North Korea Is Slapping Nukes Onto Submarines

BMD

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North Korea reportedly tested a ballistic missile launched from a submarine.

The test, which took place earlier this month, indicates that the impoverished country plans to put nukes on submarines.

A second strike capability means that any attack on North Korea could be avenged.

North Korea tested a submarine-launched ballistic missile earlier this month in a bid to make its nuclear weapons arsenal—and leader Kim Jong-un—invulnerable to attack. The short-range ballistic missile test demonstrates that the country is serious about placing nuclear weapons under the Pacific Ocean, where North Korea hopes it can evade detection. It's all part of a plan to use the chilling logic of deterrence to fend off a nuclear attack by an outside power.

The test was carried out on October 19, and involved the Gorae- ("whale") class missile submarine, Hero Ship August 24. First spotted via satellite in 2014, Hero Ship was North Korea's first missile-firing submarine. Unlike U.S. missile submarines, which are nuclear-powered and equipped with 20 launch tubes, Hero Ship is equipped with just one launch tube, built into the sail, and uses a diesel electric propulsion system.


Last week's test involved a new short-range ballistic missile, which flew 267 to 280 miles, according to NKNews.org, a privately owned news website (based in South Korea) that covers North Korea. That's far enough to hit any location in South Korea, including U.S. bases on the Korean peninsula, but not far enough to reach Japan.

Unlike long-range ballistic missiles—which launch their warhead payloads during a quick trip into low-Earth orbit—short-range ballistic missiles often have an "aeroballistic profile," meaning that the warhead never flies higher than the upper atmosphere. This makes them harder to destroy, especially for missile-defense systems that are designed to engage warheads in orbit. A short-range ballistic missile will also have a quicker trip to a nearer target, giving little time for the defender to react.


Photo credit: DigitalGlobe/ScapeWare3d - Getty Images
The expense of developing both a submarine and a submarine-launched ballistic missile indicates that North Korea plans to arm the system with nuclear weapons. The Nuclear Threat Initiative, a Washington, D.C. based nonprofit focused on "reducing nuclear and biological threats imperiling humanity" estimates that North Korea has between 25 and 60 nuclear weapons. Most of those nukes are land-based, meaning North Korea must launch them from a missile mounted on a truck or rail car. The weapons, fixed on mobile launch platforms, are designed to scatter in the event of a crisis, making them more difficult for U.S. intelligence to locate.

The more uncertain the Pentagon is about the location of North Korea's nukes, the less confident it is about finding and destroying them all—and deploying nuclear weapons at sea creates additional uncertainty. Even if a U.S.-South Korean strike destroyed all of the North's land-based missiles, the onslaught might fail to catch all of the country's missile-firing submarines, which could then retaliate by firing their missiles.

The goal is to make a surprise attack (or first strike, in nuclear parlance) so complicated that the enemy can't guarantee it will be 100 percent successful. If just one nuclear weapon survives to devastate a city, the attack will have failed.

Photo credit: U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Juan Sua
Photo credit: U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Juan Sua
Submarines are difficult, though not impossible, to detect. Most of North Korea's submarine fleet is of a 1960s vintage and easy to locate by modern standards. Although Gorae is new, it's not much better. North Korea's missile submarines would likely depart prior to a crisis and then sit quietly on the bottom of the ocean, waiting for launch orders.

Will it work? Maybe not. Submarine expert H.I. Sutton estimates that the submarine can only remain at sea for one month or less, after which it would need to return to port. The sub would also be aggressively tracked by U.S. and South Korean forces whenever it goes to sea, with anti-submarine warfare ships, aircraft, and other submarines prepared to destroy it on short notice. Finally, the submarine would need some ability to receive launch orders, ideally by radio; that link between Pyongyang's inner circle and the submarine crew could be severed by jamming.

North Korea's submarine-basing system is flawed, but still has the potential to be extremely dangerous. It's also key to the survival of the regime, especially Kim Jong-un, and for that reason, North Korea will eventually fix those flaws. If Kim's missile-firing submarines can dissuade his enemies from launching a surprise attack, he'll rest easier—and have a freer hand running his country.
 
