Pahalgam terror attack: 26 killed

[LX1111]

The Indian system doesn't have any demotions, you only get suspensions or your further promotions will be stalled indefinitely. If things get very critical you'll see a strip off, you'll never see demotions. This is true for several militaries afaik. There have been several cases in the past by several people but they have only gotten suspensions

I am not referring to the promotion or demotion of Indian generals. These documents clearly state that Pakistan will be forced into a dual crisis of Kashmir and Balochistan and completely lose control of the water resources of the Indus River. At the same time, it will take the opportunity to reshape the power structure in South Asia and shape India into a "global leader in counter-terrorism", paving the way for subsequent intervention in Afghanistan and Central Asia. Through the "hybrid war cube" (military provocation + treaty politicization + cognitive warfare + proxy war), multiple strategic resonances will be achieved.

 

[Asterion Moloc]

In their contacts with the PLAAF, Pakistan is like a knight lord, commanding ground crew to serve them.It seems that these ground crew are like their servants and serfs
Isn't it normal for there to be a few hundred capable young nobles among hundreds of millions of people?

kek, bossing around PAF ground crew dors not make them knightly order, heck the region that became pakistan never had societal organization to have even knights and knightly order, they are majority buffalo and camel herders who did not even built a canal or done any hydological works in their 2000yr odd existence (so much for sons of Indus and Gandhara ) to jump from buffalo herding to farming, it took British to organize and build the canals and make the land arable for them, and now they got the country and became feudal military chiefs. Though they do have rent-seeking Persian and other West Asian immigrants who were given land grants to live off as bueuracrats etc (no knights), with last names like kirmani, gilani, hamdani etc denoting their place of origin from persia, PAF may have higher proportion of them due to the nature of the service being more technical hence more urban background compared to rural fuedals of Army.

One more knight lord chief video for you

Using PAF assests and red carpet to show off in his ancestral village

 

[LX1111]

If China can sacrifice 100 billion dollar trade for few 2-3 billion without any practical access to Arabian sea then go ahead try your luck.

.The value of the Qinghai-Tibet Plateau is far beyond the measurement of any amount of money. If India defeats Pakistan, its next target will definitely be Tibet.

 

[Zarion]

What a stupid idea. If you have seen the offensive footage of the Russian-Ukrainian war, you will not have such a stupid idea. Whether it is Russia or Ukraine, their main offensive mode is 3 or 4 tanks, about 10 infantry fighting vehicles, and support from artillery and reconnaissance troops. If the Indians want to organize such an attack, they need a tank regiment, an infantry regiment, an artillery division, and reconnaissance and electronic warfare troops that may only be available at the army level.
If it is China, a combined battalion can solve all problems. That is why the Indian Army is so bloated and inefficient.

If you have actually seen the Russo Ukraine war then you'll know that they have consistently evolved and changed, there is no uniformity regarding there composition and it will continue to change, why would you have fixed composition in a war?

 

[Zarion]

.The value of the Qinghai-Tibet Plateau is far beyond the measurement of any amount of money. If India defeats Pakistan, its next target will definitely be Tibet.

What are you on about? Do you think wars are video games that are played one after another? No country does that and If Indi "defeats" Pakistan, it wouldn't take whole control over it. At max a few KM of land, no one wants an all out war.

CCP bots be like

View attachment 42764

Lets not be racist.

 

[LX1111]

If you have actually seen the Russo Ukraine war then you'll know that they have consistently evolved and changed, there is no uniformity regarding there composition and it will continue to change, why would you have fixed composition in a war?

Indeed, there is no fixed pattern for war at present, but the direction of development is clear. The width of the battlefield has increased significantly compared with the past. During the Cold War, a company was often responsible for only 1.5 kilometers of the battlefield, while in Russia and Ukraine, a company is often responsible for 3 kilometers of the battlefield.
Moreover, with the popularization of commercial DJI drones and Starlink, the battlefield has become highly transparent to grassroots soldiers on both sides, and cheap precision-guided weapons like HIMARS have become popular on a large scale.
This obviously requires that the army, whether in offense or defense, needs to be more decentralized and flexible, and requires more in-depth synthetic reforms, which is obviously not something that the early Cold War armies of India and Pakistan can adapt to.

