had evaluated that it will require minimal land acquisition. (ANI)
 
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66k crores gonna waste!

Nope. If its the Congress in power and commies in opposition then it will be a waste. But since commies are the ones bringing it the plan might even breeze through.
Its good to have more railway lines in India. However with time subsidy must be abolished to improve quality, on time arrival and cleanliness.
 
Nope. If its the Congress in power and commies in opposition then it will be a waste. But since commies are the ones bringing it the plan might even breeze through.
Its good to have more railway lines in India. However with time subsidy must be abolished to improve quality, on time arrival and cleanliness.

the problem is, there is only few stations and will not benefit the major population. Such huge investment should be diverted for water transport of any other form. Getting land for this will be huge task and 200kmph will make huge noise. In cost benefit analysis, it is waste.
 
the problem is, there is only few stations and will not benefit the major population. Such huge investment should be diverted for water transport of any other form. Getting land for this will be huge task and 200kmph will make huge noise. In cost benefit analysis, it is waste.

By what metric are there only few stations? I can see from the map, atleast a station in each district. I guess people understand high speed rail isn't the normal ers srr passenger service.

This meets a very critical demand of a state of the size of Kerala, end to end connectivity in reasonable time, that too when state capital is at one end of the geography. I bet there will be good demand for this service, going by the demand for train tickets to the capital now. Also this opens up the possibility of commuting to major cities in the state instead of the haphazard development taking place now in the suburbs.

Water transport?? Are you serious? How come such a slow service help the passengers from say Kozhikode get to Thiruvananthapuram any faster and comfortable than existing methods? For freight , i agree, but semi hsr wasn't for freight transportation in the first place

Regarding land acquisition, it is a challenge.

Noise? Really? Now what else? Light pollution?

Pray to enlighten us lesser mortals with your cost benefit analysis
 
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By what metric are there only few stations? I can see from the map, atleast a station in each district. I guess people understand high speed rail isn't the normal ers srr passenger service.

This meets a very critical demand of a state of the size of Kerala, end to end connectivity in reasonable time, that too when state capital is at one end of the geography. I bet there will be good demand for this service, going by the demand for train tickets to the capital now. Also this opens up the possibility of commuting to major cities in the state instead of the haphazard development taking place now in the suburbs.

Water transport?? Are you serious? How come such a slow service help the passengers from say Kozhikode get to Thiruvananthapuram any faster and comfortable than existing methods? For freight , i agree, but semi hsr wasn't for freight transportation in the first place

Regarding land acquisition, it is a challenge.

Noise? Really? Now what else? Light pollution?

Pray to enlighten us lesser mortals with your cost benefit analysis

What critical demand you are tlaking about? This will go nearby my home and I cant catch it coz have to travel 35km up or down to get the station. This is the case of most of the people. You need to know the transportation needs of the people first. The number of people travel from one stop to another is quite low comparing inner city or district transportation. It would be the best if we get better connectivity with stops with all cities rather such high speed stuff.
 
Cross-post from skyscrapercity.

Compare this cost with the cost of driving a car. The total cost of ownership of a car works is anywhere between Rs 8-Rs 15 per km based on the make and model of the car, considering financing, depreciation, maintenance, fuel, registration, tolls etc.
Even if you just consider fuel and tolls alone for an argument's sake, it would work out to at least Rs 4-Rs 6 per km. Compare this to the proposed 2.75 Rs per km on Semi HSR. If you consider this is an elite project, then all car owning households who afford more should also be considered as elites in your definition, which means roughly 25-30% of all households in Kerala.

There are so many myths being spread around about what can be done with automatic signalling and blah blah that can improve the present system.

1. Automatic Signalling can dramatically increase capacity in sections where all/most trains run at the same speed, same stop pattern etc. In such cases, automatic signalling can significantly reduce headway between trains and increase capacity. It works very well in the Chennai and Mumbai sub-urban rail network and there are dedicated tracks. In such stretche, headways between trains can be consistenly brought down to as low as 2-3 minutes during peak hour and 5-10 minutes during off peak hours. However, in stretches like Delhi-Mathura, Chennai-Jolarppettai etc which also have automated signalling and dedicated 3rd and 4th line is some stretches, the same problem of multiple types of trains using the same track persists and so the headway is reduced to just about 10-15 minutes during the peak hour, which is not achieved consistenly throughout the day due to capacity constraints.