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Ginvincible

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it's crazy to imagine how far North Korea has come all these years. Even with foreign assistance they've done amazing things. I wouldn't have believed all this progress 5 or 10 years ago but I can definitely see them miniturizing a warhead and developing longer range stealthier subs to place these on. I long thought they would have collapsed from economic struggles or extreme famine. Wonder how this will all translate to South Korea if the Kim family ends and the Koreas merge.
 
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jetray

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View attachment 21734View attachment 21735


North Korea reportedly tested a ballistic missile launched from a submarine.

The test, which took place earlier this month, indicates that the impoverished country plans to put nukes on submarines.

A second strike capability means that any attack on North Korea could be avenged.

North Korea tested a submarine-launched ballistic missile earlier this month in a bid to make its nuclear weapons arsenal—and leader Kim Jong-un—invulnerable to attack. The short-range ballistic missile test demonstrates that the country is serious about placing nuclear weapons under the Pacific Ocean, where North Korea hopes it can evade detection. It's all part of a plan to use the chilling logic of deterrence to fend off a nuclear attack by an outside power.

The test was carried out on October 19, and involved the Gorae- ("whale") class missile submarine, Hero Ship August 24. First spotted via satellite in 2014, Hero Ship was North Korea's first missile-firing submarine. Unlike U.S. missile submarines, which are nuclear-powered and equipped with 20 launch tubes, Hero Ship is equipped with just one launch tube, built into the sail, and uses a diesel electric propulsion system.


Last week's test involved a new short-range ballistic missile, which flew 267 to 280 miles, according to NKNews.org, a privately owned news website (based in South Korea) that covers North Korea. That's far enough to hit any location in South Korea, including U.S. bases on the Korean peninsula, but not far enough to reach Japan.

Unlike long-range ballistic missiles—which launch their warhead payloads during a quick trip into low-Earth orbit—short-range ballistic missiles often have an "aeroballistic profile," meaning that the warhead never flies higher than the upper atmosphere. This makes them harder to destroy, especially for missile-defense systems that are designed to engage warheads in orbit. A short-range ballistic missile will also have a quicker trip to a nearer target, giving little time for the defender to react.


Photo credit: DigitalGlobe/ScapeWare3d - Getty Images
The expense of developing both a submarine and a submarine-launched ballistic missile indicates that North Korea plans to arm the system with nuclear weapons. The Nuclear Threat Initiative, a Washington, D.C. based nonprofit focused on "reducing nuclear and biological threats imperiling humanity" estimates that North Korea has between 25 and 60 nuclear weapons. Most of those nukes are land-based, meaning North Korea must launch them from a missile mounted on a truck or rail car. The weapons, fixed on mobile launch platforms, are designed to scatter in the event of a crisis, making them more difficult for U.S. intelligence to locate.

The more uncertain the Pentagon is about the location of North Korea's nukes, the less confident it is about finding and destroying them all—and deploying nuclear weapons at sea creates additional uncertainty. Even if a U.S.-South Korean strike destroyed all of the North's land-based missiles, the onslaught might fail to catch all of the country's missile-firing submarines, which could then retaliate by firing their missiles.

The goal is to make a surprise attack (or first strike, in nuclear parlance) so complicated that the enemy can't guarantee it will be 100 percent successful. If just one nuclear weapon survives to devastate a city, the attack will have failed.

Photo credit: U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Juan Sua
Photo credit: U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 2nd Class Juan Sua
Submarines are difficult, though not impossible, to detect. Most of North Korea's submarine fleet is of a 1960s vintage and easy to locate by modern standards. Although Gorae is new, it's not much better. North Korea's missile submarines would likely depart prior to a crisis and then sit quietly on the bottom of the ocean, waiting for launch orders.

