Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning and F-22 'Raptor' : News & Discussion

_Anonymous_

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Dec 4, 2017
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This does not changes the fact that F35 is made with Dassault tools , and not the contrary :cool:
No kidding !!

The F-35 is made with "Duh ssault" tools !!?!!


Any self respecting American would rather eat a snail & a frog along with crow & Camembert than admit to it . You should provide the evidence for it right here Monsieur.
 
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Innominate

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This does not changes the fact that F35 is made with Dassault tools , and not the contrary :cool:
Lol. What is your point? I mean why bring up something so irrelevant and pointless? Is it to make yourself feel better? This is what I mean about Rafail fanboys being delusional. Is LM use of Dassault software considered a victory to you Rafail fanboys?

You know what F-35 has been kicking Rafails a s s so much that I actually feel bad for you fanboys. You people are so desperate for a victory that I will allow you this pointless victory that has nothing to do with reality that the Rafail is inferior to F-35.

Congratulations on this victory. LM and F-35 should be ashamed of themselves for outdoing Dassault using Dassault software in some of the designs of the F-35 and ruining Rafails export markets. Every time a nation selects the F-35 over the Rafail due to F-35 being overwhelmingly superior to Rafail LM should feel bad and ask Dassault for forgiveness....

Congratulations I applaud your victory.
giphy.gif
 
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BMD

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It can "supercruise" (*) only in a slight descent, this is why the so called supercruise is limited in range.
Good AESA : I hope so. It is big, that's sure. Thanks to the AESA mastery of USA I hope it is good.

(*) LM supercruise definition is : > mach 1.4 , and not in descent ;)
No, it can supercruise at M1.2 in level flight.

*Rafale fails that definition even clean and certainly with stores/tanks.
You know Catia ?
Or Solidworks ?
And what does that software run on?
 

Bon Plan

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WRONG WRONG WRONG WROOONG, WRONG WRONG WRONG WROOOONG! YOUR WRONG!!! YOUR WRONG!!! YOUR WROOOONG!!!

When are you going to come to your senses and say to yourself, I better be careful of what claim/pull out y a s s or WHOHE will prove me wrong making me look like a fool....

I dare you to post where LM or the USAF says it can only do it in "slight decline" I'm sure I'll be waiting for that source indefinitely.

Rafail fanboys really are the most delusional people that they will make up a lie and force themselves to believe it. I'm willing to bet they won't believe the Rafail lost in Finland but somehow Finland was forced to take F-35 against their will just to make themselves feel better,
WRONG WRONG WRONG. YOU'RE WONG OR YOU'RE A LIAR.

a quick googling shows that the definitive article about the F-35's supersonic dash came out of the November 2012 edition of the AirForce Magazine, which unfortunately now requires a paid membership to view. But the quotes taken from that article is as follows:


http://www.airforce-magazine.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/2012/November 2012/1112fighter.aspx

The F-35, while not technically a "supercruising" aircraft, can maintain Mach 1.2 for a dash of 150 miles without using fuel-gulping afterburners.

"Mach 1.2 is a good speed for you, according to the pilots," O’Bryan said.
 

Innominate

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WRONG WRONG WRONG. YOU'RE WONG OR YOU'RE A LIAR.

a quick googling shows that the definitive article about the F-35's supersonic dash came out of the November 2012 edition of the AirForce Magazine, which unfortunately now requires a paid membership to view. But the quotes taken from that article is as follows:


http://www.airforce-magazine.com/MagazineArchive/Pages/2012/November 2012/1112fighter.aspx
So where does it say "slight decline" like you claimed? Come on I'm waiting.
 

BMD

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Garbage, all sorts of faulty spec sheets around. I have one from BAE saying a Sea Harrier does M1.3. Sometimes undergrads cobble this crap together, or high school students on a placement. The Rafale's supercruise speed gradually snuck up from M1.2 to M.14 after the Austrians revealed the Typhoon could supercruise at M1.5. The Typhoon has demonstrated its supercruise in bids and it has always been remarked upon as significantly better than the competition.
 
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Innominate

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Even with the skinny center tank it has waaay less fuel than F-35 so notice that Dassault has never given an estimation what range can it supercruise (if it even does) so I guess we can assume until otherwise that this supercruise done by Rafail is very short range like maybe 40-60nm.

F-35 can do 150 dash miles without a "slight decline" and F-22 (what they disclosed) supercruise numbers are also out and yet for all the boasting Rafail fanboys like to do about their planes supercruise ability there's never been an estimation of its range. I don't think I can recall any nation that flies this plane bringing up its supercruise capability like they do with F-22. Could it be its range is so short it's not worth it? Hmm. :unsure:
 
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Innominate

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No, we can't assume what you are supposing. Already too many lies....
Yes we can assume just like you assumed/lied the F-35 "supercruised" 150 miles in "slight decline." Since Duhssault doesn't even give an estimation of range like the US does for F-35 and F-22 it leads me to suspect the Rafail supercruise is for such a short period of time that they don't dare to even give an estimation. If the Rafail can go over mach1+ for 20-30 miles without afterburner than yeah it technically supercruised and Duhssault can claim the plane can SP. That simple.

F-35's F135 was not built to supercruise it has a time-at-temperature limitation on its turbine that restricts it from continuous supercruise operation. I can tell you this F-35 SP goes much farther than Rafail and its what... 13-14k pounds of fuel which includes the1250 liter center tank...unless you got any sources from French air force or Dassault saying otherwise?