Whereas in our state, we have passenger trains/MEMUs/goods trains/express trains/weeklies/biweeklies/superfasts/Rajdhanis and Goods trains all sharing the same track. All these trains have different stoppage patterns and different acceleration/decceleration capabilities (esp: MEMU vs Goods trains vs a conventional loco hauled express train). In such a scenario, automated block signalling will not bring any dramatic improvement in capacity/speed. If automated signalling be of any use, we should have a dedicated 3rd and 4th to line to reduce the mix of train types using the same track. The Silver Line project is the proposed 3rd and 4th line.

2. Our lines are super saturated and doubling of Kottayam and Alappuzha (which I read has been shelved) has to be completed at the earliest. But even after doubling, we woul still need a dedicated third/fourth rail to better operate the diverse mix of trains in our network. Acquiring land along the exisiting Right of Way from TVC to SRR is very difficult. This route was initially in MG gauge which was later converted to BG hence there are many curves which limit the MPS to just 110kmph (in some stretches between TVC-QLN and QLN-KYJ) and 70-80 kmph in remaining stretches.
We need a 3rd and 4th rail, but when we build one, why should we go for such very low speed capabilities? Moreover, we are not shooting for a 300kmph type HSR but a 160-200 kmph semi HSR.
The Silver line project is the proposed 3rd/4th line and not some fancy project.

3. The total cost of NH 4 laning in Kerala is Rs 44,000 crore. The cost of this project is Rs 66,000 crore. This is not some super expensive project compared to the ones that are being undertaken now. The total LA required for this project is around 1200 hectares compared to 2600 hectares required for NH widening, to give a comparison.

4. We all can be skeptical about when the project will be implemented and rightly so considering the nature of infra projects in Kerala. But that does not take away the importance of this project how this is the only 'less unviable' options we have for a sustainable transportation for the future. Our personal vehicle numbers are booming and there is very little room to add new massive road projects in our state, towns and cities. 12 lives are lost and 120 injured everyday in Kerala on an average.
 
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What critical demand you are tlaking about? This will go nearby my home and I cant catch it coz have to travel 35km up or down to get the station. This is the case of most of the people. You need to know the transportation needs of the people first. The number of people travel from one stop to another is quite low comparing inner city or district transportation. It would be the best if we get better connectivity with stops with all cities rather such high speed stuff.

Just because the projected route doesn't stop at your gate doesn't mean others won't prefer it.

Commuting using high speed rail or semi high speed rail works the same way in all places. They won't stop at your doorstep. Providing too many stops make them physically impossible to achieve those average speeds, even if your train can run 400 odd km/h in between those stops. Well i guess you know this, still puting it here for completeness.

There are people, who would consider that 30 off km drive worthwhile, provided ample parking facilities, and take a semi hsr.

The demand I'm talking off is about the people travelling to and from TVM for various reasons. There is a good amount of traffic in this route and to this destination.

People don't travel between stops?? So you think everyone boarding a train to ernakulam is going strictly to there? In the light of reduced travel time and relative comfort hsr offer, one doesn't have to count only on passengers whose house opens to the railway station entry. Hsr will become part of the itenery, part of the choice to cover relevant distances.

Lastly how does increased urban transport facility help someone travelling to the capital from say Kozhikode? Apples and oranges? I'm not saying we don't need better urban transport but we need both
 
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At present it takes us less than an hours to fly from Bangalore to Ernakulam and then it takes close to 3 hours to travel from Kochi to my place in Mavelikara. With the Aranmula airport not likely to see the light of the day anytime soon, this semi-HSR would be boon for people like us from Alapuzha. Since there is a stop in Chegannur, we can make it to Chengannur from Kochi in a fraction of the time that it currently takes.
 
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I'm extremely worried by these new developments. Imagine this, the level of productivity in Kerala goes up coz ppl there will actually be expected to work for wages. This is against accepted Communist philosophy. Thank God for Momota in WB. At least she's furthering the cause of the left in WB continuing their legacy , not letting the bhadralok in WB feel their absence.
 
the problem is, there is only few stations and will not benefit the major population. Such huge investment should be diverted for water transport of any other form. Getting land for this will be huge task and 200kmph will make huge noise. In cost benefit analysis, it is waste.

