Project 75 India Diesel-electric Submarine Programs (SSK) : Updates and Discussions

Who will win the P75I program?

  • L&T and Navantia

    Votes: 12 40.0%
  • MDL and TKMS

    Votes: 5 16.7%
  • It will get canceled eventually

    Votes: 13 43.3%

  • Total voters
    30
The Baltics are not exactly very deep. So their so called non magnetic hull is pretty useful there. But that has the limitations of strength due to which it cannot dive as deep as say it's normal export variant the Type 214 using conventional steel.

But in our context a lot of missions will happen in IOR given the increased Chinese presence here. So capabilities to dive deeper will be required.
Type 212 are one the most deepest diving conventional subs out there.... Conventional Sub running on diesel power which can dive to great depths are practically useless by the way.
 
Was the Soryu japan SSK taking in consideration for P75I ?
Japanese knew they wouldn't be able to fullfill the ToT conditions, so they withdrew. The Spanish have not. Lets see.
Type 212 are one the most deepest diving conventional subs out there.... Conventional Sub running on diesel power which can dive to great depths are practically useless by the way.
No they aren't. Type 212 and Soryu are having some limitations. Type 212 due to metal used. Soryu due to AIP used.

Kilos and Scorpenes can.
 
The Baltics are not exactly very deep. So their so called non magnetic hull is pretty useful there. But that has the limitations of strength due to which it cannot dive as deep as say it's normal export variant the Type 214 using conventional steel.

But in our context a lot of missions will happen in IOR given the increased Chinese presence here. So capabilities to dive deeper will be required.
Why would they have to choose a magnetic hull if it's not suitable for us?

The Type 212 has diving depth limitations, so it will not be exactly that.

I think it's more of a modernisation of Type 218. The upcoming Dakar Class maybe.
This doesn't look like a derivative a of Type-212. But Type-212CD, it's obvious from the angled hull design. Don't go by the name, it's a very different and bigger 2,500+ ton submarine.

Another chance is germans introducing the new hull design to Type-214 family.
 

‘Germany well positioned in Navy’s submarine deal’

TKMS successfully demonstrated a ‘sea-proven’ Air Independent Propulsion capability, the key determinant in the deal, says the submarine manufacturer’s India head Khalil Rahman


German submarine manufacturer TKMS (Thyssenkrupp Marine Systems) was initially not inclined to bid for the Indian Navy’s mega deal for six conventional submarines under Project-75I due to the “terms and conditions”, but later entered the fray as the German government backed the project, said the company’s India head Khalil Rahman on Wednesday.

He said they successfully demonstrated the Air Independent Propulsion (AIP) capability, the key determinant in the deal, on their Type 212 submarine in the evaluation conducted by the Navy recently.


TKMS has pitched a customised version of its Type 214 for the Indian Navy’s requirements. “Technically we are in a very strong position. Indian Navy is very happy with the Type 209s in service. We have a sea-proven AIP,” Mr. Rahman said expressing confidence during a media interaction. “Our design will be specifically tailored to India and will ensure stealth in the waters... As per terms of the Request For Proposal (RFP), the P-75I design will be handed over to the Indian Navy.”

The Navy’s mega-submarine deal under Project-75I, estimated at over ₹43,000 crore, crossed a major milestone with the completion of Field Evaluation Trials (FET) to check the compliance of the bids received. There are two contenders in the fray - Germany’s TKMS and Navantia of Spain. While an Indian Navy team visited TKMS shipyard in March for FET, the evaluation of Navantia’s offer was conducted in the last week of June, as reported by The Hindu earlier. The German government is expected to take up a stake in TKMS.

On their entry into the deal, Mr. Rahman stated that initially, TKMS had made the decision to keep out. “We initially made the decision not to bid due to terms and conditions in the RFP…. Company felt there was too much risk in the commercial terms. These issues have now been resolved… One of the reasons is the support of the German government,” he said.

He said the German government historically regarded India as a market and partner, and it was really after the invasion of Ukraine that there was a “change of thinking” in the German government, when it was felt that it was very necessary to enter into a deeper partnership with India.

While TKMS has partnered with Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Limited (MDL), Navantia has partnered with Larsen & Toubro.

The FET was only to demonstrate AIP and not to demonstrate the submarine in general, and stipulations in the RFO were very clear in regard to demonstrating a “sea-proven AIP”, Mr. Rahman stressed. The TKMS AIP on offer will be both fuel cell- as well as Lithium Ion-based, giving it enhanced performance, he said, explaining that while fuel cell gives long-range endurance at low speed, Lithium Ion “functions at high speed”.

The RFP states that the first submarine should have indigenous content (IC) of 45% which should go up to 60% for the sixth and last submarine. Also, it stipulates that the first submarine be rolled out 84 months or seven years from the signing of the contract. With both the FETs completed, a technical report will be submitted by the Indian Navy to the Defence Ministry, after which staff evaluation would be done to determine who all have complied.

The submarine deal is expected to figure prominently during upcoming high-level talks with both Germany and Spain. German Chancellor Olaf Scholz is scheduled to visit India in the second half of October for inter-governmental consultations while Prime Minister Narendra Modi is likely to visit Spain in the next few months.

Navantia has offered a submarine based on its new S80 class of submarines, the first of which was launched in 2021 and was commissioned into the Spanish Navy as S-81 Isaac Peral last November. L&T will be responsible for constructing the submarines.

An AIP module acts as a force multiplier as it enables conventional submarines to remain submerged for longer duration thereby improving endurance as well as stealth.

Since World War II, TKMS has built 175 submarines and there are 52 AIP-equipped submarines either operating across the globe or contracted, company officials added
 
Actually the ball is in the Govt hand, much like the rafale deal. My guess is navy will publicly say they are ok with both and Govt would decide which to buy ?
 
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Actually the ball is in the Govt hand, much like the rafale deal. My guess is navy will publicly say they are ok with both and Govt would decide which to buy ?
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Next will be Staff Evaluation -> Contract Negotiation committee.

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