Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning and F-22 'Raptor' : News & Discussion

Herciv

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In Australia : for 2020-2021 8000 hours budgeted in the operational contract, 5000 done ...


For 2019-2020 with 22 F-35? 4500 HOURS budgeted , 3000 done !!!! ANd they are all new aircraft.

I.E. => F-35 is not able to fly more than 150 hours / year whatever the dollars you can put on it. In the same time F-18 fly more than its operationnal contract.
I.E. In a case of a war the f-35 will never be ready to sustain a high operationnal tempo.


Home page : Budget : Department of Defence
 
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Picdelamirand-oil

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Finally, it is not only the GAO that is beginning to distrust the promises of the F-35:

House appropriators have made good on threats by key congressional Democrats to halt the long-standing practice by lawmakers of adding aircraft to the Pentagon’s annual proposed F-35 Joint Strike Fighter buy, providing $8.54 billion in procurement funds for just the 85 aircraft requested— 48 of which are Air Force F-35A models. (The committee did give the service an additional $50 million in F-35 procurement funds for “depo acceleration.”)

The report does not explain the decision (summarized by the HAC on June 29) on the F-35 buy. But the lack of an increase in funded aircraft reflects the warning by House Armed Services readiness subcommittee chairman Rep. John Garamendi, D-Calif., who back in April said congressional Democrats are done with business as usual for the JSF due to concerns about the jet’s expected $1.2 trillion life-time sustainment costs.
Appropriators Increase Air Force Aircraft Procurement, Cut Missiles And Ammo - Breaking Defense
 
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zinswinsin

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"Lockheed's F-35A Cost-Saving Goal Is Not Fully In Its Control to Realize>"

A few statement tells the whole issue:

"As the airframe supplier. Lockheed directly controls 39% of the F-35A's hourly operating costs, a company official says. By contrast, the Air Force controls 47% of the cost. The engine supplier, Pratt & Whitney, is responsible for 14%"

"Lockheed believes it has a solid plan to reduce the airframe portion of the cost per flight hour by 40% by the end of fiscal 2025"

"Lockheed's plan would reduce the cost per flight hour of the F-35A to $27,852, which is still $2,852 higher than the company's commitment"
 
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Bon Plan

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US Admits Its F-35 Stealth Fighter Jets Plagued With Over 860 Defects; Flight Simulator Non-Operational

The Lockheed Martin F-35 stealth fighter jet, the most expensive aircraft in history, still cannot even be adequately tested for operational use because its simulator system remains inadequate and has not yet been upgraded, a Government Accountability Office (GAO) report said. Why China’s...
eurasiantimes.com

****

Fifteen Percent Of U.S. Air Force F-35s Don’t Have Working Engines

Marine Corps, Navy, and foreign F-35s are also being impacted by ongoing problems with the jets’ engines.

But it's not important. The F35 simulator can to nearly all the tasks as we have seen in the swiss contest.
 
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Bon Plan

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F-35 Program Could Be Cancelled in 2023

The US Air force plan for the last two decades has been to buy lots of F-35s and retire the various F-15, F-16 and F18.
Brown acknowledged the F-35 is having engine wear issues. This is on top of many other major software problems, airframe and weapons problems.

The JSF program was expected to cost about $200 billion in base-year 2002 dollars when SDD was awarded in 2001. By 2017, delays and cost overruns had pushed the F-35 program’s expected acquisition costs to $406.5 billion, with total lifetime cost (i.e., to 2070) to $1.5 trillion in then-year dollars which also includes operations and maintenance. Delays in development and operational test and evaluation pushed full-rate production to 2021.

The US will have about 800 F-35s by the end of 2021 and about 970 by the end of 2022. Winding down the F25 program might see the US getting about half of the planned 2443 F-35s.

The US would want to try to create light-weight fighter that was a partially stealthy generation 4.5 fighter. The new fighters would likely not be cheaper than the F-35 or the latest F15. The goal would be to have lower operating costs and a reliable workhorse fighter. The US has not been able to deliver a reliable new fighter for the last 35 years.

A full cancellation of the F-35 seems unlikely. The best result could be phasing out procurement of the F35 over four years.


F-35 Program Could Be Cancelled in 2023 | NextBigFuture.com

The expensive and problem-filled F-35 stealth fighter program appears on track to finally getting cut short.
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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Awww you poor froggy relying on false hope to make yourself feel better, eh? Not happening the death nail for Rafail is being hammered but there still may be hope for it in poor nations but that's about it. First world nations that can't afford their own stealth fighter program are going F-35.