Seems you're sorta in a catch 22, eh? Rafail with a 1250 liter center tank carries waay less fuel than F-35 and the F-35 can "SP" for 150 miles which means Rafail.... Get where I'm going? :sneaky:
 
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Bon Plan

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Yes we can assume just like you assumed/lied the F-35 "supercruised" 150 miles in "slight decline." Since Duhssault doesn't even give an estimation of range like the US does for F-35 and F-22 it leads me to suspect the Rafail supercruise is for such a short period of time that they don't dare to even give an estimation. If the Rafail can go over mach1+ for 20-30 miles without afterburner than yeah it technically supercruised and Duhssault can claim the plane can SP. That simple.

F-35's F135 was not built to supercruise it has a time-at-temperature limitation on its turbine that restricts it from continuous supercruise operation. I can tell you this F-35 SP goes much farther than Rafail and its what... 13-14k pounds of fuel which includes the1250 liter center tank...unless you got any sources from French air force or Dassault saying otherwise?

Seems you're sorta in a catch 22, eh? Rafail with a 1250 liter center tank carries waay less fuel than F-35 and the F-35 can "SP" for 150 miles which means Rafail.... Get where I'm going? :sneaky:
F35 was studied to replace F16 in CAS, A10 and Harrier. No need of supercruise as the F22 would have been 750 in the USAF.
With the cut in F22 procurement they tried to add air to air refinements to the flying turkey. But as it is shape as a farm door (because the CAS mission don't need something better), it is and always will be limited in speed.
And more limited now as the after burner use is limited so as to avoid more damage to the rear part of the frame...
Flyingturkey-35 was its nick name.
 

BMD

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F35 was studied to replace F16 in CAS, A10 and Harrier. No need of supercruise as the F22 would have been 750 in the USAF.
With the cut in F22 procurement they tried to add air to air refinements to the flying turkey. But as it is shape as a farm door (because the CAS mission don't need something better), it is and always will be limited in speed.
And more limited now as the after burner use is limited so as to avoid more damage to the rear part of the frame...
Flyingturkey-35 was its nick name.
The F-35 has A2A because the F-16 and F-18 has A2A.
 
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john0496

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Nov 11, 2020
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Come on Whohe
Spell after me "Dassault" d-a-s-s-a-u-l-t and "Rafale" r-a-f-a-l-e (if you prefer : gust of wind, or gun burst of fire if you translate from french)

I allways spell it right: "F-35 made with Dassault systèmes's 3DEXPERIENCE"
 
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Innominate

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F35 was studied to replace F16 in CAS, A10 and Harrier. No need of supercruise as the F22 would have been 750 in the USAF.
With the cut in F22 procurement they tried to add air to air refinements to the flying turkey. But as it is shape as a farm door (because the CAS mission don't need something better), it is and always will be limited in speed.
And more limited now as the after burner use is limited so as to avoid more damage to the rear part of the frame...
Flyingturkey-35 was its nick name.

Lol. Wow going waay off topic totally ignoring the fact Rafail likely can SC for a very short time so much so that its estimated range in SC is totally avoided... that's ok I'll humor you and answer your off topic post.

Spoken like a person that doesn't know what he's talking about. F-35 was a THREE BRANCH fighter for USAF, Marines AND NAVY!!! The F-22 had no correlation with F-35 not becoming a SC fighter, babe, Navy doesn't fly F-22 did the Navy require their F-35 to SC... NO!

Right now the best Air to Air fighters by far are the F-35 and F-22 with F-35 being ahead of F-22. F-35 beats the F-22 in stealth and F-35's EODAS will detect the F-22 first when both fighters start jamming each other at BVR ranges. In the WVR realm F-35 again comes out on top due to EODAS making F-35 armed with Aim-120D and Aim-9xII extreme HOB missiles. This is why the F-22's are being retired early they are expensive to maintain and are not as capable as the F-35.

Now if only Congress allowed the USAF to retire A-10's and many legacy fighters the USAF would be in good shape and have the budget to buy more F-35's a year than to slow down until block 4 is ready.

Btw... What's "farm door?"
 

Bon Plan

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Lol. Wow going waay off topic totally ignoring the fact Rafail likely can SC for a very short time so much so that its estimated range in SC is totally avoided... that's ok I'll humor you and answer your off topic post.

Spoken like a person that doesn't know what he's talking about. F-35 was a THREE BRANCH fighter for USAF, Marines AND NAVY!!! The F-22 had no correlation with F-35 not becoming a SC fighter, babe, Navy doesn't fly F-22 did the Navy require their F-35 to SC... NO!

Right now the best Air to Air fighters by far are the F-35 and F-22 with F-35 being ahead of F-22. F-35 beats the F-22 in stealth and F-35's EODAS will detect the F-22 first when both fighters start jamming each other at BVR ranges. In the WVR realm F-35 again comes out on top due to EODAS making F-35 armed with Aim-120D and Aim-9xII extreme HOB missiles. This is why the F-22's are being retired early they are expensive to maintain and are not as capable as the F-35.

Now if only Congress allowed the USAF to retire A-10's and many legacy fighters the USAF would be in good shape and have the budget to buy more F-35's a year than to slow down until block 4 is ready.

Btw... What's "farm door?"
OK, OK.... in your mind it is "USA uber alles".
Simple mind it is.