Jammu & Kashmir live updates: GOI remove all provisions of Article 370
- Thread starter Ashwin
- Start date
So its 20-30 * 72 virgins. Interestingly nowhere is the gender/species of the so called virgins specified.
It may serve pakistans interest to create a war like scenario at the LoC in order to keep the fickle international focus on kashmir. Pakistan currently does not have the clout to sway international opinions on its kashmir narrative, so it's best hope is to force India's hand on the LoC and use Indian belligerence to keep the limelight on kashmir.
Special situations demand special actions. The way in which central government took the state status is indeed extraordinary. At the end of the day, it is done in that way to reduce the loss of life, not because goverment cannot satisfy any required majority anywhere. After all they won all these states & national election on a manifesto that state it will remove article 370.
Regarding "No's state should loose it's state status", I disagree. If the state failed to fulfill its duties assigned to it up to a point it will treaten the national integriy & security of peoples, then central government have to take back those duties to secure the state & peoples. J&K state government have misserably failed in handling law & order which is a state subject for far too long. It's leniency or inability to act against many groups that is funding and propagating violence have made the state to a dangerous edge.
Maybe the govt should have communicated their intention to remove article 370 earlier?? You now , like mentioning that in their manifesto?
Oh wait.
Why do I get a feeling that every second thing this Gvt does feels like an assault on basic rights to you? 
Good, screw the other parties; the majority of the current Opposition does not deserve a say on matters of national security and integrity. They have proven themselves to be unconcerned with these matters at best, and potentially traitorous at worst.
Still, some parties that aren't blindly anti-BJP like BJD, YSRCP, TRS etc backed it. And some of the united Opp. parties read the writing on the wall and backed it because they had no choice.
No, it really shouldn't, stop fearmongering over anything and everything.
J&K is a unique situation; what did following the old rules give us for 70 years?
Yea...No. Why should they waste their time jumping all those hoops? So that opposition parties, the judiciary and other vested interests left over from the old Congress ecosystem can continue fillibustering/sabotaging them?
I was pretty open originally to hearing peoples' viewpoints about "The Gvt should've done this but in a different way." But most of it so far just sounds like thinly veiled mourning that 370 is gone. Suggestions of alternative methods are all either naive or sly; because none of those alternative methods stood a chance.
It sure would've been great if Nehru, Indira etc had even put one tenth of this much thought into legality, morality and constitutional propriety when they were railroading all sorts of bullshit laws and amendments into our Constitution with complete impunity.
Good, screw the other parties; the majority of the current Opposition does not deserve a say on matters of national security and integrity. They have proven themselves to be unconcerned with these matters at best, and potentially traitorous at worst.
Still, some parties that aren't blindly anti-BJP like BJD, YSRCP, TRS etc backed it. And some of the united Opp. parties read the writing on the wall and backed it because they had no choice.
No, it really shouldn't, stop fearmongering over anything and everything.
J&K is a unique situation; what did following the old rules give us for 70 years?
Yea...No. Why should they waste their time jumping all those hoops? So that opposition parties, the judiciary and other vested interests left over from the old Congress ecosystem can continue fillibustering/sabotaging them?
I was pretty open originally to hearing peoples' viewpoints about "The Gvt should've done this but in a different way." But most of it so far just sounds like thinly veiled mourning that 370 is gone. Suggestions of alternative methods are all either naive or sly; because none of those alternative methods stood a chance.
It sure would've been great if Nehru, Indira etc had even put one tenth of this much thought into legality, morality and constitutional propriety when they were railroading all sorts of bullshit laws and amendments into our Constitution with complete impunity.
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Every people have different opinion,so why you bother...Post your opinion and move on..
Agree , no doubt ways and means to achieve the result is debatable. But what other options do we have?
J&K gets special consideration bcos of involvement of external enemy whose aim is to turn the place into a war zone. As a union territory police comes directly under central govt which will gives them rights to tackle the disruptive elements. Political class in J&K was benefiting from the dispute, as in the past they would have played to gallery causing more violence & bloodshed.
Andhra was split recently , where process and decision was taken in a transparent manner. As such what makes the opposition think that constitution is being abused. Lets say its just a normal response from an opposition, I dont think we should read too much into it.
You seems do not familiar with pakistani tactics...
Very strange to see the silent of oppositie side of LOC....
May be,the new IB line is drawn....With the help of back channel from pakistan military....May be we will never claim the POK.