Will it work? Maybe not. Submarine expert H.I. Sutton estimates that the submarine can only remain at sea for one month or less, after which it would need to return to port. The sub would also be aggressively tracked by U.S. and South Korean forces whenever it goes to sea, with anti-submarine warfare ships, aircraft, and other submarines prepared to destroy it on short notice. Finally, the submarine would need some ability to receive launch orders, ideally by radio; that link between Pyongyang's inner circle and the submarine crew could be severed by jamming.

North Korea's submarine-basing system is flawed, but still has the potential to be extremely dangerous. It's also key to the survival of the regime, especially Kim Jong-un, and for that reason, North Korea will eventually fix those flaws. If Kim's missile-firing submarines can dissuade his enemies from launching a surprise attack, he'll rest easier—and have a freer hand running his country.
We dont have shit to eat but will build nukes. I like the attitude of the fat boy , this retard has eclipsed maniac mao.
 

randomradio

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Nov 30, 2017
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it's crazy to imagine how far North Korea has come all these years. Even with foreign assistance they've done amazing things. I wouldn't have believed all this progress 5 or 10 years ago but I can definitely see them miniturizing a warhead and developing longer range stealthier subs to place these on. I long thought they would have collapsed from economic struggles or extreme famine. Wonder how this will all translate to South Korea if the Kim family ends and the Koreas merge.

Money's obviously coming in from China.
 
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AbRaj

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Money's obviously coming in from China.
Chinese have learned the art of implanting such cancerous regimes from US and Colonial powers of West.
one in East and one in West and you have neutralised all the neighbors.
I believe they are trying to develop Iran into one such Cancer to target Middle East.
 

randomradio

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Nov 30, 2017
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Chinese have learned the art of implanting such cancerous regimes from US and Colonial powers of West.
one in East and one in West and you have neutralised all the neighbors.
I believe they are trying to develop Iran into one such Cancer to target Middle East.

That's how the SU also functioned. Also why the US rabidly takes control of such regimes or crushes them.

In our case we have Pak in the west and Myanmar in the east. We need to eventually deal with both.
 
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zinswinsin

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Man tech transfers are OP in the real world if it's actually state to state and it's a dictatorship.
 

Lolwa

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Chinese have learned the art of implanting such cancerous regimes from US and Colonial powers of West.
one in East and one in West and you have neutralised all the neighbors.
I believe they are trying to develop Iran into one such Cancer to target Middle East.
Iran is too ambitious and dangerous for that. And it will shift the entire Arab world into western axis. Turkey seems a far more likelier candidate.
Plus Iran is way close to China and has similar expansionist ambitions once it's ready.
 
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AbRaj

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Iran is too ambitious and dangerous for that. And it will shift the entire Arab world into western axis. Turkey seems a far more likelier candidate.
Plus Iran is way close to China and has similar expansionist ambitions once it's ready.
All these malignant regimes are expansionists at the core, be it’s NoKo, PaX or Turkey. Chinese just provide them with Oxygen and nourishment to grow and destroy the rest of the neighbourhood.
 

BMD

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Money's obviously coming in from China.
Or Iran.
Chinese have learned the art of implanting such cancerous regimes from US and Colonial powers of West.
one in East and one in West and you have neutralised all the neighbors.
I believe they are trying to develop Iran into one such Cancer to target Middle East.
Both PRK and PRC are cancerous regimes implanted by comrade Stalin's USSR.
 

randomradio

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Nah, they don't have the muscle for it.

Both PRK and PRC are cancerous regimes implanted by comrade Stalin's USSR.

The US is equally to blame too. They helped PRC financially over the last three decades and ended up creating their own worst enemy. And it's also the US's fault that they couldn't finish the job in the 50s in Korea, else we would have had a very powerful country right across the Chinese border capable of invading China instead of a retarded Siamese twin.
 
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AbRaj

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Or Iran.

Both PRK and PRC are cancerous regimes implanted by comrade Stalin's USSR.
PRC is not just a Cancer. It has morphed into a Monster thanks to greed of US and European politicians.
The situation is hopeless now and someone has to take a stand otherwise they will gobble one country after the other, either by hook or crook.
 
