Pashtunistan: Pashtun Human Rights, Pashtun Tahafuz Movement (PTM), Atrocities of Pakistani Army

BlackOpsIndia

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Why there is no thread on Pakistani atrocities on Pashtuns?

Today they broke all records and fired upon the elected representatives. This is biggest opening for India after Bengali massacre by Pakistani Army.

Please someone open a thread with relevant tweets or article of today's events.

Video of that event-


Brave Pakistani Army firing indiscriminately from behind on unarmed civilians. Killed one of their own soldier later on so as to make it look like they were attacked first.
 
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nair

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Modi Accepts Pak PM's Congratulations, Doesn't Extend Invite to Swearing-in Ceremony

"Internally, the government is expected to pay attention to fresh elections to the J&K assembly later this year and will, on a political level, continue to take a stand against Article 35 which allows J&K to frame residency laws. BJP sees it as discriminatory but Valley parties NC and PDP stoutly defend it.

There is a lot of speculation about Modi inviting foreign leaders again for his swearing in ceremony on May 30. But the readout of the Modi-Khan conversation made it clear that no such invitation was made to Khan. Pakistan has featured in the election campaign, with Modi’s decision to retaliate militarily against a terror attack finding huge resonance among the people, cementing his profile as a man of action, particularly against Pakistan-sponsored terror."

Imran Khan: Trust, terror-free atmosphere vital for peace, Modi to Imran | India News - Times of India
Imran is busy resolving PTM crisis......A potential serious threat
 

_Anonymous_

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Indeed. Has all the makings of a potential Bangladesh.
I beg to differ. Nothing of that sort is going to happen short of us not only supporting them but launching a huge offensive to capture PoK. Since either possibilities don't exist, what will happen in the interim is enhanced conflict and redeployment of the PA for say a Radd ul Fasaad - 2. It suits us too in that the PA will be permanently stretched, scarce money will be expended and the sheer brutality of it will further alienate an already alienated population. For the moment though both IK & the PA are playing it smart. They're trying to play down the incident as a one off occurence. The good news from our perspective is that the Punjabis ( most of the PA comprise of them) are gradually becoming more alienated from the rest of the ethnic groups. Hope Sindh flares up too.
 
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Gautam

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I beg to differ. Nothing of that sort is going to happen short of us not only supporting them but launching a huge offensive to capture PoK.
How do you differ ? With out a direct Indian intervention Bangladesh wouldn't happen either. What I meant by "Bangladesh" is the massive upheaval that preceded 1971 war caused by killing of the political/intellectual elite. Attack on PTM might lead to a similar situation. There is a uncanny similarity here. There is also one major difference though, geography. Geography helped us in 71, but plays against us today.

I am against any direct operation as of now and I agree Sindh flare up would be very beneficial as well. Add this to the IMF conditions to be imposed, internal fighting will skyrocket. If we play our cards right and increase pressure on the border, Baluchis will step up their ops. PA will be stretched thin.
 

_Anonymous_

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How do you differ ? With out a direct Indian intervention Bangladesh wouldn't happen either. What I meant by "Bangladesh" is the massive upheaval that preceded 1971 war caused by killing of the political/intellectual elite. Attack on PTM might lead to a similar situation. There is a uncanny similarity here. There is also one major difference though, geography. Geography helped us in 71, but plays against us today.
Well, you nailed it. For a Bangladesh to be created, Indian involvement is necessary. Otherwise it's another Balochistan. Perenially in turmoil and no independence .No subjugation either.Just a see saw of area dominance between the antagonists. The establishment sees the PTM as a front for the TTP. What's preventing them from acting is the fact that the entire movement is peaceful.


Assuming for a moment that the PTM is a front for the TTP, what triggered the incident seems to suggest that the mask is off. A massive crackdown will follow. If the TTP did resort to such a ruse then it's likely that Radd ul Fasaad hss left them severely depleted of men & resources.

OTOH, if the connection to the TTP is tenuous and this is genuinely a movement of FATA & KPK Pashtuns with marginal participation of the TTP as it seems likely ( which is why the PA is treating this entire incident with kid gloves) then it all depends on how PA handles this incident and the extent to which the PTM can further mobilise and pressurize the administration. Please note that the PTM as of now is a peaceful movement with no demands for sovereignty. Their only demand is the PA cease operations and the IDP re settle in their homes. It's our assumption that PA would over react or that PA would react the way they're known to react and precipitate a crisis. Right now the situation is fluid.