France is being surrounded by F-35s and will be fully surrounded in a few years when Germany wakes up and realizes it can't afford its own stealth fighter program even though it's supposedly a multi nation program. They will realized firing the German air force General for wanting the F-35 was a HUGE mistake.
I think the Swiss will vote against the F-35 purchase project. The reasons for the previous rejection were clearly identified. Ueli Maurer was caught red-handed with the leaked Armasuisse report showing that Gripen did not meet the minimum requirements, even though he had said the opposite.

This time it's the same, the reports from the American authorities are full of cost overruns and unrealized technical capabilities and Viola Amherd says "we are the first to be surprised but the F35 is the cheapest and the best technically and no data will be sent to the United States".

Well, in principle, the Swiss people don't like to be taken for a donkey.

I am convinced that any of the other three planes would have passed without any real dispute.

In any case without being challenged in a popular vote.
 

Innominate

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I think the Swiss will vote against the F-35 purchase project. The reasons for the previous rejection were clearly identified. Ueli Maurer was caught red-handed with the leaked Armasuisse report showing that Gripen did not meet the minimum requirements, even though he had said the opposite.

This time it's the same, the reports from the American authorities are full of cost overruns and unrealized technical capabilities and Viola Amherd says "we are the first to be surprised but the F35 is the cheapest and the best technically and no data will be sent to the United States".

Well, in principle, the Swiss people don't like to be taken for a donkey.

I am convinced that any of the other three planes would have passed without any real dispute.

In any case without being challenged in a popular vote.
Wishful hope is all you have but whatever makes your butthurt less painful, right?

It's over and you need to get emotional help before it eats you inside. The Swiss will fly the F-35 while the French will bribe nations and beg them to buy the Rafail just like India. :)

I'm serious when I say you need to get help because when Finland selects the F-35 the last thing I wanna hear is Rafail fanboys jumping off the Eiffel Tower.
 
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zinswinsin

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F-35 weapons in 2025 will be awesome. Sidekick enables another 2 A2A missiles the size of the AIM120.

On the docket for the F-35.

AIM-260 or LREW(same size as AIM-120) - 200 mile range. Can carry up to 6

Peregrine or Cuda- Half the size of the AIM-120 same range.

Should be a fun time.
 
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BMD

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The Swiss government are disappointed by the French. I know just how they feel.


Il faut découpler les aspects économiques du dossier de leur ressenti politique affirme le diplomate. Le F-35 possède une plus longue carrière devant lui que le Rafale. Nos dirigeants ont estimé que la police du ciel devait se faire à moindre coût sans en négliger la qualité opérationnelle. A-t-on instruit le même procès pour des pays comme la Belgique ou la Pologne, membres de l’UE qui ont fait le même choix ? Ce sont de bonnes raisons techniques qui conduisent –et c’est regrettable- au déficit des relations avec l’Union européenne."
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It is necessary to decouple the economic aspects from their political resentments affirms the diplomat. The F-35 has a longer lasting career ahead than the Rafale. Our leaders felt that the sky-policing had to be done at a lower cost without neglecting any operational quality. Have we heard the same lawsuit for countries like Belgium or Poland, members of the EU which have made a similar choice? These are good technical reasons which lead - and this is regrettable - to the deficit in relations with the European Union. "
 
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zinswinsin

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1626664421571.png

1626664388939.png

1626664405225.png
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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Have you heard that the F-35 can't fly near thunderstorms? And of course, since we've been hearing this story for so long, you're thinking that this must be corrected now. Well, it hasn't.

In-flight lightning strike grounds 2 F-35B Lightning II jets


On July 13, two F-35B lightning II jets based out of Marine Corps Air Station Iwakuni, Japan, were severely damaged after being struck by lightning in flight.

Both planes were able to land safely and no Marines were injured in the incident, according to the Marine Corps.

But the lightning-on-lightning violence caused enough damage to both aircraft to classify each incident as a Class A mishap. Class A mishaps are defined as incidents that result in either death or permanent disability, or more than $2.5 million in damages.

“After conducting our standard reporting and assessment procedures, the weather-related incident was labeled as a class ‘A’ mishap due to the combined projected repair costs exceeding two and a half million U.S. dollars,” Capt. Marco A. Valenzuela, a spokesman for Marine Air Group 12. told Marine Corps Times in an email.

“The safe operation of our aircraft and the readiness of our squadrons are vitally important to us in order to continue supporting our allies, partners, and joint forces in the region,” Valenzuela added.

The F-35A traditional takeoff variant of the lightning II repeatedly has been prohibited from flying in or near thunderstorms due to issues with its onboard inert gas generation system, or OBIGGS.

The OBIGGS pumps nitrogen-enriched air into the plane’s fuel systems, rendering it inert and preventing it from blowing up if struck by lightning.

Damages to the tubes that deliver the nitrogen-enriched air led to lightning flight restrictions in June 2020.

The vertical takeoff variant F-35B has a slightly differently designed OBIGGS system, which fits around its lift fan and historically has made it immune to the lightning issues of its F-35A cousin.

