Brahmos Supersonic Cruise Missile : News, Updates and Discussions

The Biho is apparently out. It's now an atmanirbhar project.
Interesting. So the Russians have managed to scuttle it.

What platform will they use ? Oh God, its going to be the BMP again isn't it ? Which missiles ? DRDO's upcoming MANPADS ? Guns ? Some Soviet/Russian cannon ?

I hope the MoD don't sleep on this.
They have their own SAMs too. The Koreans are in fact offering the K-SAAM for the Kamorta class.
I know that. I don't know if their SAMs have been tested against supersonic sea skimming missiles. Maybe we can provide some help with that.

I just want Delhi to up arm them whichever way possible.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Aditya b7777
Interesting. So the Russians have managed to scuttle it.

What platform will they use ? Oh God, its going to be the BMP again isn't it ? Which missiles ? DRDO's upcoming MANPADS ? Guns ? Some Soviet/Russian cannon ?

I hope the MoD don't sleep on this.

Yeah, quite successfully, and I even agree with them. The Biho is not suitable for 10 years down the line when AESA's going to be important. The Biho 2 otoh...

I'm guessing it's going to the private sector, in the FICV format. So the Biho will have to enter indirectly along with other foreign competitors.

I know that. I don't know if their SAMs have been tested against supersonic sea skimming missiles. Maybe we can provide some help with that.

Supersonic target drones are available.

I just want Delhi to up arm them whichever way possible.

They are way more self-sufficient than you would think. The only thing important I can think of is Astra Mk3, but the Americans will refuse its integration on the F-35, hence denied. The same for anything meant for their air force, if it cannot go on the F-35, it won't go to Korea. Indonesia is a better candidate for this. Our BMD must never be exported, never mind the fact that they need systems that are fully interoperable with the Americans, so even that's a no-go. They have no need to import ships, subs, fighters, helicopters, artillery and armoured vehicles, particularly the ones we can offer. Then they have their own TBMs.

Our LR-LACM is a bit unique, but that's about it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Aditya b7777
Yeah, quite successfully, and I even agree with them. The Biho is not suitable for 10 years down the line when AESA's going to be important. The Biho 2 otoh...

I'm guessing it's going to the private sector, in the FICV format. So the Biho will have to enter indirectly along with other foreign competitors.
I wonder how long will this take.
Supersonic target drones are available.
Yes. The Japanese used supersonic drones from Raytheon for testing their SAMs. Not sure if those drones have TERCOM or Sea skimming modes though.
They are way more self-sufficient than you would think. The only thing important I can think of is Astra Mk3, but the Americans will refuse its integration on the F-35, hence denied. The same for anything meant for their air force, if it cannot go on the F-35, it won't go to Korea. Indonesia is a better candidate for this. Our BMD must never be exported, never mind the fact that they need systems that are fully interoperable with the Americans, so even that's a no-go. They have no need to import ships, subs, fighters, helicopters, artillery and armoured vehicles, particularly the ones we can offer. Then they have their own TBMs.

Our LR-LACM is a bit unique, but that's about it.
Compatibility is always a concern. I am wondering if the supersonic AShM the Koreans just tested are compatible with the VLS on their ships. Even the 290km ranged Brahmos isn't exactly a small missile. Perhaps they can use inclined launchers instead of VLS.

I don't care much for exporting ships, helos etc. Keep supplying technologies that would make the Korean Armed Forces a bigger headache for China. I wouldn't mind if we handed over the SFDR or the LFRJ either.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Chain Smoker
I wonder how long will this take.

The army will release a PSQR, so those with money will start development soon after. Whenever they get ready, a tender will be announced, and then the usual rigmarole.

Yes. The Japanese used supersonic drones from Raytheon for testing their SAMs. Not sure if those drones have TERCOM or Sea skimming modes though.

Drones are capable of sea skimming.

India is also developing a drone called STAR.