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randomradio

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PRC is not just a Cancer. It has morphed into a Monster thanks to greed of US and European politicians.
The situation is hopeless now and someone has to take a stand otherwise they will gobble one country after the other, either by hook or crook.

The world is very lucky the Chinese don't have extremely weak neighbours. There's Russia in the north, with Mongolia acting as a buffer state. There's SoKo, Japan and the US in the east. India in the Southwest. Central Asia is protected by Russia. Taiwan is protected by the US. And ASEAN will be a powerful bloc in the long term. And the worst case for China is an alliance between just two of these power blocs, with the worst being the team up between the US and India.
 
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BMD

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Nah, they don't have the muscle for it.



The US is equally to blame too. They helped PRC financially over the last three decades and ended up creating their own worst enemy. And it's also the US's fault that they couldn't finish the job in the 50s in Korea, else we would have had a very powerful country right across the Chinese border capable of invading China instead of a retarded Siamese twin.
As Abraj said, Both the US and the EU helped China due to their greed. Agreed on Korea, the US could have used a nuke back then and there's f*ck all China could have done about it. NK is more of a growth/mole than a twin of any kind. I've been watching Mr. Sunshine on Netflix lately and what struck me most is how the current PRK population are forced to behave like 19th century Korean slaves under the Kim dynasty.
 

AbRaj

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The world is very lucky the Chinese don't have extremely weak neighbours. There's Russia in the north, with Mongolia acting as a buffer state. There's SoKo, Japan and the US in the east. India in the Southwest. Central Asia is protected by Russia. Taiwan is protected by the US. And ASEAN will be a powerful bloc in the long term. And the worst case for China is an alliance between just two of these power blocs, with the worst being the team up between the US and India.
First you are ignoring countries that have already been gobbled up by the PRC like Tibet, East Turkestan,Manchuria, Yunan and South Mongolia etc.
Secondly Mongolia have effectively been castrated by the decade long blockade by Chinese. Mongolia is to China is like Afghanistan to Pakistan.
Same is true for SoKo and Japan as both have been struggling to counter Kim’s mood swings.
ASEAN is like weaker version of European Union. It’s too fragmented to fight China.
Even India have wasted all its options of peaceful coexistence before starting to mobilise its forces. We have done all kinds of appeasements to Xini the pooh despite them arming Pakees with Nukes, Tanks, subs,jets and all kinds of weapons and even buildings roads in occupied Kashmir. We bent backwards for Xi to take a swing. All the while Chinese encroaching in our territories bit by bit.

And I’m not too sure about the will of Americans to fight Chinese.
look what happened in Afghanistan. They barely had few hundreds of operators since last few years, that too not in active combat but mainly as instructors and service providers. But even that was too much for them. And they handed Afghans to Chinese on platter.
 
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Lolwa

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As Abraj said, Both the US and the EU helped China due to their greed. Agreed on Korea, the US could have used a nuke back then and there's f*ck all China could have done about it. NK is more of a growth/mole than a twin of any kind. I've been watching Mr. Sunshine on Netflix lately and what struck me most is how the current PRK population are forced to behave like 19th century Korean slaves under the Kim dynasty.
Actually all of East Asia hasn't changed in terms of nations. Apart from Japan most East asian regimes are pretty authoritarian and very similar in function to the previous versions like Qin Empire for the chinese. Even the high-handedness of state power can be seen in all of there regimes which was pretty common among East asian empires since forever.
 
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AbRaj

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Actually all of East Asia hasn't changed in terms of nations. Apart from Japan most East asian regimes are pretty authoritarian and very similar in function to the previous versions like Qin Empire for the chinese. Even the high-handedness of state power can be seen in all of there regimes which was pretty common among East asian empires since forever.
Not just East but entire Asia with few exceptions like SoKo, Japan,Singapore, Philippines, India etc.
 

Lolwa

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Not just East but entire Asia with few exceptions like SoKo, Japan,Singapore, Philippines, India etc.
Even soko and Singapore were pretty autocratic for industrialising and still are if you look beyond their "democratic veil"