I am against any direct operation as of now and I agree Sindh flare up would be very beneficial as well. Add this to the IMF conditions to be imposed, internal fighting will skyrocket. If we play our cards right and increase pressure on the border, Baluchis will step up their ops. PA will be stretched thin.
We aren't going to act now or in the future. We'd only react. Please note that in his speech to the BJP MP's recently in the Central Hall of Parliament, not once was Pakistan mentioned. Of course, it goes without saying that in case massive operations are planned, Modi or anyone in his position wouldn't be announcing it from treetops. As of now, our plans of modernization and Reformation of the armed forces is our priority.

As far as talks with Pakistan go, it'd follow the same old meandering path of diminishing returns that they have over the past decade ever since 26/11. Two things are of importance - Pakistan, whatever it's status - financial, political etc , can't help but respond to the itch called Kashmir. Assuming Modi does away with Article 35A & Article 370, Kashmir will be up in arms. Pakistan, in spite of not being in any position financially to support an aggression will play true to type and try an intervention - in whatever form. What follows then is anyone's guess. Suffice to say that if Modi embarks on such a path, it's a hint that CS, re capture of PoK etc are all on the table.

Finally, the survival of all these separatist movements in Pakistan is linked to India. I'm not just referring to material support. Even with us pressurising the PA like we did post Balakote, these groups can give hell for leather to the PA. If the pressure drops on the LoC, the boot is on the other foot for these separatist movements.
 
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RATHORE

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I beg to differ.
This is potentially an even better opportunity than Bangladesh. And it doesn't even necessarily require the level of Indian interference that occurred in Bangladesh.

Unlike the people of East Pak. who were mainly peaceful civilians, many of them academically oriented - and had to be artificially turned into a fighting force; Pashtuns have a very very long association with warfare & weapons. They won't need anywhere close to the training or support; and their access to high quality weapons is much better too. Add in the twin advantages of terrain & straddling a very porous border b/w AFG and PAK (which also opens up room for generous AFG assistance), and you can see how easily this situation can spiral out of Pak's control.

There's also the fact that an estimated 20% of the Pakistani Army is Pashtun (I don't think Bengali numbers were anywhere close to that) - and most of them will rebel sooner or later.
 

Volcano

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I think pakistanArmy is stupid enough to make Manzoor Pashteen another Akbar Bugti . A country that ruled by military will always have a militaristic approach entrenched in its core. Pakistan Army will probably deal PTM militerly just like they did to Muhajirs of karachi in 90s,which caused a 2 decade bloodshed in Karachi
 

_Anonymous_

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This is potentially an even better opportunity than Bangladesh. And it doesn't even necessarily require the level of Indian interference that occurred in Bangladesh.

Unlike the people of East Pak. who were mainly peaceful civilians, many of them academically oriented - and had to be artificially turned into a fighting force; Pashtuns have a very very long association with warfare & weapons. They won't need anywhere close to the training or support; and their access to high quality weapons is much better too. Add in the twin advantages of terrain & straddling a very porous border b/w AFG and PAK (which also opens up room for generous AFG assistance), and you can see how easily this situation can spiral out of Pak's control.

There's also the fact that an estimated 20% of the Pakistani Army is Pashtun (I don't think Bengali numbers were anywhere close to that) - and most of them will rebel sooner or later.
If what you're proposing were to occur, it would have quite some time back. The fact is the Pashtuns are severely divided. Not just in terms of geography but in terms of ideology, motivation, goals etc. Consider this - the Mehsuds in FATA are in the forefront of the TTP. Things aren't so bad for the state of Pakistan in KPK ( I deliberately chose to refer to these individual units by their former names in spite of the fact that FATA has been amalgamated within KPK) . The Haqqanis and other Af Taliban have their bases in Pakistan but members of their tribes inhabiting both Afghanistan & Pakistan. They're also supported by Pakistan to wage war against the Afghanistan state.

For anyone seeking to carve out an independent Pashtunistan or even see this part of Pakistan be amalgamated with Afghanistan, they'd have to navigate between a maze of tribes with different goals, often working at cross purposes with each other. That's easier said than done.