Really? And water transport one can travel in 4 hours stopping in all points? Is there any river connecting north to south? Or if we speaking of sea transport nope you arent getting it.

If you have to travel 35km to go to nearest station to get train to work in the next districts in less than 45 min then its fine. Of course local metro, electric train is needed. But this project travels through all major population centres. They can also run short trains with various stops in between in those lines as well. But infra has to be present for all that to happen.
 
At present it takes us less than an hours to fly from Bangalore to Ernakulam and then it takes close to 3 hours to travel from Kochi to my place in Mavelikara. With the Aranmula airport not likely to see the light of the day anytime soon, this semi-HSR would be boon for people like us from Alapuzha. Since there is a stop in Chegannur, we can make it to Chengannur from Kochi in a fraction of the time that it currently takes.

The question is how many times you travel blr to ekm. one in a month?

Im not saying people wont travel, but the cost and the time which will take for this will not justify the cost. You are well aware that the pkd kudihiran block lags for years. In Kerala which such high population density, we need public transport with more green energy. First you need do figure out KSRTC.

Just because the projected route doesn't stop at your gate doesn't mean others won't prefer it.

Commuting using high speed rail or semi high speed rail works the same way in all places. They won't stop at your doorstep. Providing too many stops make them physically impossible to achieve those average speeds, even if your train can run 400 odd km/h in between those stops. Well i guess you know this, still puting it here for completeness.

There are people, who would consider that 30 off km drive worthwhile, provided ample parking facilities, and take a semi hsr.

The demand I'm talking off is about the people travelling to and from TVM for various reasons. There is a good amount of traffic in this route and to this destination.

People don't travel between stops?? So you think everyone boarding a train to ernakulam is going strictly to there? In the light of reduced travel time and relative comfort hsr offer, one doesn't have to count only on passengers whose house opens to the railway station entry. Hsr will become part of the itenery, part of the choice to cover relevant distances.

Lastly how does increased urban transport facility help someone travelling to the capital from say Kozhikode? Apples and oranges? I'm not saying we don't need better urban transport but we need both

Are you a resident of kerala? I have to travel 30-35 km up or down to catch the train and have to pay toll, heavy traffic. So what is the point I travel such distance in traffic just to catch the train. It make sense if I travel to BLR or Chennai but this is just for kerala itself. Such facilities can be done by reviving KSRTC which itself is pathetic state.Using this money, I'm all for connecting Metros, first Kochi metro to Angamali, then to TCR and same way to south side.. It may cost more but will benefit more.
 
The question is how many times you travel blr to ekm. one in a month?

Im not saying people wont travel, but the cost and the time which will take for this will not justify the cost. You are well aware that the pkd kudihiran block lags for years. In Kerala which such high population density, we need public transport with more green energy. First you need do figure out KSRTC.
Konkan railways changed the face of the Konkan region connecting it with Mumbai and enitre Maharashtra. Coastal trains are quite productive , even more when major Kerala cities are on its coast
 
Really? And water transport one can travel in 4 hours stopping in all points? Is there any river connecting north to south? Or if we speaking of sea transport nope you arent getting it.

If you have to travel 35km to go to nearest station to get train to work in the next districts in less than 45 min then its fine. Of course local metro, electric train is needed. But this project travels through all major population centres. They can also run short trains with various stops in between in those lines as well. But infra has to be present for all that to happen.

If you go through the high speed rails in the world, most of them connecting major cities. Whereas in kerala, with high population density and more people are living in suburbs, benefiting people will be quite less. Evenryday commuters from TVM to EKM for work is very less. But TCR to EMK or KYM to EKM is very high who makes the major traffic on the roads.
Konkan railways changed the face of the Konkan region connecting it with Mumbai and enitre Maharashtra. Coastal trains are quite productive , even more when major Kerala cities are on its coast


Im all in for such connectivity, but kerala is well connected with existing train lines, We need more metro, light metro kinda stuff than bullet trains or high speed rail. Or it should connect mangalore, bangalore or chennai
 
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