British/Italian Tempest Fighter : News and Discussion

_Anonymous_

Senior Member
Dec 4, 2017
17,345
13,279
Mumbai

JASDF's next fighter will be developed as a common aircraft with the UK.
2022/08/14 05:00
The Japanese and British governments made final adjustments in the direction of unifying the development plans of the two sides and jointly developing a common aircraft for the JASDF and the RAF's next fighter. In addition to nearly matching the performance required for the next fighter, it was determined that development costs could be reduced.

This was announced by several government officials. The costs related to development will be included in the defence budget request for fiscal 2023, and the overall picture of the development will be determined within this year.

Britain planned to deploy the Tempest, the successor to its main fighter, the Eurofighter Typhoon, in combat by 2035 and develop it jointly with Italy and Sweden.

In subsequent discussions between the Japanese and British governments, it was agreed that it would be appropriate to standardize the aircraft because the required performance was almost the same and the development period overlapped. It is also expected to reduce development costs, which are said to significantly exceed 1 trillion yen, and improve production efficiency.

Italy is also participating in the joint development. Lockheed Martin's involvement is expected to be limited to ensuring interoperability with U.S. military aircraft.
So UK has finally succeeded in it's hat in hand mission . Frankly after taking in Italy & Sweden as joint partners I wonder why did they see the need for another partner in the project ?

I recall innumerable visits by senior administration officials from the UK requesting Indian participation in the project since years .

Which brings me to an important point - with Japan on board what exactly is the distribution of work share & more importantly the contribution to the budget going to be like ?

What would Italy's & Sweden's contribution to the program be ? Or are they expected to hold on to their you know what now that UK has got a developmental partner & financier of much better standing than these two ?

Which brings me to Dassault & their feuding with Airbus on the FCAS . If Dassault is thru with ze Germans , there are 2 potential partners waiting in the wings for a tie up .

Interesting possibilities emerging in the European landscape of aviation development w.r.t the 6th Gen FA programs , isn't it sweetie ?

I'm eagerly awaiting another video by your favourite content creator Dago on this development & the comparisons / side swipes he's expected to take on the NGAD program . @Innominate
 

Bon Plan

Senior member
Dec 1, 2017
2,457
1,119
France

JASDF's next fighter will be developed as a common aircraft with the UK.
2022/08/14 05:00
The Japanese and British governments made final adjustments in the direction of unifying the development plans of the two sides and jointly developing a common aircraft for the JASDF and the RAF's next fighter. In addition to nearly matching the performance required for the next fighter, it was determined that development costs could be reduced.

This was announced by several government officials. The costs related to development will be included in the defence budget request for fiscal 2023, and the overall picture of the development will be determined within this year.

Britain planned to deploy the Tempest, the successor to its main fighter, the Eurofighter Typhoon, in combat by 2035 and develop it jointly with Italy and Sweden.

In subsequent discussions between the Japanese and British governments, it was agreed that it would be appropriate to standardize the aircraft because the required performance was almost the same and the development period overlapped. It is also expected to reduce development costs, which are said to significantly exceed 1 trillion yen, and improve production efficiency.

Italy is also participating in the joint development. Lockheed Martin's involvement is expected to be limited to ensuring interoperability with U.S. military aircraft.
nor Japan nor GB are easy partner.
So far nothing inked. The story is not at a end for 6th gen fighter in Europe.
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
15,576
11,326
India
Then, why IAF didn't accept it?

The Russians were not willing to give all the documentations that we wanted. We wanted to flight test the jet before signing the contract, which the Russians denied. The development timeframe was also not realistic. IAF wanted to wait only 6 years for their model, the Russians said 8, which I feel is only an excuse because there's no way it will happen on time anyway. Some technologies were also immature, like the engine, which piled on to the list.

So we put the contract on the backburner. We told the Russians we will take a look again after the jet is operational. Of course, the development delays and American pressure may kill the deal, but it suffices to say the Indian program is not dead. We may opt for stop gap purchase (63 jets), license production (127 jets) or development of our own model, or of course, kill it. We will know more in a few years.

Personally, I'm a fan of buying 40 jets, like we did with the Rafale.
 

RASALGHUL

Member
Aug 13, 2022
362
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India
The Russians were not willing to give all the documentations that we wanted. We wanted to flight test the jet before signing the contract, which the Russians denied. The development timeframe was also not realistic. IAF wanted to wait only 6 years for their model, the Russians said 8, which I feel is only an excuse because there's no way it will happen on time anyway. Some technologies were also immature, like the engine, which piled on to the list.