“We are currently conducting an investigation into the mishap and will incorporate the lessons learned into future flight operations,” :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: Valenzuela added.
 
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Innominate

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Have you heard that the F-35 can't fly near thunderstorms? And of course, since we've been hearing this story for so long, you're thinking that this must be corrected now. Well, it hasn't.

In-flight lightning strike grounds 2 F-35B Lightning II jets


On July 13, two F-35B lightning II jets based out of Marine Corps Air Station Iwakuni, Japan, were severely damaged after being struck by lightning in flight.

Both planes were able to land safely and no Marines were injured in the incident, according to the Marine Corps.

But the lightning-on-lightning violence caused enough damage to both aircraft to classify each incident as a Class A mishap. Class A mishaps are defined as incidents that result in either death or permanent disability, or more than $2.5 million in damages.

“After conducting our standard reporting and assessment procedures, the weather-related incident was labeled as a class ‘A’ mishap due to the combined projected repair costs exceeding two and a half million U.S. dollars,” Capt. Marco A. Valenzuela, a spokesman for Marine Air Group 12. told Marine Corps Times in an email.

“The safe operation of our aircraft and the readiness of our squadrons are vitally important to us in order to continue supporting our allies, partners, and joint forces in the region,” Valenzuela added.

The F-35A traditional takeoff variant of the lightning II repeatedly has been prohibited from flying in or near thunderstorms due to issues with its onboard inert gas generation system, or OBIGGS.

The OBIGGS pumps nitrogen-enriched air into the plane’s fuel systems, rendering it inert and preventing it from blowing up if struck by lightning.

Damages to the tubes that deliver the nitrogen-enriched air led to lightning flight restrictions in June 2020.

The vertical takeoff variant F-35B has a slightly differently designed OBIGGS system, which fits around its lift fan and historically has made it immune to the lightning issues of its F-35A cousin.

“We are currently conducting an investigation into the mishap and will incorporate the lessons learned into future flight operations,” :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: Valenzuela added.
But they did fly in thunderstorms how do you think they got struck? Not that smart are you?

This happens a lot but because it happened to the F-35 it got you to wank to it because it's always beating the Rafale in sales.
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A lightning strike causes the loss of an Italian F-16. Are lightnings a risk for aviation safety?​


A politician with Boeing ties... Yeah the Swiss should listen to him. Maybe if Dassault bribed the Swiss officials like they did with India the Swiss would have selected the Rafail.


The only way Rafail gets selected. :ROFLMAO:
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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But they did fly in thunderstorms how do you think they got struck? Not that smart are you?

This happens a lot but because it happened to the F-35 it got you to wank to it because it's always beating the Rafale in sales.
The F-18 is performing well, but this seems to be a problem for Lockheed Martin. :giggle:
 

Innominate

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The F-18 is performing well, but this seems to be a problem for Lockheed Martin. :giggle:
Have you even read how many F-18s have been damaged due to lightning? This is the first time F-35s have been damaged by lightning and it won't be the last since you have hundreds of them flying now. F-35's are still going to be flying just like F-16s that have been damaged due to lightning strikes you're just trying to grasp at anything that makes the F-35 look bad because the reality is the Rafail is a failure every time it takes on the F-35. Finland is about to say no to Rafail and select the F-35 it just brings me so much joy knowing that it is going to bring a lot of butt hurt to you and your fellow Rafail fanboys. All you and your fellow fanboys have left is wishful thinking that somehow nations will change their minds here in the real world we call that living in denial. Enjoy. ;)
 

Picdelamirand-oil

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Have you even read how many F-18s have been damaged due to lightning? This is the first time F-35s have been damaged by lightning and it won't be the last since you have hundreds of them flying now. F-35's are still going to be flying just like F-16s that have been damaged due to lightning strikes you're just trying to grasp at anything that makes the F-35 look bad because the reality is the Rafail is a failure every time it takes on the F-35. Finland is about to say no to Rafail and select the F-35 it just brings me so much joy knowing that it is going to bring a lot of butt hurt to you and your fellow Rafail fanboys. All you and your fellow fanboys have left is wishful thinking that somehow nations will change their minds here in the real world we call that living in denial. Enjoy. ;)
That planes are struck by lightning is not new. What is new is the extent (cost) of the damage. When lightning strikes an aircraft, it makes two holes. One where it enters, and another where it leaves. It is a known risk and in principle controlled (limited damage, tests to support it), if we rule out the hypothesis of several lightning strikes during the same flight (getting caught once is already rare, so several times is necessary to do it on purpose...), then comes the hypothesis of a lack of control of the consequences (partial destruction of elements in composite materials, harmful side effects of the stealth coating, particular sensitivity of an expensive system, etc). The "class A mishap" appeals to me.