Indian Army Artillery Systems : News and Updates

Hydra

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This is a fight between OFB and the private industry. And the victim in between is the IA. Lucky for them, both products are good.

I do support the induction of ATHOS, but I don't support its local production. ATHOS is currently among the most advanced guns in the world, and more importantly it has been developed by an established player. Otoh, ATAGS is going to be manufactured and maintained by first timers. Artillery requirements are so stringent that if the OEM fails to support it, the gun has no future. So the IA needs a balance between an established player and a bunch of first timers to keep the first timers in line. Which means, the maintenance and servicing benchmarks created by Elbit will be the ones for BF and Tata to beat. They will find it very hard to wriggle out of committments when there's an established player around to fulfill those committments. Plus, the IA gets access to a new supplier and a parallel line which allows for the parallel inductions of both ATAGS and ATHOS, and the IA needs all the help needed to shore up its artillery strength. The obvious difference in cost between the two is also important.

Apart from Dhanush and 150 ATAGS, the main requirement for towed guns is 1580. Out of which 1180 are expected to be produced in India. So 400 of those can be ATHOS while the remaining can be ATAGS. This way the IA gets supplies from an established player, multiple Indian players and also find a decent balance between cost and capability since the established player has the cheapest gun of the three, even cheaper than the Dhanush. During wartime, the Israeli support in terms of ammo and parts supplies and manpower for maintenance will be of immense help, which won't be available without the ATHOS. This will allow the IA to keep a lower amount of active stocks and save money.

One of the main operational and logistics advantages with buying Israeli guns, along with another 300+ M777s, is we will be able to dip our fingers into American and Israeli WWRs located in Israel. It's the fastest and cheapest way for us to replenish our stocks during wartime and 400 guns is enough of an investment to get access to those stocks. The fact that ATAGS can fire twice as many shells as its competitor in a minute won't matter during a war if the IA runs out of ammo. The reality today is we lack ammo, the bane of a third world economy.

We do not need to produce ATHOS for all the reasons you quoted.




They can make the Dhanush. The IA is still interested in a few hundred more guns. And OFB is working on the 52 cal version now. Plus there are other artillery requirements around like the MGS.
Instead of towed one, Israelis should offer truck mounted variant, or else there is no chance we going for an imported howitzer.
 

randomradio

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Ok, thats new info to me. I was in an impression that only French were responded to that tender process.

There's a program for 814 truck-mounted guns called MGS. OFB is offering a Dhanush variant. Our private sector is also involved in this with their own plans.
 
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Milspec

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They are offering the ATMOS. It's a different tender.
Have a feeling that once we get to the mounting system, for sure Kalyani and Tata Power SED's team will field a Bharat52/ATAGS mounted system essentially a Desi-G5-2000, as you said there will be a DRDO-OFB Dhanush (i.e FH77 ) based MGS, i.e Desi Archer; Not a bad problem to have in my opinion.
Have often wondered is there a place for a Mini Mounted Gun System based on either a 105mm or a 130mm system. As in the Rocket Arty we have the small MLRS like BM21 grad, medium like the Pinaka 212mm /TOS1 in 220mm and Smerch in 300mm
 
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Hydra

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Have a feeling that once we get to the mounting system, for sure Kalyani and Tata Power SED's team will field a Bharat52/ATAGS mounted system essentially a Desi-G5-2000, as you said there will be a DRDO-OFB Dhanush (i.e FH77 ) based MGS, i.e Desi Archer; No have a bad problem to have in my opinion.
Have often wondered is there a place for a Mini Mounted Gun System based on either a 105mm or a 130mm system. As in the Rocket Arty we have the small MLRS like the Grad
First of all Archer is an unparalleled howitzer system in the world, sorry we are technically incapable to make anything similar to archer.
Secondly archer is a heavyweight, i dont think IA will ever choose any thing that much heavy as a howitzer.
So we may try to develop nexter or atmos type howitzer not an archer variant.
 

Hydra

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And there is a 105 mm ulh howitzer is available with kalyani, mounted on hlHummer. Saudi Arabia has already placed order for few if i am not wrong. It is far better suited weapon of choice than any light tank in mountainous region like ladakh to handle Chinese, good for indirect and direct firing with superior mobility than any variant of tank. Dont know what logic is driving IA to go for a light tank in mountainous region, without even considering this gun.
Have a feeling that once we get to the mounting system, for sure Kalyani and Tata Power SED's team will field a Bharat52/ATAGS mounted system essentially a Desi-G5-2000, as you said there will be a DRDO-OFB Dhanush (i.e FH77 ) based MGS, i.e Desi Archer; No have a bad problem to have in my opinion.
Have often wondered is there a place for a Mini Mounted Gun System based on either a 105mm or a 130mm system. As in the Rocket Arty we have the small MLRS like BM21 grad, medium like the Pinaka 212mm /TOS1 in 220mm and Smerch in 300mm
 

randomradio

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Have a feeling that once we get to the mounting system, for sure Kalyani and Tata Power SED's team will field a Bharat52/ATAGS mounted system essentially a Desi-G5-2000, as you said there will be a DRDO-OFB Dhanush (i.e FH77 ) based MGS, i.e Desi Archer; No have a bad problem to have in my opinion.

Yep. There are enough indigenous solutions, especially by the time the program starts.

Have often wondered is there a place for a Mini Mounted Gun System based on either a 105mm or a 130mm system. As in the Rocket Arty we have the small MLRS like BM21 grad, medium like the Pinaka 212mm /TOS1 in 220mm and Smerch in 300mm

IA seems to have settled for 155mm though. And BF has already made a 39 cal version based on the ULH.


BF has also made an MGS based on the Humvee and a 105mm gun. It's called Garuda-105.
 

Hydra

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Yep. There are enough indigenous solutions, especially by the time the program starts.



IA seems to have settled for 155mm though. And BF has already made a 39 cal version based on the ULH.


BF has also made an MGS based on the Humvee and a 105mm gun. It's called Garuda-105.
There was a report on Kalyani 39 cal mgs that, IA isn't interested on 155/39 cal mgs & they want 155/52 cal mgs.
 

Hydra

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randomradio

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The article's incomplete. What it means is winter trials are completed. In about 6 months' time we will see summer trials.

Hopefully, upon success of the summer trials, we will see an order for 100-150 placed before March 2022. This will allow large scale orders to be placed before 2024. The yearly production capability of the two companies is gigantic. I believe BF has the capacity to produce 250 a year, Tata could be similar as well. So the time it will take to induct the entire strength will be entirely dependent on how much the govt is willing to pay every year.
 
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