So we put the contract on the backburner. We told the Russians we will take a look again after the jet is operational. Of course, the development delays and American pressure may kill the deal, but it suffices to say the Indian program is not dead. We may opt for stop gap purchase (63 jets), license production (127 jets) or development of our own model, or of course, kill it. We will know more in a few years.

Personally, I'm a fan of buying 40 jets, like we did with the Rafale.
Thanks, for info.
Sanctioned Up/Economically isolated Russia will definitely try to sweeten the deal. I hope we stand up to US&EU pressure.
What your Opinion on ADA AMCA MK1 & MK2?
Do you think ADA have what it's take to Deliver 5th & 6th gen fighter jets? Just wanted to know your assessment.
Thanks in advance.
 

Rajput Lion

Member
Sep 23, 2022
226
96
India
The Russians were not willing to give all the documentations that we wanted. We wanted to flight test the jet before signing the contract, which the Russians denied. The development timeframe was also not realistic. IAF wanted to wait only 6 years for their model, the Russians said 8, which I feel is only an excuse because there's no way it will happen on time anyway. Some technologies were also immature, like the engine, which piled on to the list.

So we put the contract on the backburner. We told the Russians we will take a look again after the jet is operational. Of course, the development delays and American pressure may kill the deal, but it suffices to say the Indian program is not dead. We may opt for stop gap purchase (63 jets), license production (127 jets) or development of our own model, or of course, kill it. We will know more in a few years.

Personally, I'm a fan of buying 40 jets, like we did with the Rafale.
Read somewhere that Russians are also soon going to unveil twin-seat model(SU60!!) as the control mothership of Okhotnik S-70. IAF may be interested in it if they offer full TOT of Type 30 engine😃
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
15,576
11,326
India
Thanks, for info.
Sanctioned Up/Economically isolated Russia will definitely try to sweeten the deal. I hope we stand up to US&EU pressure.
What your Opinion on ADA AMCA MK1 & MK2?
Do you think ADA have what it's take to Deliver 5th & 6th gen fighter jets? Just wanted to know your assessment.
Thanks in advance.

Yeah, their isolation is a blessing for us. I actually want us to buy as much high end tech from them as possible, especially materials tech.

ADA has the ability, but the timeframes they advocate are unrealistic. AMCA Mk1 is not enough to challenge the Chinese, and I'm expecting AMCA Mk2 only around 2040. Hence my support for some Su-57s.
 
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randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
15,576
11,326
India
Read somewhere that Russians are also soon going to unveil twin-seat model(SU60!!) as the control mothership of Okhotnik S-70. IAF may be interested in it if they offer full TOT of Type 30 engine😃

We don't need ToT for this tech. We only need the capability the jet it's connected to brings to the table. Unless the IAF thinks MRFA Rafales are enough.
 

Hydra

Banned
May 19, 2020
3,300
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SU57M is absolutely required, there's absolutely no two ways about it.
You must be a fals flagger. Or else no patriot or atleast an indian with bare minimum common sense will force india to purchase this sh*t from Russia.
Su47 isn't a stealth aircraft, its EW isn't on par with a gen 4+ fighter, No AESA, its having underpowered engine.
 
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Rajput Lion

Member
Sep 23, 2022
226
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India
You must be a fals flagger. Or else no patriot or atleast an indian with bare minimum common sense will force india to purchase this sh*t from Russia.
Su47 isn't a stealth aircraft, its EW isn't on par with a gen 4+ fighter, No AESA, its having underpowered engine.
Even Americans are worried about future iterations of SU57 and J20. When fully mature, SU57M is going to be hell of a plane. India needs this plane in large number to continue our air dominance which begun in 2002 with the arrival of MKI.
 

Hydra

Banned
May 19, 2020
3,300
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Mumbai
Even Americans are worried about future iterations of SU57 and J20.
US was/is worried about s400 too. If some one is Worrying about something, that doesn't means that it is top end or deadly. I am worried about cockroaches lurking in bathroom, that doesnt means that its an apex predator.
When fully mature, SU57M is going to be hell of a plane. India needs this plane in large number to continue our air dominance which begun in 2002 with the arrival of MKI.
Have you time traveled to future & came back?
 
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Rajput Lion

Member
Sep 23, 2022
226
96
India
US was/is worried about s400 too. If some one is Worrying about something, that doesn't means that it is top end or deadly. I am worried about cockroaches lurking in bathroom, that doesnt means that its an apex predator.

Have you time traveled to future & came back?
Just wait and watch.