Compatibility is always a concern. I am wondering if the supersonic AShM the Koreans just tested are compatible with the VLS on their ships. Even the 290km ranged Brahmos isn't exactly a small missile. Perhaps they can use inclined launchers instead of VLS.

They would have taken care of that.

I don't care much for exporting ships, helos etc. Keep supplying technologies that would make the Korean Armed Forces a bigger headache for China. I wouldn't mind if we handed over the SFDR or the LFRJ either.

The SFDR is actually Russian. And the Koreans have their own LFRJ.

They are making their own stuff, even an AAM.

Anyway, politically, the Koreans have no intention of bothering the Chinese.
 
The army will release a PSQR, so those with money will start development soon after. Whenever they get ready, a tender will be announced, and then the usual rigmarole.



Drones are capable of sea skimming.

India is also developing a drone called STAR.



They would have taken care of that.



The SFDR is actually Russian. And the Koreans have their own LFRJ.

They are making their own stuff, even an AAM.

Anyway, politically, the Koreans have no intention of bothering the Chinese.
No SFDR is not Russian.
 
The army will release a PSQR, so those with money will start development soon after. Whenever they get ready, a tender will be announced, and then the usual rigmarole.
😑
Drones are capable of sea skimming.

India is also developing a drone called STAR.
Ah yes, the LFRJ spin off. If they want they can test their SAMs against their own supersonic AShM like we did.
They would have taken care of that.
So they would have a Brahmos NG before us. Doubtful. But let's see.
The SFDR is actually Russian.
Design consultancy for the ramjet came from Russia. The nozzle less booster was from HEMRL I think. The design work was done by DRDL.

That's about it. No hardware came from Russia.
They are making their own stuff, even an AAM.
Very cool design. That's a AShM though.
Anyway, politically, the Koreans have no intention of bothering the Chinese.
Them and the Japanese. One of the reasons China could push their claims in SCS. They faced no resistance. The Americans under Obama did nothing too.
 
Yeah, quite successfully, and I even agree with them. The Biho is not suitable for 10 years down the line when AESA's going to be important. The Biho 2 otoh...

I'm guessing it's going to the private sector, in the FICV format. So the Biho will have to enter indirectly along with other foreign competitors.



Supersonic target drones are available.



They are way more self-sufficient than you would think. The only thing important I can think of is Astra Mk3, but the Americans will refuse its integration on the F-35, hence denied. The same for anything meant for their air force, if it cannot go on the F-35, it won't go to Korea. Indonesia is a better candidate for this. Our BMD must never be exported, never mind the fact that they need systems that are fully interoperable with the Americans, so even that's a no-go. They have no need to import ships, subs, fighters, helicopters, artillery and armoured vehicles, particularly the ones we can offer. Then they have their own TBMs.

Our LR-LACM is a bit unique, but that's about it.
They are more self sufficient than us. They already have an ATGM superior to the Javelin, MBT,SPH,Cruise Missile,Tactical ballistic missile,IFV's, AIP SSK with both cruise and ballistic missile capabilities. The most heavily armed destroyer presently in service. They are conventionally a much more independent and secure military than us. They are only behind Japan in self sufficiency. There aerospace industry is behind us. On every other conventional metric they are ahead of us by quite a margin.
It's actually us who need SoKo assistance not them. While we have none of the above in mass service or production. They have already exported half of the above stuff to Nato and other first world countries while we can barely win export orders in the third world.They are Israel of the East to not be exxagerating. Plus they are open to share tech with us and we should exploit. Atleast they won't scam and lowball us like the Russians do.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Hydra

I'm actually hoping that the private sector is at a significantly advanced stage.

Ah yes, the LFRJ spin off. If they want they can test their SAMs against their own supersonic AShM like we did.

So they would have a Brahmos NG before us. Doubtful. But let's see.

No, I mean they don't have to make a copy of the Brahmos-1 right from the beginning. There's also nothing saying it has a 300Kg warhead either, it could have a much smaller warhead, similar to Harpoon.