 

[randomradio]

You are saying as if a rifle is to be replaced. New warships will keep coming whether old are operational or not. Pakistan has ordered Chinese Frigates. They are not for replacements. They are for the enhancement of existing fleet. If we do not sink old warships, in future wars old and new warship together will fight against us. You can not harm Pakistan more than sinking warship (in terms of Money) with minimum collateral damage.

While their numbers will keep increasing, over time they will still become less and less of a threat because IN will be moving up the value chain, not just increase numbers.

What I'm saying is any such large scale destruction must be the first step to a larger and more permanent objective. It could be economic or territorial, preferably both.

 

[screambowl]

.The value of the Qinghai-Tibet Plateau is far beyond the measurement of any amount of money. If India defeats Pakistan, its next target will definitely be Tibet.

Incorrect comparison.
Pakistan needs to be punished for terrorism, are you suggesting that China also supports terrorism?

 

[Zarion]

Indeed, there is no fixed pattern for war at present, but the direction of development is clear. The width of the battlefield has increased significantly compared with the past. During the Cold War, a company was often responsible for only 1.5 kilometers of the battlefield, while in Russia and Ukraine, a company is often responsible for 3 kilometers of the battlefield.
Moreover, with the popularization of commercial DJI drones and Starlink, the battlefield has become highly transparent to grassroots soldiers on both sides, and cheap precision-guided weapons like HIMARS have become popular on a large scale.
This obviously requires that the army, whether in offense or defense, needs to be more decentralized and flexible, and requires more in-depth synthetic reforms, which is obviously not something that the early Cold War armies of India and Pakistan can adapt to.

This discussion is becoming dumber and dumber as it goes. India is already going through several reforms and already has HIMARS alternative. The plan for a Starlink like network is already in works. There is nothing more dumber than thinking that a military can't evolve.

 

[LX1111]

kek, bossing around PAF ground crew dors not make them knightly order, heck the region that became pakistan never had societal organization to have even knights and knightly order, they are majority buffalo and camel herders who did not even built a canal or done any hydological works in their 2000yr odd existence (so much for sons of Indus and Gandhara ) to jump from buffalo herding to farming, it took British to organize and build the canals and make the land arable for them, and now they got the country and became feudal military chiefs. Though they do have rent-seeking Persian and other West Asian immigrants who were given land grants to live off as bueuracrats etc (no knights), with last names like kirmani, gilani, hamdani etc denoting their place of origin from persia, PAF may have higher proportion of them due to the nature of the service being more technical hence more urban background compared to rural fuedals of Army.

One more knight lord chief video for you

Using PAF assests and red carpet to show off in his ancestral village

I have no interest in castes in India and Pakistan. I have read many memoirs of retired Chinese military officers. observations from the PLAAF, the technical level of Pakistani pilots is significantly higher than that of other countries, such as Turkey, Thailand, Egypt, etc., and even higher than the PLAAF before the military reform in 2014. They can often organize new but very effective tactics with poor equipment.
But their pilots are obviously more noble than the ground crew. Once, the Chinese saw the pilots playing golf, and the ground crew were assigned to be caddies. In the PLAAF, this is unimaginable.

 

[randomradio]

Another stupid thing, the purpose of the US and Russia to rebuild the division is not that the synthesis is bad, but that the brigade is too small, their division is a larger brigade. With more synthetic battalions (regiments). And build more support units at the division level.

Whatchu talkin' 'bout? A US armored division has 3 armored brigades with 2 regiments each of Abrams, Bradleys, and APCs. That's 12-13000 troops.

Russian and Indian divisions are terrain-specific and have 3 or 4 brigades.

Indian divisions are different. Their regiments are single-arms. Tank regiments only have tanks. If you want to organize an attack, you need to draw tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, artillery, engineers, electronic warfare and air defense units from different regiments.

