Sukhoi Su-30MKI

_Anonymous_

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What usually is the follow up action once the CoI reaches a finding & apportions guilt to external agencies like HAL or ADA for gross negligence?

Let's consider HAL in this case & leave ADA aside & let's also assume for the sake of argument that IAF personnel aren't in any way involved in this mishap .

Does HAL conduct a simultaneous enquiry or does it follow IAFs CoI? Once the culprits are identified what action is taken against them? Any idea or case precedent you're aware of? @Milspec
 
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Milspec

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What usually is the follow up action once the CoI reaches a finding & apportions guilt to external agencies like HAL or ADA for gross negligence?

Let's consider HAL in this case & leave ADA aside & let's also assume for the sake of argument that IAF personnel aren't in any way involved in this mishap .

Does HAL conduct a simultaneous enquiry or does it follow IAFs CoI? Once the culprits are identified what action is taken against them? Any idea or case precedent you're aware of? @Milspec
Every aircraft that is handed over to the IAF goes through a full gambit of flight testing before the handover process takes place. From that point onwards the maintenance of the aircraft is handled by IAF BRD. Given neither of these pilots are CTP's most likely these were commission aircraft.
The likely hood of this being a Manufacturing or design issue is low as you would see multiple failures of the same mode in multiple aircrafts pointing to inherent issue with the aircraft.

Now if something like a fatigue failure of components or system caused due to excess vibration, or shear/stress failure due to unanticipated pressure, flexure, etc. is discovered; then there is an escalation ladder and DFMEA/PFMEA followed by the CRE/CRI and HAL to remedy the situation.

It has never been heads must roll type of system, it's more let's figure it out and fix it type of approach. Fighter Jets are extremely complex machines and issues like these even happen in simple machines like cars.
 

Ashwin

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20210920_012350.jpg


Spicy leak
 

randomradio

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@randomradio here both ASPj and HBJ are different I think one of them will work as Escort Jammer.

Most likely both are the same.

Since the MKI won't be carrying an internal SPJ, it has to carry it in pods. And the pods will have to be carried on the wing tips for full 360 deg capability.

ASPJs and HBJs work in the same frequency. And an ASPJ is pretty much an escort jammer. You are likely referring to standoff jamming, but the pod's gonna have to be bigger than something that can be carried on wingtips. Heavy points will have to be used, like the SAP-14.

So it's just a mistake in the tweet.
 

HariPrasad

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Brahmos Missile test from an Su-30 MKI a threat to region : Pak Foreign Office


Foreign Office Spokesman Dr Muhammad Faisal on Thursday said that India’s latest test of BrahMos cruise missile was a threat to regional peace and stability.

Addressing the weekly press briefing, he said that such moves threatened regional peace and stability. “They also expose Indian duplicity that it only pays lip service to the arms control regimes. Pakistan has consistently raised serious concerns about these developments as they negatively impact regional security and stability,” he said.

“Pakistan continues to stress the need for a meaningful dialogue for confidence-building, avoidance of arms race and promotion of strategic stability in South Asia. Pakistan’s proposal for a strategic restraint regime for South Asia remains on the table.”

Dr Faisal said that the recent increase in missile tests by India after its membership of the Missile Technology Control Regime (MTCR) “demonstrates its policy of duplicity” as it had refrained from any such tests in the period before receiving the membership, likely to help its chances of gaining it.

Indian missile test a threat to region: FO - Daily Times

The problem with Pakistan is that it still consider itsrlf a balancing force in the region.
 

HariPrasad

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When Mig 29 was unveiled, one analyst had beautifully described it as 4th generation plane with third generation electronics. Russian planes are masterpieces of engineering but lacks in electronics and low observability. My roadmap for super sukhoi is to put AL 41 enigine in mki , big Uttam with about 2000 TRM, new ew in line with spectra etc. and RAM paint developped for AMCA.
 

AbRaj

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When Mig 29 was unveiled, one analyst had beautifully described it as 4th generation plane with third generation electronics. Russian planes are masterpieces of engineering but lacks in electronics and low observability. My roadmap for super sukhoi is to put AL 41 enigine in mki , big Uttam with about 2000 TRM, new ew in line with spectra etc. and RAM paint developped for AMCA.
SPECTRA,Viper Shield,AreXis etc are all based on DRFM.
Even Barracuda of F35, DASS in EFT, Khibiny of Su35 and SU 57 and EWS of J20 and other Flanker copies incorporates DRFM as one of the methods for jamming.
Even SAP pods on Su30 use DRFM for jamming the hostile signals.
Only difference is the level of sophistication different manufacturers employ. Barracuda and Spectra are considered highly advanced compared to other DRFM systems.
 
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HariPrasad

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SPECTRA,Viper Shield,AreXis etc are all based on DRFM.
Even Barracuda of F35, DASS in EFT, Khibiny of Su35 and SU 57 and EWS of J20 and other Flanker copies incorporates DRFM as one of the methods for jamming.
Even SAP pods on Su30 use DRFM for jamming the hostile signals.
Only difference is the level of sophistication different manufacturers employ. Barracuda and Spectra are considered highly advanced compared to other DRFM systems.