Design consultancy for the ramjet came from Russia. The nozzle less booster was from HEMRL I think. The design work was done by DRDL.

That's about it. No hardware came from Russia.

They are calling it a "joint venture" though. But, okay, it's likely that we started off with Russia, using Russian tech, and are now Indianising everything, including the motor.

@Chain Smoker

Them and the Japanese. One of the reasons China could push their claims in SCS. They faced no resistance. The Americans under Obama did nothing too.

Typical Americans. They do not think beyond their immediate goals. Like today they are regretting having denied technology, even from Russia, to India throughout the 90s.
 
They are more self sufficient than us. They already have an ATGM superior to the Javelin, MBT,SPH,Cruise Missile,Tactical ballistic missile,IFV's, AIP SSK with both cruise and ballistic missile capabilities. The most heavily armed destroyer presently in service. They are conventionally a much more independent and secure military than us. They are only behind Japan in self sufficiency. There aerospace industry is behind us. On every other conventional metric they are ahead of us by quite a margin.
It's actually us who need SoKo assistance not them. While we have none of the above in mass service or production. They have already exported half of the above stuff to Nato and other first world countries while we can barely win export orders in the third world.They are Israel of the East to not be exxagerating. Plus they are open to share tech with us and we should exploit. Atleast they won't scam and lowball us like the Russians do.

Yeah, they are the ones who are ahead in technologies that can be exported. We are naturally ahead when it comes to strategic systems, but cannot be exported. Our focus has sadly been different.
 
Yeah, they are the ones who are ahead in technologies that can be exported. We are naturally ahead when it comes to strategic systems, but cannot be exported. Our focus has sadly been different.
I personally think our lack lead is mainly due to not involving the private industry for conventional weapons r&d. We could literally have a 55 ton tank read within a year if we gave Tata or Kalyani the deal along with JV. They will have better QC as well as better tech unlike involving the DRDO or OFB. DRDO should frankly focus only on development of strategic munitions and crown-jewel tech the rest of the r&d and manufacturing should be given to the private industry. We are going in the right direction for the most part but not fast enough..
 
  • Like
Reactions: AbRaj
So they would have a Brahmos NG before us. Doubtful. But let's see.
Well, yesterday the Koreans showed a supersonic anti-ship missile similar in appearance to the Brahmos/Yakhont (from 1:38 in the linked video) . This, in addition to the Hyunmoo 4-4 SLBM, a long-range bunker-busting ALCM and the Hyunmoo-4 SRBM (with a 2.5-3 ton conventional warhead) (all shown in the linked video below).


Coming to the supersonic missile, as per Korean sources, its dimensions and max. range (500-550km) are similar to the Brahmos NG. And we are yet to test the Brahmos NG. If true, it isn't doubtful anymore; they will (or rather do) have a Brahmos NG before us.
 
Well, yesterday the Koreans showed a supersonic anti-ship missile similar in appearance to the Brahmos/Yakhont (from 1:38 in the linked video) . This, in addition to the Hyunmoo 4-4 SLBM, a long-range bunker-busting ALCM and the Hyunmoo-4 SRBM (with a 2.5-3 ton conventional warhead) (all shown in the linked video below).


Coming to the supersonic missile, as per Korean sources, its dimensions and max. range (500-550km) are similar to the Brahmos NG. And we are yet to test the Brahmos NG. If true, it isn't doubtful anymore; they will (or rather do) have a Brahmos NG before us.

A Brahmos NG before us would mean the Russians have given it to them. It's just a continuation of their relationship with Russia.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Chain Smoker
A Brahmos NG before us would mean the Russians have given it to them. It's just a continuation of their relationship with Russia.
Maybe. But that isn't how their relationship with Russia is and that isn't how the Korean military-industrial complex usually operates. Not to mention, Korean sources first mentioned of the missile's development in around 2014-15. Considering Korea's history of officially confirming a missile's existence years after the project actually begins the timeframe isn't too short for the missile to be developed in Korea with Russian tech transfers ( much like the KM-SAM Cheongung; developed with assistance from Almaz-Antey; adopted in Russia as the S-350 Vityaz).
 