Please also hark back to the time the British ruled the sub continent or even earlier to see that these tribes were never United. That's one reason why outsiders have always held away over them. The trick was always to set one against the other. That's what the Pakistan deep state has done. This time they've used the currency of religion to set up an insurgency against Afghanistan and when faced with blowback from a section of them, they've gone after this section, hammer and tongs. The very fact that all these groupings share the same ideology yet the TTP is fighting a battle, largely isolated , on its own, should be telling.

Our best bet is to let the situation fester. The more the discontent and disconnect between the ordinary Pashtun in FATA and the Pakistani state the better for us. There's no doubt that there exists a latent aspiration for an independent Pashtunistan or even union with Afghanistan amongst the Pashtuns on both sides of the Durand Line, but in the absence of a charismatic figure or a leadership able to surmount the many hurdles individual tribes throw up and weld them together into a cohesive whole, nothing productive from theirs or our point of view will ensue.

Meanwhile, let's be content watching the slow implosion of the state of Pakistan. Let's also not forget that these are essentially turbulent people whom no one has been able to subjugate permanently. They can either be exterminated like what Changez Khan did and scattered the rest into oblivion or be kept at arms length. For that we have a buffer called Pakistan. Let's be grateful for tender mercies.
 

RATHORE

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The fact is the Pashtuns are severely divided.
This is true. But at the same time, if anything is going to unite Pashtuns, it's the exceedingly cruel repression of their people by Pakistan - paired with Pakistan smearing them all as Indian/RAW agents for making legitimate demands. Pakistan trifles with them at its own peril.
 

randomradio

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_Anonymous_

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This is true. But at the same time, if anything is going to unite Pashtuns, it's the exceedingly cruel repression of their people by Pakistan - paired with Pakistan smearing them all as Indian/RAW agents for making legitimate demands. Pakistan trifles with them at its own peril.
It's a developing story. As I wrote in an earlier post, the situation is fluid. Let's hope for the worst or best depending on your perspective.
 

ghostwhowalks

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ive written this earlier too on this forum. Does the bloody Pakjabi army have a death wish? why are they hell bent on alienating a powerful section of the populace that is the Pushtoons. if the Pushtoon Jigras formally declare war on Pak army, the Pakjabis will have a very very tough fight on their hands.
 

Notsuperstitious

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ive written this earlier too on this forum. Does the bloody Pakjabi army have a death wish? why are they hell bent on alienating a powerful section of the populace that is the Pushtoons. if the Pushtoon Jigras formally declare war on Pak army, the Pakjabis will have a very very tough fight on their hands.
They have a genuine pashtoon problem as their annexation to Pakistan was forced
 

randomradio

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ive written this earlier too on this forum. Does the bloody Pakjabi army have a death wish? why are they hell bent on alienating a powerful section of the populace that is the Pushtoons. if the Pushtoon Jigras formally declare war on Pak army, the Pakjabis will have a very very tough fight on their hands.
The Pakjabis will be fine on that front as long as the Pashtuns do not get external funding. I think they should get "development and humanitarian assistance" from India.
 

BlackOpsIndia

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5 more bodies of Pashtuns killed by Pakistan army recovered, still have no idea how many are missing after yesterday Pakistan army attacked political rally of Pashtuns. Media is choked and information is very limited.

Prominent Pashtun rights activists picked up from home and kept in some undisclosed location. Elected Pakistani Pashtun representatives even after massive rigging in favour of Imran Khan are arrested, fired upon as Pakistan army tried to kill them, now abducted and kept at undisclosed location.

Few days back Pakistani Army spokesman threatened massacre of Pashtuns by saying their time is up


before that he compared them to dog and asked Pakistanis to take care of dogs (kill them) in a midnight tweet after they did a political rally. (Tweet deleted now)
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PTM is fighting against inhuman treatment against Pashtuns where elderly Pashtuns are striped and searched at every few KM, people dislocated in fight against terror are not provided compensation as their houses were destroyed by tanks and carpet bombings. Few pictures below-

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The leaders of this organization even woman are arrested again and again by army and kept in undisclosed location, some killed, some missing. A solider was killed few days back when a woman couldn't take daily intrusion into house and trying to rape her. Happening all the time in that area.

Even the tribal system of governance where Pahstuns have more say is being replaced and Punjabis are sent to govern them.

Soldier martyred as terrorists raid North Waziristan checkpost: ISPR - Pakistan - DAWN.COM