Zorawar: Light tank for Indian army

[jmaxwell_]

Alright, to be fair to the IA they might be worried about the capability that China unveiled last year:

Type 100 tank - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Due to advancements in propellant and kinetic delivery technologies, which allow APFSDS rounds to achieve a reported muzzle velocity of roughly 1,706 m/s (5,600 ft/s), the 105 mm gun is reported to be comparable to the larger 120 mm and 125 mm smoothbore guns in terms of general performance

Chinese	English
战斗全重 <35t	Combat weight (fully loaded) < 35 t
车体重量 <25t	Vehicle weight < 25 t
乘员 3人	Crew: 3
车长 7440	Length: 7,440 mm
车宽 3720	Width: 3,720 mm
车高 2500	Height: 2,500 mm
最大速度 65km/h	Maximum speed: 65 km/h
最大行程 500km	Maximum range: 500 km

 

[RandomGoober]

My version of Zorawar has:

• ~11.65 m² of protected area (lvl 5/6)
• ~6.93 m² of rest of the sides (lvl 4)

(with a fair margin of error, but that's best I could do from a model)

I just need the right areal densities to guess weights (know some about lvl 2 & lvl 4 in similar application)..

 

[BoredBear]

My version of Zorawar has:

• ~11.65 m² of protected area (lvl 5/6)
• ~6.93 m² of rest of the sides (lvl 4)

(with a fair margin of error, but that's best I could do from a model)

I just need the right areal densities to guess weights (know some about lvl 2 & lvl 4 in similar application)..

Do you think the current weight of Zorawar is 25 tons? Anupu & I were having a discussion on this on the other forum. CV-90 TML has the same protection and 105mm gun but it has a weight of around 22 tons. And it is a system from 90s with little to no composite material usage. What if the current weight of Zorawar is less than that because of composite material?

This is what he had shared there.

Yes, you are absolutely right. This whole overweight shenanigan is based on the assumption that the current zorawar is 25 tons dot. The fact is the CV90 TML variant. The one with a 105mm gun and a protection shockingly similar at Stanag level 4ish was weighing only 22.5 tons. If Zorawar is currently weighing just 22.5 tons, or around, they have 2.5 to 5 tons of weight budget left for additional armour without going over the weight. This whole discussion is based on the assumption that Zorawar has already exhausted its design weight budget. An additional armour will take additional weight.

 

[RandomGoober]

Do you think the current weight of Zorawar is 25 tons? Anupu & I were having a discussion on this on the other forum. CV-90 TML has the same protection and 105mm gun but it has a weight of around 22 tons. And it is a system from 90s with little to no composite material usage. What if the current weight of Zorawar is less than that because of composite material?

This is what he had shared there.

I just know CVRDE describes Zorawar combat weight as 25T + 10%

They wouldn't call it heavier than it is.

 

[randomradio]

Alright, to be fair to the IA they might be worried about the capability that China unveiled last year:

Type 100 tank - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

View attachment 52207

Chinese	English
战斗全重 <35t	Combat weight (fully loaded) < 35 t
车体重量 <25t	Vehicle weight < 25 t
乘员 3人	Crew: 3
车长 7440	Length: 7,440 mm
车宽 3720	Width: 3,720 mm
车高 2500	Height: 2,500 mm
最大速度 65km/h	Maximum speed: 65 km/h
最大行程 500km	Maximum range: 500 km

It's a problem with old APFSDS shells used in India and China with their limited penetrator lengths. Russian and Western standards are now between 800 and 1000 mm at 2 km, 0 deg. Indian and Chinese shells are still stuck well below 800 mm, 450-650 mm. So now current gen 105 mm guns are matching the capabilities of the ammo used in the Type 90 and T-90.

 

[Ashwin]

https://www.bseindia.com/xml-data/corpfiling/AttachLive/17b94c51-f0d2-482e-806b-4e17a21ccc65.pdf

PTC wins 2.5-year ARDE-DRDO order to design and develop Titanium Cradle for Indian Light Weight Tank.

 

[Gautam]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2088244748863819966

 

[Ashwin]

 

[Gautam]

Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype

Tata Advanced Systems Ltd (TASL) has emerged as the lowest bidder in a gruelling defence ministry contest to develop a next-generation light battle tank, beating four other entities vying for the key project valued at nearly ₹20,000 crore, said people familiar with the matter.

The project is being implemented under the defence ministry’s Make 1 policy, which permits 70% government funding for project development. The second-lowest bidder, Mahindra Defence Systems, will also be invited to develop the prototype.



Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype - The Economic Times

Wait, 125 mm? Are they planning to mount a 125mm on the Zorawar?

 

[Nithees1]

Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype

Tata Advanced Systems Ltd (TASL) has emerged as the lowest bidder in a gruelling defence ministry contest to develop a next-generation light battle tank, beating four other entities vying for the key project valued at nearly ₹20,000 crore, said people familiar with the matter.

The project is being implemented under the defence ministry’s Make 1 policy, which permits 70% government funding for project development. The second-lowest bidder, Mahindra Defence Systems, will also be invited to develop the prototype.

