Are we in state of undeclared war?

nair

nair
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Nov 30, 2017
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Look like another step up on the escalation ladder...... 120mm is been used by pakistanis...... (saw the reports and pics do not know the authenticity of it yet)

Pakistan is smart in ensuring they are holding India with them in every now and then..... They ensure that we are busy tackling them by ensuring issues now and then...... Their existence as a nation depends on India and Kashmir, and when ever we ignored them or put everything on back burner and moved along with our life, they ensured that we turn back and return to them by doing some thing or other.....

Imagine of they also ignore India and move on with their own things, what happens???? Since their existence and their militiary's significance depends on India and its rivalary with them..... They cant do it...

Ever thought what do they get by irking or creating trouble in India???? that too for more than 60 years??? They cannot accept or agree India moving to a different league.......

Why Pakistanis dont care of about escalation?????

Well they very well knows that we cannot go for a full blown war, and localised war can be a stale mate, because there are several place along LOC, which they have an huge advantage, and they can also create huge damage...... Not only that an escalation will bring international attention, and there is no way Pakistan has a disadvantage..... because 1) They have nothing to loose, their economy is already in a bad shape 2) They do not have reputation to loose..... But the cost for India on both these points are high and they very well knows this..... Now with china strongly on it pocket, and at times support Pakistanis to keep things hot on their behalf, now add Russia who has been our bestest buddy for decades, moving away on opposite direction........ USA who is pulling India (vice versa) to itself..... there is hardly anything which we gain from this.... Our strategy was make terror costlier in all aspects to Pakistan.... But the way things are they do not care about the cost, and they are ready to loose what ever for the gain of sustained hostilities with India......

Pakistan does not have a strong govt after outster of Nawas, and (most of us wont even remember the name of the new PM) PA becoming stronger and stronger, they will call the shots for a very long time and this hostilities are going to continue.....

India : Is having a strong leader and a strong govt, whose popularity is depleting every passing day, will also find it difficult, with the current hostilities, especially confused with his foreign policies , It's sincere efforts to find peace with pakistan was replied with terror attacks, and they are also getting to know the difficulty in handling a neighbor who has nothing to loose......

"Written hastely" so mistakes has to be ignored.....
 
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Paro

Bloom17
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whose popularity is depleting every passing day, will also find it difficult, with the current hostilities, especially confused with his foreign policies
That is what matters now. In my experience he likes to be in the lime light all the time. And I can only guess what he is planning.
 
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nair

nair
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That is what matters now. In my experience he likes to be in the lime light all the time. And I can only guess what he is planning.
Lets not get down that line, because we all know where the discussion will head ...... Mine was a passing reference, and I feel that point also can play a part, especially with the kind of "E" Population we have..... Let us get back to the main topic...
 
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Aravind

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Dec 5, 2017
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You haven't comprehended my statement "Unless a capacity and circumstances/environment is built up" - India has to do this.
Well, what was stopping the circumstances/environment were the peace pigeons, urban naxals,libtards who Enjoy kababs ,shayaris and the mujras . Until these people are not exterminated the status quo will continue, You cannot start a campaign when you have enemies in your own house.
 

Shashank

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Dec 4, 2017
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Any country including superpowers as well are constantly in sate of war. We have always been in state of war since Formation of modern India post independence . It was china, east and west pakistan to start with and West pakistan and china for now and who knows Bangladesh, srilanka and Myanmar in future.
External enemies will keep on changing but internal enemies which is slowly destroying country from within on basis if region, religion, ideoloy and caste needs to be tackled on priority.
If we want to win war outside we have to start winning it from inside first. Unfortunately deeply trenched tunnel diggers are not that easy to rout and will take lots of time and sincere effort to get rid of them.
 

randomradio

Senior Member
Nov 30, 2017
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We are in a sort of 'permanent state of war' with Pakistan. It means we will exercise our military dominance over Pakistan.

That's why all the action at the LoC. And this may not necessarily have a timeframe. It may go on indefinitely.

The more aggressive India is, the smaller are the chances of actually going to war.
 

safriz

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Jan 1, 2018
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I think we give politicians more than due credit for all of our fallacies. When did Nawaz got the authority on army and ISI even if we consider Modi hold the supreme authority?

If you are not suggesting that Nawaz simply dials in Modi, ask him to heat up the LOC and Modi oblige unconditionally. Thats a too much of a ask from a mere friend. Where is the quid pro quo?
NS has 4 Billion USD an year worth of business with Modi's close friends such as Jindal. Also he makes sure India gets diplomatic victory over Pakistan in every matter without even trying. For example the cases India won against Pakistan in International courts are all engineered losses. The teams Pakistan had been sending were of Incompetent people who did not know what they were doing . Those victories are facilitated by NS regime for political benefit of Modi.
So although NS has no control on Pakistan army, he does have control on Indian army via Modi.
Just connect the dots. LOC flares up or a major terrorism even happens just hen NS is in trouble.
For example the Peshawar school attack in which over 140 lost their lives, most of them kids. happened when Imran Khan and Tahir Ul Qadri Sit in in front of Parliament was gaining momentum and NS saw his government going . Then APS attack happened and the sit in had to end, averting a major political crisis for NS government.
TTP the organization who carried out the attack has Indian support vis Indian consulates in Afghanistan.
 

vstol Jockey

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Dec 1, 2017
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have you guys heard of a term in military called "attrition"? during Kargil war, PAF nearly ran out of spares to operate F-16s for an extended period. The present state of affairs allow us to escalate as per our needs including using air power to drain out PAF and PA. The future battles will be decided within a time span of just 72hrs between nuke armed rivals. This means a high tempo air warfare with over 3k-4k sorties everyday. Many aircraft will go out of action for want of spares only. What GOI is doing is that it is keeping all options open and can gear up or down the way they want. As on date India is controlling the game and will continue to do so till a final war breaks out. we have to bleed our enemy to the point where his moral is low, spares scarce, and ability to fight battle is nearly zero. Financial war is one such thing. reducing petro reserves of enemy to few days and than taking them out in first few hours of war, is the best way to win a war. Germany lost the day they lost oil reserves in former Soviet Union Territories in WW-2.
 

STEPHEN COHEN

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Dec 4, 2017
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We are in a sort of 'permanent state of war' with Pakistan. It means we will exercise our military dominance over Pakistan.

That's why all the action at the LoC. And this may not necessarily have a timeframe. It may go on indefinitely.

The more aggressive India is, the smaller are the chances of actually going to war.
Also @nair

In case you have Noticed ; there has been No firing on the LOC for last three days

That is because we have very recently kicked them hard

So this is the only language they understand

You kick them ; they will behave for a WHILE

There was an article written by Lt General H S Panag

It was about the small and localised attack by his team in Batalik sector

The interesting point that I noticed was where he wrote that
for Six months after Kargil the Pakistanis were Quiet

And then they again started their Mischief

How we pushed Pak out of the Batalik Sector

So this is the only way to deal with them
 

STEPHEN COHEN

Senior member
Dec 4, 2017
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have you guys heard of a term in military called "attrition"? during Kargil war, PAF nearly ran out of spares to operate F-16s for an extended period. The present state of affairs allow us to escalate as per our needs including using air power to drain out PAF and PA. The future battles will be decided within a time span of just 72hrs between nuke armed rivals. This means a high tempo air warfare with over 3k-4k sorties everyday. Many aircraft will go out of action for want of spares only. What GOI is doing is that it is keeping all options open and can gear up or down the way they want. As on date India is controlling the game and will continue to do so till a final war breaks out. we have to bleed our enemy to the point where his moral is low, spares scarce, and ability to fight battle is nearly zero. Financial war is one such thing. reducing petro reserves of enemy to few days and than taking them out in first few hours of war, is the best way to win a war. Germany lost the day they lost oil reserves in former Soviet Union Territories in WW-2.
The LOC firing is taking a toll out of their Ammunition stocks also

Also the declining forex reserves will mean that within Six months there wont be enough fuel to Move a Division ; all these are a part of inflicting costs on them

Pakistan is getting boxed in a Straight jacket
 

Paro

Bloom17
Dec 2, 2017
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TTP the organization who carried out the attack has Indian support vis Indian consulates in Afghanistan.
If the TTP reads your comment they would commit suicide before blowing themselves up.
Ok let's try your logic. A Muslim hired by kafir to kill Muslims. You just did Mother sister to their terrorism policy.
 
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STEPHEN COHEN

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Dec 4, 2017
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I do expect a few air strikes deep inside pakistan to force PAF to mount CAP on regular basis in very short term period. IAF may do sweeps and strikes in Pakistan starting April this year or it may have already happened.
If GOD grants me a Just two wishes I will ask :ROFLMAO:

1 To see F16 s being SHOT down by SU 30s

2 Indian Tanks blowing up ALL Pakistani Tanks
 

_Anonymous_

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Dec 4, 2017
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I do expect a few air strikes deep inside pakistan to force PAF to mount CAP on regular basis in very short term period. IAF may do sweeps and strikes in Pakistan starting April this year or it may have already happened.
Already happened ?? Where and how ? Can you elaborate ?
 
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_Anonymous_

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For example the Peshawar school attack in which over 140 lost their lives, most of them kids. happened when Imran Khan and Tahir Ul Qadri Sit in in front of Parliament was gaining momentum and NS saw his government going . Then APS attack happened and the sit in had to end, averting a major political crisis for NS government.
TTP the organization who carried out the attack has Indian support vis Indian consulates in Afghanistan.
What about the NDS ? After all they love the Pakistanis more than we do ? How can you be sure the TTP didn't act independently ? Any references for your outrageous claim ? Or are we hearing talk in the corridors of GHQ - Pindi?
 
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RATHORE

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Dec 2, 2017
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What about the NDS ? After all they love the Pakistanis more than we do ? How can you be sure the TTP didn't act independently ? Any references for your outrageous claim ? Or are we hearing talk in the corridors of GHQ - Pindi?
The Pakistani mind is a sick one. They kill, and gloat over killing, ~160 civilians in Mumbai; then play the victims quoting figures of Pakistani citizens lost to their own terror groups and pretending that we killed the kids in APS Peshawar. When in reality it was just a slow boiling consequence of decades of Islamization of Pakistani society and support for terrorist groups all across South Asia.
 

safriz

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Jan 1, 2018
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UK, Pakistan
have you guys heard of a term in military called "attrition"? during Kargil war, PAF nearly ran out of spares to operate F-16s for an extended period. The present state of affairs allow us to escalate as per our needs including using air power to drain out PAF and PA. The future battles will be decided within a time span of just 72hrs between nuke armed rivals. This means a high tempo air warfare with over 3k-4k sorties everyday. Many aircraft will go out of action for want of spares only. What GOI is doing is that it is keeping all options open and can gear up or down the way they want. As on date India is controlling the game and will continue to do so till a final war breaks out. we have to bleed our enemy to the point where his moral is low, spares scarce, and ability to fight battle is nearly zero. Financial war is one such thing. reducing petro reserves of enemy to few days and than taking them out in first few hours of war, is the best way to win a war. Germany lost the day they lost oil reserves in former Soviet Union Territories in WW-2.
That's wrong.
PAF always maintains operational capability intact. PAF was not allowed by India's sock puppet Nawaz Sharif to go into war during Kargil.
The whole of Pakistan armed forces were strangled and stopped from launching a full blown war on Kargil. Credit to India's lap poodle Nawaz.
It had nothing to do with spares.
Our military was at war but civilian government under Nawaz Sharif refused to recognise the Kargil crisis as a war.
Exactly same thing happened in 1971 when army was at war but Zulfiqar Bhutto gave a damn.
 
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Kshithij Sharma

Well-Known member
Dec 4, 2017
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We lose about 200 soldiers every year out of a total 20lakh soldiers (Army+BSF+CRPF). This amounts to 0.01% of the soldiers. Even if we include other related casualty in jihad, bangladesh, Naxal etc, the numbers are still low - 0.1% of total.

One must be calm and attack at the opportune time to achieve meaningful objective. If the objective is winning elections, then so be it. If the objective is permanent peace, so be it.

India's problem was congress and disgustingly indifferent people who let arbitrary people rule over them, voted for no proper reason and were highly short sighted.

In full scale war, the so called well off people who are unwilling to fight will be slaughtered for being parasitic and wasting resources like food. So, that issue is also sorted out.
 

Paro

Bloom17
Dec 2, 2017
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That's wrong.
PAF always maintains operational capability intact. PAF was not allowed by India's sock puppet Nawaz Sharif to go into war during Kargil.
The whole of Pakistan armed forces were strangled and stopped from launching a full blown war on Kargil. Credit to India's lap poodle Nawaz.
It had nothing to do with spares.
Our military was at war but civilian government under Nawaz Sharif refused to recognise the Kargil crisis as a war.
Exactly same thing happened in 1971 when army was at war but Zulfiqar Bhutto gave a damn.
Aeronaut: Kargil Conflict and Pakistan Air Force