J&K is and was not the only state of the Indian union beset with terrorism and other security challenges. Punjab suffered from the same crisis and didn't have to lose its statehood while successfully overcoming the challenge. We also have the example of Assam and North Eastern states.
I will readily concede that cross border terrorism by heavily trained and armed terrorists, is more than what regular state law enforcement agencies are trained to handle. Which is why Army and other central forces are at the vanguard of the counter terrorism operations, operating under the cover of the most generous constitutional immunity . I don't believe that Indian constitution is so emaciated that a threat of terrorism is enough to warrant shaking it to its core.
They did mention revoking Article 370 in their manifesto and I don't have any objection to that. But I'm sure they didn't say anything about bifurcating a full state into union territories.
Why do I get a feeling that every second thing this Gvt does feels like an assault on basic rights to you?
Good, screw the other parties; the majority of the current Opposition does not deserve a say on matters of national security and integrity. They have proven themselves to be unconcerned with these matters at best, and potentially traitorous at worst.
Still, some parties that aren't blindly anti-BJP like BJD, YSRCP, TRS etc backed it. And some of the united Opp. parties read the writing on the wall and backed it because they had no choice.
No, it really shouldn't, stop fearmongering over anything and everything.
J&K is a unique situation; what did following the old rules give us for 70 years?
Yea...No. Why should they waste their time jumping all those hoops? So that opposition parties, the judiciary and other vested interests left over from the old Congress ecosystem can continue fillibustering/sabotaging them?
I was pretty open originally to hearing peoples' viewpoints about "The Gvt should've done this but in a different way." But most of it so far just sounds like thinly veiled mourning that 370 is gone. Suggestions of alternative methods are all either naive or sly; because none of those alternative methods stood a chance.
" screw the opposition because we can do anything we want because we have majority" is precisely the attitude that allowed Nehru's congress to inflict the wound of Article 370 on a nation still basking in the aura of a infallible Pt Nehru. India under Modi is currently experiencing its Nehru moment.
Sacrificing long lasting constitutional principles, like consulting the states, giving parliament sufficient time to discuss the matter, wait for the affected State to constitute its assembly and then consult it, try to achieve political consensus, for the sake of transient political objectives is fraught with danger for our constitution, federal structure and ultimately our democracy.
Like Nehru's supporters backed his political shenanigans blindly, unaware of its consequences decades later, today we may support Modi roughshoding opposition and parliament in the name of national security, but do we pause to think about its intended and unintended consequences decades from now.
As the saying goes"The best lessons from history the ones that we can learn from "
How is it danger to federal spirit? The 'Union' comes first and to protect it you can even implement Emergency as per constitution. Not just that you need 2/3rd Majority in both houses, whosoever has this much legislative power rest assured he/she represents majority of Indians in letter and spirit. It is democracy after all if you have to represent people's wish.
So don't worry about federal structure, there are more than enough safeguards present in process to ensure will of people not politicians is presented.
Even the election to RajyaSabha on proportional representation is such that no single party can abuse the system even after brute majority, it is even named 'Council of State' and accorded powers such that the rights of states and opposition are protected and heard.
This is not unprecedented, from independence there is no shortage of states being created, altered, dropped, renamed, bifurcated, land outside India subjugated and assimilated with proper constitutional framework.
And how or why should other states be consulted in this? What stakes do they have except center and J&K? Why should they be party to dispute or consultation? And if you are talking about informal consultations majority of states are BJP ruled, they are automatically supporting it.
It looks so fancy to say we should create consensus, we should consult everyone in essays and answer writing, in reality consensus is rarely reached so following the procedure is more than enough.
Yeah that's why the term 'residual powers to Union' was given. Whatever is not mentioned automatically is under Union and they have the power to make laws the way they want as long as they are abiding by the constitution.
In the end for any act or process we can always say we support it but don't like the way it is done, that's the go to line when we have no substantial fact or argument to oppose something just our wishful thinking.
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And since we are feeling so touchy with sacred constitution written in 1950, amended 100+ times we must also tell how a constitutional fraud lasted 70years. How even after specific mention that constitution can be amended only by Parliament 35A was inserted by a single man with Presidential decree and how correcting it somehow become danger to democracy and bla bla bla.
Pakistan's plan to invade Endiya. Err........I mean Gaffora's plan to invade Pakistani media.
