T-90 Bhishma / T-72 Ajeya of Indian Army : News and Discussions

Ankit Kumar

Senior member
Nov 30, 2017
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Bangalore
How much a normal armoured personal carrier provides, that much

Maybe delve some time into modern European IFV designs which are in service or are about to enter in service. As they have data available on their protection levels so a real good thing to read, you will see just all round protection against HMG fire and frontal protection against 20/25mm canon fire pushes up their weight so much. Also read the criticism for those modern designs.

I cannot change your perspective, but i find it fun to read on those systems. Will surely broaden your views on armoured warfare.
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
11,679
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India
Tank is an.obsolete concept, the more you add selpf protective measurements the more it become expansive nothing more nothing less. What IA is need high mobile troop carrying vehicle with reasonable ballistic protection with attack helicopter coverage, and mounted howitzers.

 
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Sathya

Senior member
Dec 2, 2017
2,281
1,274
India
Ukrainian T72 upgrade package

If you want technical details of these systems, 60-70% of the systems can be traced to websites of different factories which comes under KMDB.

1. How much would upgrade cost per tank.
2.if we have comparr our T 90 with this Upgraded T72 how much will be the capability difference.

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My 4 yr kid likes that video, asked me to save it.. And show him when he asks me .
 

Ankit Kumar

Senior member
Nov 30, 2017
2,497
2,283
Bangalore
1. How much would upgrade cost per tank.
2.if we have comparr our T 90 with this Upgraded T72 how much will be the capability difference.

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My 4 yr kid likes that video, asked me to save it.. And show him when he asks me .
Ukraine for its own army has repaired and upgraded some T72s from its reserves but it included only new communication equipment and ERA besides general repair. No upgrade to the engines and transmission. A couple of upgraded tanks were spotted with RWS station. So its difficult to comment on the cost.

But to our own fleet we have a pretty good program in my opinion, only thing lacking is the gun. We are likely going to add thicker ERA, Night Vision , GPS, newer engine to the tanks.

The base armour of T72 might be nothing compared even to say Leo 1 firepower, but it's going to face Type59 tanks, Type 69 tanks and T80UD without ERA. So that's that.

The cost is cheap , unless and untill you add panoramic night/TI for the commander and a Passive defence system. And maybe the gun.
 
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Lolwa

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Feb 6, 2020
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797
Delhi
our armoured capability is really becoming obsolete as compared to Pakistan.
They have reached parity with us. They will soon again lose the that once we induct the fmbt (hopefully armata) and Arjun mk2 (hopefully with a 700mm rha apfsds) The thing is the apfsds of both side are so pathetic that chances are both won't be able to penetrate each other's tanks. But I personally don't think armoured will be the big game changer. The sooner the IAF gains air superiority in the region the faster will our mechanised corps go deep inside Pakistan. The Chinese on the other hand would be a much bigger problem. We really need to first upgrade our tanks to the 2a46m5 standard and go for the svinets and the IMI round for our fleet. We wasted our resources developing a 120 mm rifled gun instead of working on a 125mm gun like the Chinese. We copy the worst from the west whether it's their economic models or weapons...
 

Hydra

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May 19, 2020
1,915
909
Mumbai
They have reached parity with us. They will soon again lose the that once we induct the fmbt (hopefully armata) and Arjun mk2 (hopefully with a 700mm rha apfsds) The thing is the apfsds of both side are so pathetic that chances are both won't be able to penetrate each other's tanks. But I personally don't think armoured will be the big game changer. The sooner the IAF gains air superiority in the region the faster will our mechanised corps go deep inside Pakistan. The Chinese on the other hand would be a much bigger problem. We really need to first upgrade our tanks to the 2a46m5 standard and go for the svinets and the IMI round for our fleet. We wasted our resources developing a 120 mm rifled gun instead of working on a 125mm gun like the Chinese. We copy the worst from the west whether it's their economic models or weapons...
Ha, you are well aware about indian way of modernisation and time taken for such thing, fmbt will not come in near future.
And we choose 120mm for Arjun because it designed based on Western philosophy. The russians choose 125 mm because, initially their projectile technology is not on par with west when comes to projectile, in reality german 120 mm projectile gives similar if not better results than a russian 125 mm.
So Chinese military strategy entirely copied from russians and they took 125mm design.
 
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Lolwa

Well-Known member
Feb 6, 2020
1,139
797
Delhi
Ha, you are well aware about indian way of modernisation and time taken for such thing, fmbt will not come in near future.
And we choose 120mm for Arjun because it designed based on Western philosophy. The russians choose 125 mm because, initially their projectile technology is not on par with west when comes to projectile, in reality german 120 mm projectile gives similar if not better results than a russian 125 mm.
So Chinese military strategy entirely copied from russians and they took 125mm design.
The problem with us is we don't have a good metallurgical base to make rods for our apfsds and still we went for the 120mm and that too rifled. It would be good if we had actually invested in designing apfsds but we sat on our asses happy with 500 mm rha rounds. While the Chinese have reached 800 mm rha on their 125mm guns. The pakistani vt 4's are actually cheaper than the Thai vt 4's chances are that they maybe inferior and it will take till 2023. I really hope we have bought the t-90ms instead of the t-90s rumours I'm hearing...
 

SrNair

Member
Mar 12, 2018
114
91
Kerala
They have reached parity with us. They will soon again lose the that once we induct the fmbt (hopefully armata) and Arjun mk2 (hopefully with a 700mm rha apfsds) The thing is the apfsds of both side are so pathetic that chances are both won't be able to penetrate each other's tanks. But I personally don't think armoured will be the big game changer. The sooner the IAF gains air superiority in the region the faster will our mechanised corps go deep inside Pakistan. The Chinese on the other hand would be a much bigger problem. We really need to first upgrade our tanks to the 2a46m5 standard and go for the svinets and the IMI round for our fleet. We wasted our resources developing a 120 mm rifled gun instead of working on a 125mm gun like the Chinese. We copy the worst from the west whether it's their economic models or weapons...

It is actually in vice versa .
A chance for heavy tank war is little in case with PRC because of treacherous terrain in Himalayas.
It is actually the AF that decides the fate of a war.
Once we have the Air superiority then situation willbe favourable to us
 

Lolwa

Well-Known member
Feb 6, 2020
1,139
797
Delhi
It is actually in vice versa .
A chance for heavy tank war is little in case with PRC because of treacherous terrain in Himalayas.
It is actually the AF that decides the fate of a war.
Once we have the Air superiority then situation willbe favourable to us
I have a wierd feeling that sometime in future we might end up seeing type 99's on both fronts of the lac Arunachal and ladakh both. Though the terrain doesn't allow it but I hope I'm wrong..
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
11,679
8,924
India
I have a wierd feeling that sometime in future we might end up seeing type 99's on both fronts of the lac Arunachal and ladakh both. Though the terrain doesn't allow it but I hope I'm wrong..

You can bring tanks to mountains, but you can't use it as a tank in mountains. It's nothing more than a pillbox in such terrain. So you will most definitely see Chinese MBTs on our border.