You are confused between integrated brigades and standard units. That's a different topic.

While Russian and US brigades are integrated, India is still creating that standard. But all three are operating divisions of roughly the same strength.

Even if you ignore what India is doing, the US and Russians are doing the opposite of what you have claimed.

 

[Zarion]

I have no interest in castes in India and Pakistan. I have read many memoirs of retired Chinese military officers. observations from the PLAAF, the technical level of Pakistani pilots is significantly higher than that of other countries, such as Turkey, Thailand, Egypt, etc., and even higher than the PLAAF before the military reform in 2014. They can often organize new but very effective tactics with poor equipment.
But their pilots are obviously more noble than the ground crew. Once, the Chinese saw the pilots playing golf, and the ground crew were assigned to be caddies. In the PLAAF, this is unimaginable.

Honestly this is dumb and not just dumb it is just playing a scenario in one's mind. There is no point in discussing "nobility", "technicality", etc before a war even starts. You can have all these discussions when a war is played out, which in itself is very unlikely.

 

[screambowl]

I have read many memoirs of retired Chinese military officers. observations from the PLAAF, the technical level of Pakistani pilots is significantly higher than that of other countries, such as Turkey, Thailand, Egypt, etc., and even higher than the PLAAF before the military reform in 2014. They can often organize new but very effective tactics with poor equipment.

Read the memoirs of retired Chinese military officers post 2019, the recipe on how to get shot by a 40 years old outdated aircraft in a latest 4th gen fighter has been validated by Pakistan Airforce.

 

[Asterion Moloc]

I have no interest in castes in India and Pakistan. I have read many memoirs of retired Chinese military officers. observations from the PLAAF, the technical level of Pakistani pilots is significantly higher than that of other countries, such as Turkey, Thailand, Egypt, etc., and even higher than the PLAAF before the military reform in 2014. They can often organize new but very effective tactics with poor equipment.
But their pilots are obviously more noble than the ground crew. Once, the Chinese saw the pilots playing golf, and the ground crew were assigned to be caddies. In the PLAAF, this is unimaginable.

I have good interest in social organization in China, apart from Pakistan, particularly the differences between Northern Han and Southern Han, and higher tfr of cantonese than Northern Han(Mamdarin) and also of various sinitic mutually unintelligible languages like cantonese, hakka and hokkien.

It would be helpful of you share any resources on these matters in china and particularly of CCP and the demographic composition of it.

 

[LX1111]

Whatchu talkin' 'bout? A US armored division has 3 armored brigades with 2 regiments each of Abrams, Bradleys, and APCs. That's 12-13000 troops.

Russian and Indian divisions are terrain-specific and have 3 or 4 brigades.

Are you talking about the US Army in another time and space? We are in the US Army after the Waypoint 2028 reform. A standard heavy division has two ABCTs, one SBCT, one Army Aviation Brigade, one Artillery Brigade, one Engineer Battalion and one Support Brigade.
A new ABCT will consist of three combined arms battalions, a cavalry squadron, an armored engineer battalion, and a brigade support battalion.
You can see that the essence of the future of the US Army is to build a division with stronger support capabilities based on the brigade combat team, rather than rebuilding the traditional tank division.

 

[randomradio]

If the Indians want to organize such an attack, they need a tank regiment, an infantry regiment, an artillery division, and reconnaissance and electronic warfare troops that may only be available at the army level.
If it is China, a combined battalion can solve all problems. That is why the Indian Army is so bloated and inefficient.

That's nonsense. That's not how it works.

By incorporating divisions under the Corps HQ, in the current structure a command can unleash the full power of an artillery division in support of a single battalion or they can distribute artillery batteries to individual brigades no different from an integrated brigade and allow brigade commanders to make their own independent decisions.

It's a trade-off. In the Chinese system, the battalion and brigade are more lethal individually while decreasing the lethality of the corps, but in the Indian system the most lethal force is the corps.

So if Indian battalion wants to organize an attack with 3 or 4 tanks, some IFVs and support troops etc, they can. And they have done that in previous wars too.