That is exactly what I say. To keep sukhois relevant, We need to have sophisticated EW. There was a news some time back that Rafale jamed Su 35 radar. We should get rid of these weaknesses. We need advance AESA and top class EW. Big RCS is weakess of MKI. We can take rusdian help to redesign air intake with AL41 engine. New EW , RAM, new AESA and AAM can transform MKI.
 

AbRaj

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That is exactly what I say. To keep sukhois relevant, We need to have sophisticated EW. There was a news some time back that Rafale jamed Su 35 radar. We should get rid of these weaknesses. We need advance AESA and top class EW. Big RCS is weakess of MKI. We can take rusdian help to redesign air intake with AL41 engine. New EW , RAM, new AESA and AAM can transform MKI.
I believe that the Su 30 intakes are sufficient to accommodate more powerful engines. In fact Russians are already upgrading their Su 30 SM ( Russian version of Su 30 MKI ) to SM2 standard ( proposed Super Sukhoi upgrade for MKI )
The Super Sukhoi Su-30SM2.
“The upgraded version of the Su-30SM will not only have improved combat features but will also use various parts and equipment from the Su-35. As a result, the maintenance of a large fleet of both types of modern fighters will be simplified. This is especially important in relation to engines, the most expensive aircraft components.

The Su-30SM2 will receive the AL-41F-1S engine, which is also used in the Su-35S. Compared to the power plant used so far in the Su-30SM, its thrust will increase by more than 16%, to 14,500 kg at full post-combustion. In addition, it reduces the cost of maintenance, by doubling the interval between revisions, now reaching 4 thousand hours. Other improvements and plasma ignition made it more efficient, reducing its fuel consumption.

Su-30SM2
Changes to onboard electronics and software will allow the use of new missiles and bombs designed to arm the Su-35 and the fifth-generation Su-57 stealth fighter.

Other improvements include a new radar, the Irbis-E, a powerful PESA-type radar also inherited from the Su-35. It will allow the Su-30SM2 to detect ground and air targets from a greater distance, with certain anti-stealth capabilities. It will also allow the fighter to use the latest long-range missiles.

The Su-30SM2s will receive the latest integrated multi-channel communication, data exchange, navigation, and identification (OSNOD) system, developed for the Su-57 and to be installed on all combat aircraft. Among its advantages, it allows aircraft and drones to communicate with each other, maintain high-speed contact with ground control points, and integrate into modern combat networks.”

 
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HariPrasad

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I believe that the Su 30 intakes are sufficient to accommodate more powerful engines. In fact Russians are already upgrading their Su 30 SM ( Russian version of Su 30 MKI ) to SM2 standard ( proposed Super Sukhoi upgrade for MKI )

The Super Sukhoi Su-30SM2
The upgraded version of the Su-30SM will not only have improved combat features but will also use various parts and equipment from the Su-35. As a result, the maintenance of a large fleet of both types of modern fighters will be simplified. This is especially important in relation to engines, the most expensive aircraft components.

The Su-30SM2 will receive the AL-41F-1S engine, which is also used in the Su-35S. Compared to the power plant used so far in the Su-30SM, its thrust will increase by more than 16%, to 14,500 kg at full post-combustion. In addition, it reduces the cost of maintenance, by doubling the interval between revisions, now reaching 4 thousand hours. Other improvements and plasma ignition made it more efficient, reducing its fuel consumption.

Su-30SM2
Changes to onboard electronics and software will allow the use of new missiles and bombs designed to arm the Su-35 and the fifth-generation Su-57 stealth fighter.

Other improvements include a new radar, the Irbis-E, a powerful PESA-type radar also inherited from the Su-35. It will allow the Su-30SM2 to detect ground and air targets from a greater distance, with certain anti-stealth capabilities. It will also allow the fighter to use the latest long-range missiles.

The Su-30SM2s will receive the latest integrated multi-channel communication, data exchange, navigation, and identification (OSNOD) system, developed for the Su-57 and to be installed on all combat aircraft. Among its advantages, it allows aircraft and drones to communicate with each other, maintain high-speed contact with ground control points, and integrate into modern combat networks.”

It is nice but I would loke to have AL 41 to be sourced from Russia and rest of the things from elsewhere. We can incorporate Paython 5 , Astra mk1 and Mk2 with Mki. If France allow, we can integrate Meteor as well. We can make EW with Israel or we can get it from France in technology transfer. I am not in favor of Russian electronics.
 

AbRaj

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It is nice but I would loke to have AL 41 to be sourced from Russia and rest of the things from elsewhere. We can incorporate Paython 5 , Astra mk1 and Mk2 with Mki. If France allow, we can integrate Meteor as well. We can make EW with Israel or we can get it from France in technology transfer. I am not in favor of Russian electronics.
It’s not possible. Russian won’t share source code for integration of western components and weapons into Su 30. It has a history of not certifying airworthiness of our own MAWS and EW components on Mig 21s and Su 30s, hindering our own EWS development. It’s just a fanboy dream which unfortunately will never materialise.
And if you are thinking about something along the lines of Chinese J Series jets, well forget about it. It will be too time consuming for India unlike China who had their own weapons, radars and EW pods fully developed before venturing into this risky business. And they had money to shut Russians from making too much noise, we just can’t.