Rafale RB of Indian Air Force : News and Discussions

Herciv

Active member
Nov 30, 2017
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Rafale is able to fly 7 hours without any flight supply.
I have found this p43 :
https://www.assemblee-natio...
In
July 2020, the Rafales of the projected air base (BAP) in Le Levant,
engaged in the Chammal operation, passed the 2,000 flight hours mark for
the calendar year alone (4). This milestone required 20,000 hours of
maintenance; 4,000 m3 of fuel; 900 in-flight refueling operations...
4000m3 for 2000 war flight hours give 7 hours if rafale can carry 11T of kerozene.
I could be wrong.
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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According to Captain Charpentier (callsign Charpy, well known), quoted by Jean-Marc Tanguy in the Air & Cosmos spécial Chammal, there is some interesting information about the Rafale M :

  • The radar with the AESA antenna would have a triple range compared to the PESA antenna. Maximum range, practical range, average range, I don't know, but triple!
  • The processing time (consolidation) of a track at low altitude is also visibly accelerated by the AESA antenna.
  • Bi-Scalp configurations are open on the Rafale M. It is their on-board use that is prohibited. From the ground AND with return to the ground, it is possible. This is a sign that the workload induced for the pilot is not insurmountable for a single-seater.
  • The bi-Exocet configurations in point 2, on the other hand, have not been opened up because it is expensive (implying "for an option that is not indispensable").
  • The GBU-24 (2000 lbs) was fired in operation from a belly pack. The bi-GBU-24 is being opened on the Rafale F3R.
  • Charpy says that the Rafale at medium altitude makes little noise and can therefore surprise its targets when it strikes - especially when it fires its AASMs from a distance.
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
9,967
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India
According to Captain Charpentier (callsign Charpy, well known), quoted by Jean-Marc Tanguy in the Air & Cosmos spécial Chammal, there is some interesting information about the Rafale M :

  • The radar with the AESA antenna would have a triple range compared to the PESA antenna. Maximum range, practical range, average range, I don't know, but triple!
  • The processing time (consolidation) of a track at low altitude is also visibly accelerated by the AESA antenna.
  • Bi-Scalp configurations are open on the Rafale M. It is their on-board use that is prohibited. From the ground AND with return to the ground, it is possible. This is a sign that the workload induced for the pilot is not insurmountable for a single-seater.
  • The bi-Exocet configurations in point 2, on the other hand, have not been opened up because it is expensive (implying "for an option that is not indispensable").
  • The GBU-24 (2000 lbs) was fired in operation from a belly pack. The bi-GBU-24 is being opened on the Rafale F3R.
  • Charpy says that the Rafale at medium altitude makes little noise and can therefore surprise its targets when it strikes - especially when it fires its AASMs from a distance.

What is your opinion on the triple range? Is it due to pulse compression, or normal detection range?

I feel like it has to do with when performing something very specific.
 
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randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
9,967
7,619
India
Rafale is able to fly 7 hours without any flight supply.
I have found this p43 :
https://www.assemblee-natio...
In
July 2020, the Rafales of the projected air base (BAP) in Le Levant,
engaged in the Chammal operation, passed the 2,000 flight hours mark for
the calendar year alone (4). This milestone required 20,000 hours of
maintenance; 4,000 m3 of fuel; 900 in-flight refueling operations...
4000m3 for 2000 war flight hours give 7 hours if rafale can carry 11T of kerozene.
I could be wrong.

I think it refers to inflight refuelling which allowed a 7-hour mission with 11T of fuel, including what was transferred.
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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transition.wifeo.com
What is your opinion on the triple range? Is it due to pulse compression, or normal detection range?

I feel like it has to do with when performing something very specific.
From what Thales tells me, it seems to me that it is in strong depointment and look down, because in these conditions the AESA antenna diagram is, a priori, less degraded than that of the PESA.
 
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Herciv

Active member
Nov 30, 2017
100
107
FRANCE
I think it refers to inflight refuelling which allowed a 7-hour mission with 11T of fuel, including what was transferred.
Yes indeed.
The aerial launches of the Rafale de la BAP in Le Levant also mobilized 14 different specialties of mechanics who ensure day and night the implementation, maintenance and repair of the Rafale stationed on the BAP. In a little over 7 months, these airmen and airwomen have carried out nearly 5,000 technical operations for a volume approaching 20,000 hours of maintenance.

2,000 flight hours also represent 4,000 cubic meters of fuel distributed on land and 900 in-flight refueling operations, which will have enabled the aircraft to fly more than 1,000,000 kilometers, or 25 times around the Earth. Since the beginning of 2020, some fifteen personnel from the French Army Fuel Service (SEA) have performed nearly 280 hours of maintenance on petroleum vehicles and equipment.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
 

BMD

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Dec 4, 2017
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What happened here?

1614508409286.png
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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I would like to make a few small calculations in order to size a maintenance team in relation to the number of Rafale pilots.
Let's take the French case where the pilots fly 180 hours a year, and where there are 1.4 pilots per Rafale, which means 250 hours of flight per year.
Normally we find that it takes 8 hours of maintenance per flight hour.

In one year there are about 1600 hours of work in France, so the maintenance of a Rafale will require 250 hours * 8 = 2000 hours of work or 1.25 maintainers.

In the documentation produced for the Finnish call for tenders, it is said that the Rafale can fly 1000 hours per year, in which case it will require 4 times more maintenance, i.e. 5 maintainers per Rafale. For the pilots, the constraint is to distribute the flying hours so that they are all well trained. If we want to maintain this objective, we must also multiply their number by 4, i.e. have 5.6 pilots per plane. If this objective is temporarily abandoned, we will be able to be satisfied with 3 pilots.

In the same Finnish document it is said that the Rafale can withstand a one-month surge during which it would have 350 hours.
It would therefore require 2800 hours of maintenance but in a month there are 160 hours of work, which gives a team of 18 maintainers.
In addition, in a month there are 720 hours, 350 of which are used to fly, so the 2800 hours of work must be spread over the remaining 370, so at least 8 people must work permanently on the Rafale when it is not flying, so this will only be possible if we have 3 teams of 8 maintainers who work in turn day and night on the Rafale when it is not flying.
5 pilots would probably be enough, but we may want to put more for training reasons.