 

[randomradio]

Are you talking about the US Army in another time and space? We are in the US Army after the Waypoint 2028 reform. A standard heavy division has two ABCTs, one SBCT, one Army Aviation Brigade, one Artillery Brigade, one Engineer Battalion and one Support Brigade.
A new ABCT will consist of three combined arms battalions, a cavalry squadron, an armored engineer battalion, and a brigade support battalion.
You can see that the essence of the future of the US Army is to build a division with stronger support capabilities based on the brigade combat team, rather than rebuilding the traditional tank division.

Their Waypoint 2028 is still in the works. Nothing's been finalized. What they have today is still a standard division, just integrated at the brigade level.

Yes, it naturally won't be a traditional tank division, that's for sure. But the biggest field unit will still be a division, not a brigade.

 

[screambowl]

Russian President Putin condemned the Pahalgam terror attack in a phone call to PM Modi and stressed that the perpetrators must be brought to justice. The call follows Pakistani calls for international investigation into the attack.

Putin's "Full Support" To PM Modi As Pak Seeks Russia Role In Pahalgam Probe

Russian President Vladimir Putin dialled Prime Minister Narendra Modi today and strongly condemned the terror attack in Jammu and Kashmir's Pahalgam, where 25 tourists and a Kashmiri were shot dead in cold blood.

www.ndtv.com

 

[LX1111]

You are confused between integrated brigades and standard units. That's a different topic.

While Russian and US brigades are integrated, India is still creating that standard. But all three are operating divisions of roughly the same strength.

Even if you ignore what India is doing, the US and Russians are doing the opposite of what you have claimed.

Compared with the U.S. military, the Russian army is much more traditional. The main reason is that its equipment is backward and its information level is too low. It still does not have a traditional tank regiment, but a mixture of tanks, infantry fighting vehicles and artillery.

That's nonsense. That's not how it works.

By incorporating divisions under the Corps HQ, in the current structure a command can unleash the full power of an artillery division in support of a single battalion or they can distribute artillery batteries to individual brigades no different from an integrated brigade and allow brigade commanders to make their own independent decisions.

It's a trade-off. In the Chinese system, the battalion and brigade are more lethal individually while decreasing the lethality of the corps, but in the Indian system the most lethal force is the corps.

So if Indian battalion wants to organize an attack with 3 or 4 tanks, some IFVs and support troops etc, they can. And they have done that in previous wars too.

The hypothetical Indian Army is like plasticine that can be glued together at will. However, this is wrong. The key to future wars lies in dispersion and integration. You think that the Indian Army can arbitrarily split up armored divisions, artillery divisions, and air defense regiments in wartime and combine them into various combat units.
And the confusion caused by personnel from different departments, how to solve the complex communication and command problems of these temporary units on the battlefield? A simple logistics problem, an armored battalion of an armored division, an artillery company of an artillery division, and an infantry battalion of an infantry-style infantry form a joint force, who should they ask for logistical supplies? The armored division, the artillery division, or the infantry division?

 

[LX1111]

It's a trade-off. In the Chinese system, the battalion and brigade are more lethal individually while decreasing the lethality of the corps, but in the Indian system the most lethal force is the corps

Do you really know what you are talking about? The support forces under one of my group armies include artillery brigades, air defense brigades, special operations brigades, army aviation brigades, engineering and chemical defense brigades, and service support brigades. Do I think China's army-level units are weak?

So if Indian battalion wants to organize an attack with 3 or 4 tanks, some IFVs and support troops etc, they can. And they have done that in previous wars too.

India can certainly organize itself, but when every battle on the battlefield requires such organization, why don't you organize the troops as needed for combat from now on?

Yes, it naturally won't be a traditional tank division, that's for sure. But the biggest field unit will still be a division, not a brigade.

It seems that you don't understand what the Americans mean. The American believe that a stronger support force must be built on the brigade combat team, similar to China group army, so there is a 2028 waypoint, but they still believe that brigades and battalions are the most basic synthetic combat units.