Last edited:
No, I mean they don't have to make a copy of the Brahmos-1 right from the beginning. There's also nothing saying it has a 300Kg warhead either, it could have a much smaller warhead, similar to Harpoon.
Fair point.
Typical Americans. They do not think beyond their immediate goals. Like today they are regretting having denied technology, even from Russia, to India throughout the 90s.
They regretted what ?
Yeah, they are the ones who are ahead in technologies that can be exported. We are naturally ahead when it comes to strategic systems, but cannot be exported. Our focus has sadly been different.
Agreed.
Well, yesterday the Koreans showed a supersonic anti-ship missile similar in appearance to the Brahmos/Yakhont (from 1:38 in the linked video) . This, in addition to the Hyunmoo 4-4 SLBM, a long-range bunker-busting ALCM and the Hyunmoo-4 SRBM (with a 2.5-3 ton conventional warhead) (all shown in the linked video below).


Coming to the supersonic missile, as per Korean sources, its dimensions and max. range (500-550km) are similar to the Brahmos NG. And we are yet to test the Brahmos NG. If true, it isn't doubtful anymore; they will (or rather do) have a Brahmos NG before us.
Very interesting. @randomradio remember what I said about our relation with Russia. Maybe a knock on effect ?
Maybe. But that isn't how their relationship with Russia is and that isn't how the Korean military-industrial complex usually operates. Not to mention, Korean sources first mentioned of the missile's development in around 2014-15. Considering Korea's history of officially confirming a missile's existence years after the project actually begins the timeframe isn't too short for the missile to be developed in Korea with Korean components but Russian tech transfers (like the KM-SAM Cheongung II).
If I recall correctly Korea also purchased some cryogenic engines from Russia for space launch applications. It does seem likely that they received tech from Russia.

But why consult us ? They did have a contract with us, why would they need that ?
 
Maybe. But that isn't how their relationship with Russia is and that isn't how the Korean military-industrial complex usually operates. Not to mention, Korean sources first mentioned of the missile's development in around 2014-15. Considering Korea's history of officially confirming a missile's existence years after the project actually begins the timeframe isn't too short for the missile to be developed in Korea with Korean components but Russian tech transfers (like the KM-SAM Cheongung II).

The Russian equivalent of Brahmos-NG would have finished a long time ago, it's like how we haven't even started the construction of the first prototype of Brahmos-2, but the Zircon is pretty much in the induction stage.

The KM-SAM, L-SAM and now the P-800 family would make sense. Anyway, the Koreans received a lot of Russian tech after the Cold War under Operation Siberian Brown Bear, which mainly involved the transfer of BM technologies to Korea in lieu of paying off Korean loans. So everything happening today has continued from there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Chain Smoker
If I recall correctly Korea also purchased some cryogenic engines from Russia for space launch applications.
Yes, it was for the KSLV-1 Naro.
It does seem likely that they received tech from Russia.
Again, yes. The technology was used for developing the KSLV-2 Nuri, which is scheduled for its maiden launch next month.

But why consult us ? They did have a contract with us, why would they need that ?
Who knows? They did take the help of the Israelis to test their indigenous AESA radar for the KF-21 Boramae, so they might have had a similar arrangement with us for testing purposes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Gautam
They regretted what ?

Now the Americans want us to "quickly" develop capabilities that can challenge China, after spending the better half of a century denying those same technologies, even from countries willing to transfer tech, like the cryogenic engines from Russia.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Gautam
So everything happening today has continued from there.
While true to some extent, the L-SAM clearly differs from the S-400. So maybe, the Koreans got tech transfers for the KM-SAM Cheongung, upgraded it to Cheongung 2 themselves, and are now manufacturing the L-SAM entirely indigenously (this particular pattern is present in every single Korean weapons programme).
 
Last edited: