Pahalgam terror attack: 26 killed

[arsalan3345]

If you are talking about military modernization, there's a point beyond which Pakistan will no longer be competitive without creating its own industry. The Chinese are always going to keep you a level or two below themselves. Good luck trying to catch up.

But the Pakistani economy is the real Gordion knot. And the existence of PA ensures the Pakistanis will have to untie that knot with both hands tied behind their backs. You have been surviving because of bailout programs. Those sources are drying up.

Some sections of the GCC want to firmly enter India's camp. With the West going apesh!t over climate change and renewables, China too, they need India for continued survival. You must have seen the sort of "support" they provided Gazans recently, their interest in religious conflicts is waning. Plus most Iranians and Arabs have given up on Islam (50% Arabs and 70% Iranians). Guess it has a lot to do with people actually understanding the words rather than reading a language they don't understand, like in Pakistan. So even Iran is being primed for a revolution.

That leaves China and America.

China is going to be suppressed. They have made too many enemies, and they have tried to fix things (India and Russia especially) but no one believes them. The issue for Pakistan is unlike a decade ago when a few billion every few years was enough to buy time, now the requirement is in pretty high double digits every year. The Chinese cannot dump $10-20B into Pakistan just to keep it afloat with Trump and the Republicans around trying to suppress them. Plus the suppression of China has become a bipartisan effort, so there's no getting around it. And at the same time, Russia and India are modernizing at a rapid rate further compounding their security problems. Add to that their population woes coming up before getting rich, tying their hands more than anything else. In such a situation, they are gonna have to go slower at pissing off India while also hurting themselves by financially supporting Pakistan.

America has the ability to keep Pakistan afloat, but you are gonna have to give up on nukes in some way or the other. You will have to cut down on your military expenditure too. So it's not gonna come free like it has been. And this arrangement could be temporary before they leave the IOR region to India once Iran is dealt with. F-16s are passe.

These are the problems you face even without Indian economic interference. If India's current posture lasts long enough, then...

I agree with only few points specially related to Pakistani economy. Chinese can't invest every year but they will continue to help Pakistan technologically. Russia and Pakistan are the only friends of China in this region. I don't want to speak about CPEC but the importance of Pakistani ports are vital for chinese naval presence in this region. Their think tanks are ready to invest more money because they are thinking about the long term game. United states is a threat for China. United states doesn't want Chinese in Pakistan and they always try to balance, giving more weapons to india but secretly helping Pakistan as well. Nobody knows what happens after 10 years but i am sure that Pak armed forces will match strength of Indian armed forces even after 10 years. Reason is geographical and strategic importance of Pakistan.

 

[randomradio]

The meeting between PM, NSA and Navy chief is very significant. Expect announcement of Naval Blockade of Pakistan followed by complete destruction of Pak Navy, Karachi and Pasni port in Gwader. This will kill CPEC. IN might even load up Amphi brigade of 54th Div to take out Balochistan. This Amphi brigade will sail out and will reach the coast of Gwader after Pak Navy has been sunk. SU-30MKI and MIg-29K will enforce local air superiority in that area while increasing pressure on Pak Eastern Border. This is my assesment. We may throw in both CBGs into battle, one to destroy Pak Navy and second to protect the Amphi forces.

If such an operation is conducted, don't you think we will want to keep Pasni Port alive so we can use it ourselves?

And what about Americans stepping in to take some control or drop in protection forces on Pak's nukes?

Plus if someone's talking about this openly at this point, it could just be psyops to check reaction. I don't wanna rule out this exciting possibility, but there seem to be some roadblocks that need to be addressed by the forces and govt before wiping out PN or invading Pakistan.

 

[randomradio]

In theory yes, but highly unlikely as Indian navy will suffer too many losses from Pakistani ground and air based assets

Depends on the priority Gwadar has in terms of survival of Pakjab. Most Pak forces are concentrated there. And there's 7-8 IAF squadrons available for the task, not just 2 CBGs.

 

[Hydra]

Development of our own MIC has been the biggest achievement of Modi gov. Nothing could be more worse than his predecessor gov. Period.

See that's why we are doing only sounds,not action. Even BD dared to threaten india because of this.

No, it's the cost of modernization. There will be some temporary short-term hiccups for a more powerful end result. In 5 years, we will be capable of multidomain operations like the US and China at a global scale. We will transition from a regional power to a great power. China did that by reducing their ground forces from 3 million to less than 1 million.

Right now, we have failed to modernize adequately quickly enough, prefering to push it to the 2030-45 period. Our 2020-25 goals are still at the level of a regional power, with stopgaps, emergency purchases, infra etc, while working on long term programs in the background (AMCA, FRCV/FICV, artillery etc). An exception is force multipliers like a C4ISR network, satellite constellations, AWACS, ISTAR etc, which will all be functional by 2030. We plan on getting large deals done between 2025-30 for full delivery by 2035-45. That's our aim. Only the navy's working fast, the govt has given them the highest priority.

In the meantime, we had to sacrifice some capabilities, stuff I've already pointed out. And manpower shortages mean we had to weaken parts of our border (Pakistan) to strengthen other parts (China). Until 2035 or so our stopgap plan is to use greater firepower (IRF, FPV drones, air strikes, SAMs) and superior logistics with lesser number of troops than planned against Pakistan and with somewhat adequate number of troops against China.

Mate we didn't even place order for follow on phalcon awacs system,could have been done years ago.

 

[safriz]

So this is from Current Pakistani information minister, and 8 am ashamed to have such people in our government.

"4x Indian Rafale flying near Pakistan border, were electronically jammed so much that they lost their way and crash landed into a wrong airport".

I guess our minister is unaware of INS which cannot be jammed.

 

[vstol Jockey]

Vstol, with so much respect, a naval blockade in this time and age is impossible. it's not practical.

Thats where you are wrong. Blockade is to force PN strike IN. Its a Bait.

 

[randomradio]

Chinese can't invest every year but they will continue to help Pakistan technologically.

Only up to a certain point. We have now reached a point where a military needs full access to software to maintain operational viability. Even during combat, software patches will be necessary just to maintain spectrum survivability.

For example, the Americans introduced cognitive EW in 2021 and full joint C4ISR on a cloud-based SDN in 2024. The Americans are working on quantum encryption, which the Chinese have already operationalized, both being fully available by 2030. India is gonna catch up by then too in all these areas. The Chinese are not gonna give you any of this. And you need a proper industry to develop it all from scratch, and of course, more money than Pakistan's yearly govt expenditure. You will have to launch 100 satellites just to get it all working.

Hardware is only the enabler. Software is the fight.

I've always said that warfare is soon going to be the domain of the rich, every one else is going to get slaughtered. Kinda like how there are only a few super-tech companies around.

So the Americans have already achieved it as of this year, the Chinese will do it in another 2 years, India will take at least 5 years. Pakistan's nowhere in this list.

Russia and Pakistan are the only friends of China in this region.

People make this mistake constantly, but no, Russia is not friends with China. In fact, the Chinese want Russian lands in Siberia.

I don't want to speak about CPEC but the importance of Pakistani ports are vital for chinese naval presence in this region. Their think tanks are ready to invest more money because they are thinking about the long term game.

I doubt the Chinese will get the opportunity to use Pakistan as a naval base. The one you will piss off more than India will be the US.
And of course the Iranians and the GCC. You really think these guys want China anywhere near them?

 

[randomradio]

Mate we didn't even place order for follow on phalcon awacs system,could have been done years ago.

There were no more airframes left. The ones left needed rebuilding. Russia offered the IL-476 later on, but we had moved on to the A330 and indigenous radar by then.

 

[Hydra]

'Will Destroy Any Structure Built To Divert Indus Water': Pakistan's Defense Minister Khawaja Asif Issues Threat To India (VIDEO)

Pakistan Defence Minister Khawaja Asif has threatened India that if it builds any structure to divert Pakistan's share of water under the Indus waters treaty would be destroyed. India had suspended the Indus Waters Treaty, which ensures water for 80% of Pakistani agricultural land.

www.freepressjournal.in

 

[vstol Jockey]

The meeting today between PM, NSA and Navy chief seems what I suggested has been taken as a basic doctrine. IN will shortly announce Naval Blockade of Pakistan which will force Pak Navy to retaliate. IN will sink complete PN and also take out Karachi and Pasni Ports. At the same time, IN will embark the Amphi Brigade of 54Th div positioned in Hyderabad and sail towards Gwader. Intial strike by IN will establish complete control of sea arnd Pakistan and IAF will mount pressure from the Punjab border to ensure PAF is not able to interfere in the amphi ops of IN. I expect both CBGs to come into play for it. One CBG vl fight Pak navy and PAF in western and southern Pakistan while the other vl support he amphi forces. The Balochistan rebels will work with MARCOS to clear a amphi landing safe area around gwader. Mig-29K of IN and Su-30MKI of IAF vl ensure that Paf is not able to interfere as IAF vl mount pressure on Indian Border with Pakistan which will restrict PAF from diverting its assets to defend Gwader. At the sametime, IA will go for POJK. That is an area whr neither PAF can interfere nor can it stop IAF from full spectrum war domination. Pakistan looses depth as it goes north and the S-400 can take down anything which flies upto Afghan border from Ambala itself. Plus we will use S-400 in ambush mode.

Shani the nyay Dev is in Mean rashi with Rahu and in 11th house of Indian Kundali making and Angarak Yoga. This means that IN will play a major role in this war with Pakistan. In Feb-Mar 1987, I had sailed on INS Sindhudurg for war sailing as part of Operation Brasstacks. I used to sleep on the canisters of 57MM gun ammo as we had removed nearly everything from the ship to make space for ammo. Hyderabad based 54th Div of Indian Army is the largest division of Indian Army with five brigades under it. Being positioned in the center of India, Its amphi brigade can be moved rapidly to either coast of India. Once a foot hold is established by MARCOS and BRAS/BLA, The airborne Div of IA will be para dropped followed by heavy equipment like MBTs being landed by IN to supposrt this force. Pakistan has left Sindh undefended and also Balochistan undefended as they have tried to create a killing ground for Indian IBGs and Indian Strike forces in Sindh thru the use of Tactical nukes within their own territory. But once again, they will be f$$ked taken from behind. As they say about dogs, Came from behind, did the job from behind so dont now how the father looked.

If such an operation is conducted, don't you think we will want to keep Pasni Port alive so we can use it ourselves?

Not needed for Amphi ops as they are always done in non port areas.

 

[safriz]

The meeting today between PM, NSA and Navy chief seems what I suggested has been taken as a basic doctrine. IN will shortly announce Naval Blockade of Pakistan which will force Pak Navy to retaliate. IN will sink complete PN and also take out Karachi and Pasni Ports. At the same time, IN will embark the Amphi Brigade of 54Th div positioned in Hyderabad and sail towards Gwader. Intial strike by IN will establish complete control of sea arnd Pakistan and IAF will mount pressure from the Punjab border to ensure PAF is not able to interfere in the amphi ops of IN. I expect both CBGs to come into play for it. One CBG vl fight Pak navy and PAF in western and southern Pakistan while the other vl support he amphi forces. The Balochistan rebels will work with MARCOS to clear a amphi landing safe area around gwader. Mig-29K of IN and Su-30MKI of IAF vl ensure that Paf is not able to interfere as IAF vl mount pressure on Indian Border with Pakistan which will restrict PAF from diverting its assets to defend Gwader. At the sametime, IA will go for POJK. That is an area whr neither PAF can interfere nor can it stop IAF from full spectrum war domination. Pakistan looses depth as it goes north and the S-400 can take down anything which flies upto Afghan border from Ambala itself. Plus we will use S-400 in ambush mode.

Shani the nyay Dev is in Mean rashi with Rahu and in 11th house of Indian Kundali making and Angarak Yoga. This means that IN will play a major role in this war with Pakistan. In Feb-Mar 1987, I had sailed on INS Sindhudurg for war sailing as part of Operation Brasstacks. I used to sleep on the canisters of 57MM gun ammo as we had removed nearly everything from the ship to make space for ammo. Hyderabad based 54th Div of Indian Army is the largest division of Indian Army with five brigades under it. Being positioned in the center of India, Its amphi brigade can be moved rapidly to either coast of India. Once a foot hold is established by MARCOS and BRAS/BLA, The airborne Div of IA will be para dropped followed by heavy equipment like MBTs being landed by IN to supposrt this force. Pakistan has left Sindh undefended and also Balochistan undefended as they have tried to create a killing ground for Indian IBGs and Indian Strike forces in Sindh thru the use of Tactical nukes within their own territory. But once again, they will be f$$ked taken from behind. As they say about dogs, Came from behind, did the job from behind so dont now how the father looked.

Not needed for Amphi ops as they are always done in non port areas.

And then you woke up ?

 

[screambowl]

arabs will not give permission for troops to stay. arabs have sympathy towards Israel. I also have sympathy for Israel because i know Iran. Our balochistan is in mess thanks to Iran.

Astagfirullah!

You only said that Muslims is one community and now you are dividing them in Shia Sunni, Arab and Parsi. That means your resolute in Kashmir is not because of religion. This alone questions the legitimacy of Pakistan and it's concerns about Kashmir and the two nation story ( I mean theory) .

. I don't trust Iran. Yes we don't want Israel to kill Gazans but what can we do!

La haul wala quata, so your nuclear threat and blabber is only for Indians, what a joke of a nation you are.

there is nothing that we can do because of geographical issues. Same with Bangladesh,separated from mainland Pakistan and thousand miles away. that is why bangladesh happened but i don't want to go in detail. Let's talk about Pakistan and India.

Your Army Chief halala Munir was boasting about two nation theory and suddenly you restrict yourself to India and Pakistan minus Bangladesh. If Bangladesh got separated from Pakistan why can't Balochistan get separated from Pakistan? Two nation theory has already failed.

 

[Innominate]

Pakistan's cross-border terrorism has plagued India for years, yet the Pahalgam attack once again highlights India's reactive, ad hoc response. Rather than keeping contingency plans ready to execute swift, surprise retaliation, Modi has convened endless meetings — giving Pakistan ample time to heighten military alertness and prepare countermeasures with newly received Chinese and Turkish weapons, including missiles and drones.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1918562465551438206

After decades of cht flaring up in Kashmir I can't believe IAF had no contingencies to quickly strike back within 24hours? Now all the hype coming from India for over a week has given PAF enough time to prepare putting their fighters on alert status very likely giving PAF the opportunity to intercept incoming IAF aircraft if use for retaliation.

No wonder there's talk about just using missiles.

 

[Lolwa]

Apparently we have procured the agm 114 r9x from the yankees.

Bad news for Pakistan as India to acquire 85 V Sword missile, launchers with night vision capabilities, they are capable of..., Osama bin Laden...

This missile is typically launched via drone.

www.india.com

 

[Innominate]

I am having many conversations on India-Pakistan crisis and hearing that New Delhi in fact doesn’t want to start a broader war because it isn’t well prepared to handle the potential fallout. Rather, India is likely to pursue targeted strikes, to include missile attacks against terrorist facilities, to symbolically demonstrate strength and avoid any major Pakistani retaliation—but this can hardly be guaranteed.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1918457740986568928

I reckon we'll see if India proves the so-called "experts" wrong.

 

[Lolwa]

Pakistan's cross-border terrorism has plagued India for years, yet the Pahalgam attack once again highlights India's reactive, ad hoc response. Rather than keeping contingency plans ready to execute swift, surprise retaliation, Modi has convened endless meetings — giving Pakistan ample time to heighten military alertness and prepare countermeasures with newly received Chinese and Turkish weapons, including missiles and drones.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1918562465551438206

After decades of cht flaring up in Kashmir I can't believe IAF had no contingencies to quickly strike back within 24hours? Now all the hype coming from India for over a week has given PAF enough time to prepare putting their fighters on alert status very likely giving PAF the opportunity to intercept incoming IAF aircraft if use for retaliation.

No wonder there's talk about just using missiles.

Our targets are not military, they are jihadi training centers.

 

[safriz]

Pakistan's cross-border terrorism has plagued India for years, yet the Pahalgam attack once again highlights India's reactive, ad hoc response. Rather than keeping contingency plans ready to execute swift, surprise retaliation, Modi has convened endless meetings — giving Pakistan ample time to heighten military alertness and prepare countermeasures with newly received Chinese and Turkish weapons, including missiles and drones.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1918562465551438206

After decades of cht flaring up in Kashmir I can't believe IAF had no contingencies to quickly strike back within 24hours? Now all the hype coming from India for over a week has given PAF enough time to prepare putting their fighters on alert status very likely giving PAF the opportunity to intercept incoming IAF aircraft if use for retaliation.

No wonder there's talk about just using missiles.

Missile strikes will work in favor of Pakistan as Pakistan has an extensive inventory, both in types and numbers of missiles.
Much easier retaliation compared to Air strike or ground assault

 

[screambowl]

Our targets are not military, they are jihadi training centers.

All of those centers have elements of Pakistan special forces and also protected by them only.

 

[Shaktimaan]

The meeting today between PM, NSA and Navy chief seems what I suggested has been taken as a basic doctrine. IN will shortly announce Naval Blockade of Pakistan which will force Pak Navy to retaliate. IN will sink complete PN and also take out Karachi and Pasni Ports. At the same time, IN will embark the Amphi Brigade of 54Th div positioned in Hyderabad and sail towards Gwader. Intial strike by IN will establish complete control of sea arnd Pakistan and IAF will mount pressure from the Punjab border to ensure PAF is not able to interfere in the amphi ops of IN. I expect both CBGs to come into play for it. One CBG vl fight Pak navy and PAF in western and southern Pakistan while the other vl support he amphi forces. The Balochistan rebels will work with MARCOS to clear a amphi landing safe area around gwader. Mig-29K of IN and Su-30MKI of IAF vl ensure that Paf is not able to interfere as IAF vl mount pressure on Indian Border with Pakistan which will restrict PAF from diverting its assets to defend Gwader. At the sametime, IA will go for POJK. That is an area whr neither PAF can interfere nor can it stop IAF from full spectrum war domination. Pakistan looses depth as it goes north and the S-400 can take down anything which flies upto Afghan border from Ambala itself. Plus we will use S-400 in ambush mode.

Shani the nyay Dev is in Mean rashi with Rahu and in 11th house of Indian Kundali making and Angarak Yoga. This means that IN will play a major role in this war with Pakistan. In Feb-Mar 1987, I had sailed on INS Sindhudurg for war sailing as part of Operation Brasstacks. I used to sleep on the canisters of 57MM gun ammo as we had removed nearly everything from the ship to make space for ammo. Hyderabad based 54th Div of Indian Army is the largest division of Indian Army with five brigades under it. Being positioned in the center of India, Its amphi brigade can be moved rapidly to either coast of India. Once a foot hold is established by MARCOS and BRAS/BLA, The airborne Div of IA will be para dropped followed by heavy equipment like MBTs being landed by IN to supposrt this force. Pakistan has left Sindh undefended and also Balochistan undefended as they have tried to create a killing ground for Indian IBGs and Indian Strike forces in Sindh thru the use of Tactical nukes within their own territory. But once again, they will be f$$ked taken from behind. As they say about dogs, Came from behind, did the job from behind so dont now how the father looked.

Not needed for Amphi ops as they are always done in non port areas.

Lol Strategic front story teller.

 

[Lolwa]

I am having many conversations on India-Pakistan crisis and hearing that New Delhi in fact doesn’t want to start a broader war because it isn’t well prepared to handle the potential fallout. Rather, India is likely to pursue targeted strikes, to include missile attacks against terrorist facilities, to symbolically demonstrate strength and avoid any major Pakistani retaliation—but this can hardly be guaranteed.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1918457740986568928

I reckon we'll see if India proves the so-called "experts" wrong.

We aren't interested in a war. The Chinese want us to enter in a war since they want to slow down the transfer of American manufacturing from China to India. As I said the terrorist attack was either by the MSS or CIA(globalist/deepstate). Our economy is doing well and investment is growing with the EU and Russia also investing in Indian manufacturing. So China is rattled deepdown.

According to Chinese zodiac this is the year of the snake. And Xi Jinping was born in the year of the Snake so this will most likely be a beneficial year for any Chinese moves. So it is most likely a deception to force us into a war with the Porkpigs and slow down the transfer for american manufacturing from China to India. The Snake thrives in cunning and deception and playing from the shadows. So it's a bait. That's why China is so confident because they don't care if India wins or loses they want to delay the transfer of manufacturing so that China can arm-twist the Yanks in the tarrif war. This is a small move that will decide who wins the tarrif war in 2030.