View attachment 53875

Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype - The Economic Times

Wait, 125 mm? Are they planning to mount a 125mm on the Zorawar?

it mentions as "105-125mm", so maybe just some speculation by the media ?

 

[Ad 04 30]

59 being build by DRDO/L&T and 295 being divided between whatever TASL and Mahindra come up with

Need serious reforms at this point, which aren't coming in DAP 2026

 

[jmaxwell_]

Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype - The Economic Times

Are they ready to move forward with building the prototype? Seemed like parts of the project still needed more development?



Edit: Unless this is being built with Cummins engine/Renk transmission?

 

[Ad 04 30]

Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype

Tata Advanced Systems Ltd (TASL) has emerged as the lowest bidder in a gruelling defence ministry contest to develop a next-generation light battle tank, beating four other entities vying for the key project valued at nearly ₹20,000 crore, said people familiar with the matter.

The project is being implemented under the defence ministry’s Make 1 policy, which permits 70% government funding for project development. The second-lowest bidder, Mahindra Defence Systems, will also be invited to develop the prototype.

View attachment 53875

Tata emerges lowest bidder for Rs 20,000-crore Project Zorawar light tank; Mahindra to also develop prototype - The Economic Times

Wait, 125 mm? Are they planning to mount a 125mm on the Zorawar?

Will it be based on DRDO's design or their own/licensing?

 

[Ashwin]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2097573691286860244

https://twitter.com/x/status/2097580321441263656

 

[Gautam]

Are they ready to move forward with building the prototype? Seemed like parts of the project still needed more development?

View attachment 53880

Edit: Unless this is being built with Cummins engine/Renk transmission?

I think the hull will be compatible with both the current powerpack (Cummins engine/Renk transmission) & the future powerpack (CVRDE 800hp engine & transmission).

L&T's Zorawar would also use the same CVRDE powerpack when it is operational.

 

[Shan]

Till India does not have a certified Powerpack of it own, the MoD will clear the use of a foreign OEM for the LT. I have not seen a useful 25 or sub 25 LT as a concept or in production. Most LTs are in the range of 30-35 tonnes with complete add-ons (mod armour config). As this has already been discussed extensively, I will refrain from stating the cons again. It is difficult to wrap my head around how much penetration protection a 25 tonne vehicle can offer. There is also the difficulty of cramming EW suite and APS on thing (if they are planning to do so). Let's see what happens. I expected a revision in specs if it is to stay relevant against emerging threats.

 

[Gautam]

it mentions as "105-125mm", so maybe just some speculation by the media ?

I should have been clearer.

We have a new MBT under development. For a while we have been getting conflicting reports about whether this new MBT would get a 120 mm smoothbore gun or a 125 mm smoothbore gun. We have seen patents & prototypes of a dual flow auto-loader for this MBT. Dual flow as in it will have a bustle mounted auto-loader with ammo stored on the turret & the hull. 3-person crew all in the hull.

125mm SB would be a logical choice. We operate a sizable fleet of the T-90 & T-72. Both of these tanks use the Soviet/Russian 2A46 main gun. A 125 mm SB gun. The Army has a sizable stock of 125mm tank ammo, many OFB factories have active production lines of many Soviet/Russian origin tank ammo.

If the new tank, which is meant to replace the T-72, gets a 125mm SB then it will be able to make use the Army's ammo stocks & the production lines we have running.

That's where my mind went when I saw the 125mm number. Who knows maybe our light tanks would also have a 125 mm in the future. The Sprut has a 125mm too.

Or maybe it is just a typo.

Most LTs are in the range of 30-35 tonnes with complete add-ons (mod armour config).

The Zorawar weighs 25 tons when the add-on armour removed. With spaced armour panels on the sides, ERA/NERA on the front/back & the APS when it is ready, the Zorawar would also be 30+ tons.

 

[Shan]

The Zorawar weighs 25 tons when the add-on armour removed. With spaced armour panels on the sides, ERA/NERA on the front/back & the APS when it is ready, the Zorawar would also be 30+ tons.

I do hope so. The ideal mark seems to hover around 35. No need to pursue weight recklessly that's my only concern. 105mm is standard and I hope they stick with it.

 

[jmaxwell_]

Will it be based on DRDO's design or their own/licensing?

Given the latest article is saying the 59 L&T will be in parallel to the 295 TASL/Mahinda order... I'm leaning towards assuming TASL/Mahindra will be some JV.

Hopefully that is not the case and L&T makes a TON more profit than TASL/Mahindra otherwise private industry will learn the wrong lessons... i.e. stay away from DRDO partnerships because you will get larger orders with less R&D headache/investment doing .

 

[Ginvincible]

what's the point of having 2 different light tank models? Mahindra/Tata will take a few years to develop and field prototypes. In the meantime L&T's Zorawar will have some incremental upgrades and learnings anyways right?

Is to diversify suppliers? Some radically different requirements emerged (maybe from Ukraine war learnings)? or is it just normal indian bureaucratic ineffeciencies at play?